BUDDHIST HELL in Sri Lanka: Demons and Devils: Dickwella Temple (Wewurukannala Vihara)

Whatever, peacefulpete. You're just classic trolling now, looking for somebody to entertain a senseless argument. This putting words and concepts in peoples' mouths is so very lame, textbook trolling. I happen to know what Buddha taught, the rest of what you think is Buddhism? I couldn't care less. You asked a question, I answered, been there, done that, go find a Buddhist to troll, though he'd probably be done with you in short order, also.

originally posted by: Scrutinizing
Whatever, peacefulpete. You're just classic trolling now, looking for somebody to entertain a senseless argument. This putting words and concepts in peoples' mouths is so very lame, textbook trolling. I happen to know what Buddha taught, the rest of what you think is Buddhism? I couldn't care less. You asked a question, I answered, been there, done that, go find a Buddhist to troll, though he'd probably be done with you in short order, also.

Well now YOU'RE obviously trolling this thread.

Which is disappointing because I thought you might have been genuinely interested in discussing Buddhism.

Anyway, facts are facts. Buddhism does not have any centralized structure or coordination among all the different temples around the world.

It's quite different from Catholicism in its structure.

Buddhism doesn't even have one centralized book, like the Bible. Buddhism has at best maybe 3 centralized books and most people probably don't even read those specific 3 books.

So yeah the structure of the two religions couldn't really be more different.

originally posted by: The GUT
Wanna see the Dalai Lama consult with entities? Pretty amazing scenes and "transformations" of the oracles in this film.

Cloaked in secrecy for over 400 years, the State Oracle of Tibet has been a strange and mystical aspect of the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. This ancient spirit, which has inhabited a succession of thirteen human mediums, advises the Dalai Lama on matters of public and religious policy. To witness the eerie spectacle of a medium entering a trance state and being possessed by the Oracle is to confront profound questions about the very nature of human consciousness.

With permission from the Dalai Lama that had never been granted before, The Oracle explores the ancient practice of consulting spirits.

The Dalai Lama is interviewed about the subject at length and not only speaks about the trance state of possession, but is actually filmed consulting the channeled entities himself.

I don't use the word "possession" lightly or as my own opinion, but, rather, use the trance channelling monks own words.

This film should also be of interest to those intrigued by the sound/vibration aspects of the Tibetan "Adepts".

In one scene the monk/oracle is surrounded by trumpets and sound. In explanation of what he experiences, the oracle states that the "possession" is preceded by vibrations that start in the feet and then a floating feeling and suddenly the trance state.

The Dalai Lama also makes the intriguing comment that some of these spirits are religious and some are not. I'm not sure because of his accent, but he seems to say that more of the spirits are Muslims and Christians than Buddhist or Hindu!

It will also be noted, that these channelled "Spirits" can be as devastatingly deceptive as all channelled entities seem to be.

At one point, two of the possessed monks seem to fiercely and violently engage each other. It's explained, however, that one of them is actually paying homage to the other!?

And did I mention the ritual murder?

Beautifully shot & nicely narrated, but in some cases, somewhat disturbing, you'll probably find the film extremely fascinating.

I've only watched some of the vid you posted but I can say that Tibetan Buddhism (which is what that is, and what the Dalai Llama is part of) is not only pure Buddhism. Historically it was also mixed with the indigenous culture of Tibet, which seems to be where it got its wildest traditions and decorations and rituals.

The indigenous culture was probably roughly similar to the indigenous culture of Native Americans.

Anyhow that's always a good thing to keep in mind when considering Tibetan Buddhism including the Dali Llama. They represent more traditions, beliefs etc. than those found in more basic versions of Buddhism.

The Zen tradition of Buddhism (from Japan and originating from China) is known for minimalistic forms of rituals and aesthetics. And it is not mixed with the same indigenous culture that is part of Tibetan Buddhism.

I'm not criticizing anything, I just find history of it as very interesting.

Zen is minimalistic in its tradition and emphasizes silent meditation. It's supposed to represent the essence of Buddhism.

a reply to: Raggedyman

Do you ever wonder what level of representation Buddhists have theocratically?

originally posted by: peacefulpete

originally posted by: The GUT
Wanna see the Dalai Lama consult with entities? Pretty amazing scenes and "transformations" of the oracles in this film.

Cloaked in secrecy for over 400 years, the State Oracle of Tibet has been a strange and mystical aspect of the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. This ancient spirit, which has inhabited a succession of thirteen human mediums, advises the Dalai Lama on matters of public and religious policy. To witness the eerie spectacle of a medium entering a trance state and being possessed by the Oracle is to confront profound questions about the very nature of human consciousness.

With permission from the Dalai Lama that had never been granted before, The Oracle explores the ancient practice of consulting spirits.

The Dalai Lama is interviewed about the subject at length and not only speaks about the trance state of possession, but is actually filmed consulting the channeled entities himself.

I don't use the word "possession" lightly or as my own opinion, but, rather, use the trance channelling monks own words.

This film should also be of interest to those intrigued by the sound/vibration aspects of the Tibetan "Adepts".

