Russia says space station leak could be deliberate sabotage

originally posted by: 14377
a reply to: BigDave-AR


Those rub marks would've had to come from a drill with a plastic chuck IMO.



That's why I chose that avatar it does convey a message .

Was that a budge I got out of ya?!?! lol
It could have been plastic like your chuck or finely checkered metal like on my workhorse drill, I know that one from expierence lol.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

I budged more than that in this thread . lol

I still think it's plastic,I think metal would've rubbed the paint down more.


It also looks like a odd angle to me. What do you think?

originally posted by: 14377
a reply to: BigDave-AR

I budged more than that in this thread . lol

I still think it's plastic, metal would've rubbed down farther IMO.


It also looks like a odd angle to me. What do you think?

The angle to the dangle looks like it could be workable for bracing the drill chuck against in advertently which would help the walking of a bit in more or less parallel lines as the chuck would want to be pulled along by the friction thus making life harder on whatever “craftsman” decided the capsule needed an extra “speed hole”.
I was just ribbing you I feel like we’ve got some comradery going on from bashing our thick skulls together lol.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

Cheers


I think you and I could debate this for months. Lol

I'm gonna pull back and wait for some more data .

Take care

Wow ,,





from what I see Drill burs , Defiantly a Drill , and Drill skips ,
( you would think.... Professionally if they were dam Words they would be Symmetrical aligned Wording aka EVEN!!!
WOW people ..

but from my point of view it looks as if someone was trying too place a Blockage
or a Plug at the BIG Round HOLE!

for what ever Purpose it Had ..

there is 3 Small indentations like a Start of a Drill bit . above the Large Round Opening aka HOLE

as if tempting too USE a different method all together .

and wasn't successful and just Sealed it .


Now the Sabotage ????

if it was Sealed and a Astronaut Discovered it and removed the Seal .
some that sabotaged it would just leave it exposed right ?


I am assuming it was not Intentional , and not deliberately too sabotage.

My Conclusion I was a Human Error ,
Somebody had messed up either on the Ground or on the Station .

I still say someone was trying too Seal that large Hole or placing a Plug
in it , and drilled a hole for a chain or rope ( anchoring it )
attached to it so it would not get lost aka float away


more likely with something like this ??


Question what is that Big Round " circular" Hole for ?? Anyways ??

originally posted by: 14377
A micrometer year can be a piece of space junk. Anything from a ball bearing up to a screw . A small ball bearing traveling at 22,000 mph has quite a bit of penetrating power.

I know that, but from what I have read the way they behave is the same, regardless of the material they are made of, the size and the speed are what gives them that behaviour, the behaviour that resulted in the creation of the micrometeor shields as they are now, and they are very effective for those small sizes.

A progress we supply ship I have learned is not pressurized. But it is pressurized when it hooks up with the ISS . I would also like someone to explain the minor depressurization that occurred.

Why are you talking about Progress? It was on one of the two Soyuz ships docked to the ISS, Soyuz MS-09. The hole is near the waste water container of the Soyuz Orbital Module.

Here's an image I found on another forum, showing the approximate location of the hole.



Source

Here's an article I just found that is two days old and cites a American astronaut. Notice it says exterior .

I saw that several days ago, and that's why I asked for astronauts aboard the ISS, although that astronaut has flown in other missions he is not there now, his last mission was in 2016.

I've got two questions that I can't find the answers for.

How thick is the hull and why did it calls depressurization ?

The hull of what, Soyuz? Apparently, 1.9 mm, besides the micrometeorite protection.

I found the above information here, and that document includes the following image, representing the wall of the Soyuz orbital module.

a reply to: Wolfenz

That big hole was drilled from the inside out.

That is a steel sheet metal.

It makes no sense what so ever cause like you said wtf is that big hole? Like armap has just posted the specs show the ship to be made of several layers and none of them steel yet i am sure that pic we see is steel cause aluminum does not leave the sharp edges protruding out in the direction of the drill path. Aluminum drilling leaves a mainly clean hole and aluminum sheet metal would not be a wise choice for a bulk head on a ship at the thickness we see here. The reason is because the properties of aluminum can either be soft and malleable or hard and brittle neither would stand up to simple everyday use and not have a great danger of puncture.

originally posted by: howtonhawky
a reply to: Wolfenz

That big hole was drilled from the inside out.

That is a steel sheet metal.

It makes no sense what so ever cause like you said wtf is that big hole? Like armap has just posted the specs show the ship to be made of several layers and none of them steel yet i am sure that pic we see is steel cause aluminum does not leave the sharp edges protruding out in the direction of the drill path. Aluminum drilling leaves a mainly clean hole and aluminum sheet metal would not be a wise choice for a bulk head on a ship at the thickness we see here. The reason is because the properties of aluminum can either be soft and malleable or hard and brittle neither would stand up to simple everyday use and not have a great danger of puncture.

It’s not steel man and it’s not sheet stock get over it the diagram is above.

a reply to: ArMaP

I concede , it's a hole drilled from the inside .

originally posted by: howtonhawky
That big hole was drilled from the inside out.

The bigger hole is there for a purpose, the problem was the small hole.

It makes no sense what so ever cause like you said wtf is that big hole?

Those big holes (they are more than one, we can see that on the full photo) are supposed to be there.

Like armap has just posted the specs show the ship to be made of several layers and none of them steel yet i am sure that pic we see is steel cause aluminum does not leave the sharp edges protruding out in the direction of the drill path. Aluminum drilling leaves a mainly clean hole and aluminum sheet metal would not be a wise choice for a bulk head on a ship at the thickness we see here. The reason is because the properties of aluminum can either be soft and malleable or hard and brittle neither would stand up to simple everyday use and not have a great danger of puncture.

