Oath to "Global Society" vs. Pledge of Allegiance

a reply to: Asktheanimals

That's what rednecks do... we scare the mundanes.

I don't think those who are so dead-set against anything American understand that the Pledge is not to our government... it is to us, to each other. Our system of governance is government of the people, by the people, for the people. Just because that has been corrupted, it does not change what we pledge our allegiance to.

What scares me is that our children are being taught by those who cannot apparently understand the very concepts they are attempting to teach. Nothing could clarify this more than a misguided attempt to remove the Pledge of Allegiance. One might as well hire a flock of chickens to teach quantum mechanics.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: TerryMcGuire

What about their personal responsibility?

At every level of that oath, they are being subsumed to a group. It is at all levels collectivist.

Did I not say that? I said

First, I am not in favor or oaths or pledges being made in schools by children not old enough to have made their own decisions. This goes for the pledge of allegiance to any flag.

Do you not see that the same process is at work with children who are forced to make the pledge of allegiance?
Do you not see that there is the very same subsumption in that process?

a reply to: TheRedneck

Glad I don't have children in school these days.
My area is so conservative they even have prayers at school functions.
And Nobody complains!
If I lived in a liberal area I'd likely be in jail for disrupting school board meetings.

a reply to: Annee

Then you are against education, because that's what education is: the correction of incorrect thinking. Just because a child thinks 2+2=5, it does not make it so. They must be taught that 2+2=4 if they are ever going to be able to do math.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Yeah that's not creepy at all is it ?

This will be as confusing as the problem facing dual citizens--allegiance to country A or to country B?

originally posted by: Annee
Beware of "It's always been done that way".

I like the idea of the kids writing their own pledge in class.

One that actually reflects their own thinking.

I'm against forced indoctrination of kids.

I can see your points but nearly everything we teach to children could be called indoctrination. Their minds are not developed enough to do much real "thinking". (real thinking requires holding multiple points of view and letting them battle it out in your head) As they grow older and smarter they can then challenge what they've been taught for themselves. That's the beauty of liberty and free speech that allows us to question anything we wish. Until children reach that age parents have the responsibility to pass on their values, morals and ethics.

My parents indoctrinated me in church, as a teen I rejected it, as a 50-something I came back around to it. Without some measure of indoctrination kids have too many things to question at once. They need some solid ground they can rely on, both socially and mentally. Depends on what your definition of indoctrination is I suppose.

As for letting them write their own pledge:
I plej allejens to my PS 2 and Call of Duty Clan.
I hate bedtime because that's when my Japaneze frens get on.
I want to join their clan cuz their ranked higher.
School sux, movies and skateboards are awesome.
Need more marvel movies becuz deadpool and GOTG rox!

a reply to: Asktheanimals

All schools are becoming liberal. I've watched it with my own eyes in the middle of nowhere in Alabama. School is no longer about education, it is about day-care and indoctrination into the concepts that the indoctrinators want the kids indoctrinated into. Anything other than the 'approved' indoctrination is called indoctrination and attacked.

I'm a little surprised I'm not still in jail from when my kids were in school.

TheRedneck

While I don’t think we should be forced to say any kind of pledge in school, the idea of a sick Globalist pledge makes my skin crawl. Pledging allegiance to the NWO sounds about as appealing as a jab in the eye with a sharp stick.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

I'm 72.

Still remember forced gender roles.

Mom was disabled from polio. 30 years before the Disability Act. We got kicked out of businesses because it upset other customers. My discrimination experience.

I was raised as a free thinker, in a kind of metaphysical environment--before there was a word for it.

Although difficult for a kid to make their own rules -- I'll take it over forced indoctrination.

It was a white Christian neighborhood with forced Christian prayer in public school. Jews kept their mouths shut (really sad).

I tried to accept the benevolent part of Christianity, but religion is too hypocritical. There is nothing real about the Christ story.

I raised 2 kids, and helped raise 3 grandchildren. My granddaughter just started college at Sonoma State. Has worked steady since age 16.

I will be forever thankful my parents left Ohio, never to return. And that I was raised a freethinker along the Southern California beaches.

Loved the Hippie/flower child years. Although, with 2 babies -- I observed -- did not indulge. A choice.

Society needs to evolve.

Man needs to evolve.

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: Asktheanimals


I will be forever thankful my parents left Ohio, never to return. And that I was raised a freethinker along the Southern California beaches.

Loved the Hippie/flower child years. Although, with 2 babies -- I observed -- did not indulge. A choice.

Society needs to evolve.

Man needs to evolve.

i kind of envy it.
i got dragged to ohio as a teen. still here

uuuggggh

southern california sounds good to me

a reply to: Annee

You know the saddest part of that post? In many ways you are right about things that need to change. Forced prayer? NO! Allowed prayer... yes. Discrimination? No. Blanket acceptance of anything, anywhere, any time? No!

The society you advocate would have atrocities much greater than those you rightfully rail against. It is possible to fix the bad without destroying the good. We can teach children about the world they live in, and still allow them to reason for themselves as they grow... it does not have to be total immersion into an alternate indoctrination as the policy we are discussing tries to implement.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: Asktheanimals


I will be forever thankful my parents left Ohio, never to return. And that I was raised a freethinker along the Southern California beaches.

Loved the Hippie/flower child years. Although, with 2 babies -- I observed -- did not indulge. A choice.

Society needs to evolve.

Man needs to evolve.

i kind of envy it.
i got dragged to ohio as a teen. still here

uuuggggh

southern california sounds good to me

I personally love the progressive feeling and attitude of liberal CA (CA is really about half & half Liberal/Conservative).

"Minds -- thinking and changing the world".

Of course there will be UPS & DOWNS. Successes and Failures --- still better then stagnation.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Annee

You know the saddest part of that post? In many ways you are right about things that need to change. Forced prayer? NO! Allowed prayer... yes. Discrimination? No. Blanket acceptance of anything, anywhere, any time? No!

The society you advocate would have atrocities much greater than those you rightfully rail against. It is possible to fix the bad without destroying the good. We can teach children about the world they live in, and still allow them to reason for themselves as they grow... it does not have to be total immersion into an alternate indoctrination as the policy we are discussing tries to implement.

TheRedneck

100% separation of church and state.

Pray on your own time.

STUCK in a world of time past -- is not for me.

a reply to: Annee

Thanks for sharing on a personal level.
Life experiences can be drastically different depending on where one is raised.
Virginia vs California - yeah, I could see some huge divergence there.
I'm all for free thought and free expression, I taught art at elementary schools.
I made them do abstract art while listening to classical music then speed metal.
Lying to children is among the worst things we can do and indoctrination is often that.
The big question is how much choice do we allow children.
We all need some discipline and kids without some will suffer for it.
I think we agree more than we don't actually.

Thank god justice prevailed and they reversed course.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
To the Republic for which it stands (the flag).
There is nothing wrong with pledging allegiance to our system of governance.
Our flag is simply the symbol for it.
It is truly the bottom line of our society and the basis for our system of laws.
Nationalism is not a dirty word, we share a bond, a country and a collective future.
Better that we work together instead of being fragmented and squabbling over everything.

Whoa, #TRUTH.

a reply to: Annee

STUCK in a world of time past -- is not for me.

Oh, you're not stuck Annee... you're racing back to those times.

TheRedneck

School comes before Family?

originally posted by: Annee

STUCK in a world of time past -- is not for me.

But just last week we had an entire thread topic on this very concept, where you screamed up and down that you are indeed stuck in the past.