In one scene the monk/oracle is surrounded by trumpets and sound. In explanation of what he experiences, the oracle states that the "possession" is preceded by vibrations that start in the feet and then a floating feeling and suddenly the trance state.

The Dalai Lama also makes the intriguing comment that some of these spirits are religious and some are not. I'm not sure because of his accent, but he seems to say that more of the spirits are Muslims and Christians than Buddhist or Hindu!

It will also be noted, that these channelled "Spirits" can be as devastatingly deceptive as all channelled entities seem to be.

At one point, two of the possessed monks seem to fiercely and violently engage each other. It's explained, however, that one of them is actually paying homage to the other!?

And did I mention the ritual murder?

Beautifully shot & nicely narrated, but in some cases, somewhat disturbing, you'll probably find the film extremely fascinating.

I've only watched some of the vid you posted but I can say that Tibetan Buddhism (which is what that is, and what the Dalai Llama is part of) is not only pure Buddhism. Historically it was also mixed with the indigenous culture of Tibet, which seems to be where it got its wildest traditions and decorations and rituals.

The indigenous culture was probably roughly similar to the indigenous culture of Native Americans.

Anyhow that's always a good thing to keep in mind when considering Tibetan Buddhism including the Dali Llama. They represent more traditions, beliefs etc. than those found in more basic versions of Buddhism.

The Zen tradition of Buddhism (from Japan and originating from China) is known for minimalistic forms of rituals and aesthetics. And it is not mixed with the same indigenous culture that is part of Tibetan Buddhism.

I'm not criticizing anything, I just find history of it as very interesting.

Zen is minimalistic in its tradition and emphasizes silent meditation. It's supposed to represent the essence of Buddhism.


what about pimpin?

Buddhism does have and share some of the old sky gods and demons which is akin to Christianity, but more so Hinduism since it came from the Chinese/Indian border. They were superstitious, and were scared of angels and dogs too, but what the video showing seems more Indian themed. The skinny Buddha said not to be the original, where the fat version is.

The statue of him lying down or sleep looks similar to depiction of Vishnu.

Although Buddha being the idea of a god isn't really accepted, actions might as well be speaking louder then words. It is wide spread in the east, albeit, like nothing ever happened, as compared to the west.

Now a days zen meditation is like watching paint dry, instead of worrying about where one butt is going to go.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: Raggedyman

Wouldn’t it be funny if your strict adherence to Christian beliefs landed you in Buddhist hell?

Wouldn't it be even funnier if yout strict adherence to yout fundamentalist atheism landed you in a Buddhist hell

originally posted by: Specimen
Buddhism does have and share some of the old sky gods and demons which is akin to Christianity, but more so Hinduism since it came from the Chinese/Indian border. They were superstitious, and were scared of angels and dogs too, but what the video showing seems more Indian themed. The skinny Buddha said not to be the original, where the fat version is.

The statue of him lying down or sleep looks similar to depiction of Vishnu.

Although Buddha being the idea of a god isn't really accepted, actions might as well be speaking louder then words. It is wide spread in the east, albeit, like nothing ever happened, as compared to the west.

Now a days zen meditation is like watching paint dry, instead of worrying about where one butt is going to go.

Not sure I understand everything you said or meant but:

Skinny Buddha is historical... He was starving himself prior to his enlightenment.

The fat Buddha is more of a good-luck folk character, kinda like Santa Claus or something like that.

The statue of Buddha laying down probably shows him dying. It's regarded that his death is when he attained perfect freedom. I don't know much about Vishnu but I wouldn't have thought there was any connection.

Zen can be boring if you consider solitary meditation as boring. Also it's the gateway to freedom.

originally posted by: i77oomiknotti
a reply to: Raggedyman

Do you ever wonder what level of representation Buddhists have theocratically?

It all would depend on the place and the situation, right?

American and Western Buddhist temples are likely to be boring meditation-clubs, basically.

Tibetan Buddhism does its own thing, on its own, mixed with indigenous culture of Tibet.

I would like to learn more about daily life of monks in Japan and China, India etc. I don't know how exactly things work in such countries re: the monks and monasteries.

a reply to: Raggedyman

I would save you a seat, and I would still have a better sense of humor.

a reply to: Woodcarver

I think sitting next to you and listening to you carry on for eternity would be one of the lowest and most cruelest levels of hell
I have never seen any humor from you woodie, never

a reply to: i77oomiknotti

No it's not something I have ever considered
Do you have any information

I know there has been a few wars fought by Buddhists so there is Buddhist theocracy

I also know many Tibetans felt relieved when China invaded, set free from their oppressive lives as peasants and the Dali Lama

www.theguardian.com...

But don't let the truth cloud hate for China

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: i77oomiknotti

No it's not something I have ever considered
Do you have any information

I know there has been a few wars fought by Buddhists so there is Buddhist theocracy

I also know many Tibetans felt relieved when China invaded, set free from their oppressive lives as peasants and the Dali Lama

www.theguardian.com...

But don't let the truth cloud hate for China

Wrong, there have not been "Buddhist wars." Please give a link or details to whatever you're thinking of.