It's an aluminium alloy with magnesium, it's not common aluminium.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

I have read the diagram. Supposedly mg6 alloy.

I do not buy it.

What we see in the pic is evidence of steel being drilled.

Look at the big hole and how it is flared out.

I have never seen aluminum do that.

The pic does not look right.

I do not buy that they would use 1/16 aluminum to hold pressure in the first place since it can be punctured so easily. I can imagine that if they do then there is no telling how long the other 60 layers of material was acting as pressure layers. Maybe that would explain why it took so long to fail since there was no patch there.

originally posted by: howtonhawky
a reply to: BigDave-AR

I have read the diagram. Supposedly mg6 alloy.

I do not buy it.

What we see in the pic is evidence of steel being drilled.

Look at the big hole and how it is flared out.

I have never seen aluminum do that.

The pic does not look right.

I do not buy that they would use 1/16 aluminum to hold pressure in the first place since it can be punctured so easily. I can imagine that if they do then there is no telling how long the other 60 layers of material was acting as pressure layers. Maybe that would explain why it took so long to fail since there was no patch there.

I suppose your a matelurigical expert?

ETA looking at the location of the strike it might not be able to be deorbited I’m pretty sure that mission package has to be ejected from the capsule before the reentry burn. They need to park that module on another airlock to preserve that module until it can be deorbited so we can get to the bottom of the mechanics of what went on.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

You can see where they rested the drill against the uni strut looking part. Thats probably how the skip is not curved. The third try was successful with minor skip. It seems pretty obvious to me. Very shoddy workmanship or hastily done sabotage.

originally posted by: Starhooker
a reply to: BigDave-AR

You can see where they rested the drill against the uni strut looking part. Thats probably how the skip is not curved. The third try was successful with minor skip. It seems pretty obvious to me. Very shoddy workmanship or hastily done sabotage.

I concur that was my point, I lean towards the shoddy workmanship over the sabotage personally that was just typical Russian bluster at first before they backed down to it being a manufacturing error, looks like an apprentice went at it with a dull beaver lol. You’d think someone working on something so critical might make damn sure of where they’re drilling and be smart enough to use a center punch to give the bit the best chance of biting into the material without wanting to walk and wouldn’t have their chuck up against the the angled reinforcement.

ETA-

originally posted by: 14377
a reply to: ArMaP

I concede , it's a hole drilled from the inside .

Ah it’s okay buddy we win some and we lose some, but you’re a fighter and I respect that. Shoot me your PayPal info if you have one I’ll buy ya a beer!!!
Only thing better than a friend is a good worthy rival!

a reply to: BigDave-AR

Also, the hole is drilled at an angle if anyone hasn't noticed.

Edit: I could be wrong

originally posted by: Starhooker
a reply to: BigDave-AR

Also, the hole is drilled at an angle if anyone hasn't noticed.

Edit: I could be wrong

No it doesn’t look particularly squared up.

originally posted by: howtonhawky
a reply to: Wolfenz

That big hole was drilled from the inside out.

That is a steel sheet metal.

It makes no sense what so ever cause like you said wtf is that big hole? Like armap has just posted the specs show the ship to be made of several layers and none of them steel yet i am sure that pic we see is steel cause aluminum does not leave the sharp edges protruding out in the direction of the drill path. Aluminum drilling leaves a mainly clean hole and aluminum sheet metal would not be a wise choice for a bulk head on a ship at the thickness we see here. The reason is because the properties of aluminum can either be soft and malleable or hard and brittle neither would stand up to simple everyday use and not have a great danger of puncture.

clearly we are talking about two different things ,

Drilled from the inside out ?

ever use a drill ? those shavings a.k.a.s Burs tells the tale ..

yeah Big HOLE not talking about the Drill hole ! although I think that they drilled the hole too place an anchor for a rope or chain attached too a Seal plug ...

here is a pic again what is that hole use for besides the drill hole ..
so you call that Drill hole a big hole ?

Sorry i am not a #ing Micky Spillane that won a prize for grammar..

yeah i know I am a certified welder and fabricator..





Again, i do not know the whole story here ..

a reply to: Wolfenz

The big hole is supposed to be there as there are more. Definitely not a micro meteorite. Question is, sabotage or shoddy workmanship? It's like someone was working in haste with little skill. Interesting to say the least.

originally posted by: Starhooker
a reply to: Wolfenz

The big hole is supposed to be there as there are more. Definitely not a micro meteorite. Question is, sabotage or shoddy workmanship? It's like someone was working in haste with little skill. Interesting to say the least.

I looked back on Previous posts at the same time you had posted this ..

I am getting the whole picture now .. it was not what i was thinking

those holes more less for holding something in at the bulk head I assume
using ropes straps etc ?

Now i see the big fuss as what Purpose the drill marks and hole.
as the Thermal Sheet covering was covering the damage Originally and the Thermal sheet cover
is now folded over , too view the Drill hole damage .. Interesting ..
I say Drill hole as I see Bur shavings and I can see with in the Drill hole circular grove marks
which tells me someone was or had placed a Screw there !

which could be too fasten the Thermal sheet cover ??

just a easy Guess


The more famous, showing the hole.


Repairing it.


After the repair.

a reply to: Wolfenz

The big holes are probably for cutting weight and could double for tie offs of needed. But why so sloppy? One would think that anyone working on it would be very skilled and know how to drill a dang hole. It's fishy. Like someone made a quick last minute effort to sabotage it. But if that's the case, why such a small hole? It's a mystery