And no, Tibetans did not feel relieved when China invaded. Tibet was separate from China for probably thousands of years before China invaded with modern technology, destroyed their monasteries, imprisoned and tortured the monks.

What the hell with saying things that are blatantly opposite what really happened.

Your link also does not support the things you said. Your link is pointing out imperfect aspects of Tibetan culture and then implying that China invading, murdering, raping, torturing them was a good thing. It wasn't, and it's not a good thing.

I heard one time that out of Tibet's rich ancient history, of thousands of temples, China has destroyed thousands and left only FIVE temples still standing.

There are presumably Tibetan monks in prison being tortured even as we type, and even as you lie about it possibly being right for China to invade and destroy Tibet and its people and culture.

Also what are you even doing besides trolling against Buddhism?

I didn't make the thread to promote Buddhism...

The link got me to look more into Tibet's history of supposed violence etc.

The long and short of it is that China has a political motivation in making Tibet's history sound terrible, and to say the least, China's and Tibet's views are very different re: Tibet's history.


"The question of Tibet's social history is therefore highly politicized, and Chinese claims in this respect are intrinsic to the functioning of the PRC, and not some free act of intellectual exploration. They have accordingly to be treated with caution. From a human rights point of view, the question of whether Tibet was feudal in the past is irrelevant. A more immediate question is why the PRC does not allow open discussion of whether Tibet was feudal or oppressive. Writers and researchers in Tibet face serious repercussions if they do not concur with official positions on issues such as social conditions in Tibet prior to its "liberation," and in such a restrictive climate, the regime's claims on this issue have little credibility."

en.wikipedia.org...

^Check out that Wiki page about the controversies over Tibet's history.

a reply to: peacefulpete

Did you read the link I posted, research Tibet and life before Chinese invasion

www.worldfuturefund.org...

Try that link for an education

As for trolling, I was asked about Buddhist theocracy, not something I am knowledgeable about
I am familiar with the fact that many serfs in Tibet were happy the Dali Lama was kicked out of power
Also violence is endemic, religion or no religion

Your reaction to my facts indicate
A ,you are incredibly ignorant
B ,you may not be promoting Buddhism but don't want the truth told about Buddhists failings

a reply to: peacefulpete

Check out medicine and education, gdp in Tibet pre China
Then post China
I am not saying the Chinese were good or better, but don't kid yourself, Tibet was not an altruistic paradise

a reply to: Scrutinizing

Whatever, peacefulpete. You're just classic trolling now, looking for somebody to entertain a senseless argument.

Its their main purpose for being here,

This putting words and concepts in peoples' mouths is so very lame, textbook trolling.

and just happens way too often, very few posts are honest posts always twisting whats said.

I happen to know what Buddha taught, the rest of what you think is Buddhism? I couldn't care less.

I agree with how you described how modern Buddhism has changed and very much agree with your analogy how its similar to what the Catholic Church has done with Christianity.


Either the OP completely fails to grasp what you are saying or really is what they call about at least 5 posters in each of their threads.

You asked a question, I answered,

what really shows their dishonesty and what is considered trolling is that you answered before they asked.


You posted your views on Buddha's teachings and how many things have become attached over the years and then after you posted that they asked the question to which you already answered.

Its absolute insanity to try and have a normal discussion with OP, it seems if you have anything that is bordering to being critical or slightly differing views you are a troll.

I am a fan of most of the teachings of Buddhism as I think they promote positive ideals like showing loving-kindness, compassion and patience to others while abstaining from aggression, anger and violence.

However, it's still a shame to see that even non-theistic religions like Buddhism still use appeals to fear to encourage obedience from adherents instead of encouraging positive actions and leaving it at that.

Apparently human existence isn't quite suffering enough and the hell realms await those with really bad karma.

Escape the never-ending cycle of rebirth to reach enlightenment while accumulating good karma along the way. Easier said than done...

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: peacefulpete

Did you read the link I posted, research Tibet and life before Chinese invasion

www.worldfuturefund.org...

Try that link for an education

As for trolling, I was asked about Buddhist theocracy, not something I am knowledgeable about
I am familiar with the fact that many serfs in Tibet were happy the Dali Lama was kicked out of power
Also violence is endemic, religion or no religion

Your reaction to my facts indicate
A ,you are incredibly ignorant
B ,you may not be promoting Buddhism but don't want the truth told about Buddhists failings

Yes I read your link. Then I read more about the history of violence in Tibet and I found that Wiki entry explaining that Tibet's history is politically motivated for the Chinese to make their history look as terrible as possible.

Factually, no, Tibet was not happy (and is not happy) about China invading them, arresting them, torturing them, killing them, raping them, destroying their temples and culture.

Those are the real-life facts of what you're talking about.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: peacefulpete

Check out medicine and education, gdp in Tibet pre China
Then post China
I am not saying the Chinese were good or better, but don't kid yourself, Tibet was not an altruistic paradise

Pre-China, Tibet was an isolated and simple culture.

Yeah of course medicine and education etc. It's the same for any other isolated country lacking resources.

What you're trying to do is morph it into a criticism on Buddhism and it's not. Buddhism is bigger than Tibet and Buddhism is bigger than Tibetan Buddhism.