After watching The Stan Romeneck Story, are there any un-debunkable abduction cases?

I was scrolling through Netflix documentaries when I saw Extraordinary: The Stan Romeneck Story... It was a great thrill and has some compelling moments and then some very questionable moments. I think it was about 20 minutes into the movie where I saw a flashlight being shined from a rooftop to pass as a UFO and I said to myself "wait a minute..." and started my google search while watching the movie.

Court conviction information came up and spoiled the end of the movie, but that isn't what this thread is about. As I searched and watched the film I also saw the "peeping Tom" clip and remembered seeing it a few years back here on ATS. While the story has some elements that haven't been dubunked as far as I can tell, his ACL injury and recovery, injuries from "abductions" all over his body, the telephone calls... And he does have a lot of witness testimony to certain event, albeit they are all UFO researchers so, yeah that isn't solid enough credibility for me. It seems like all UFO researchers will cling to a case or story to make what they've done with their time seem legitimate. Finally I came upon an interview he did on a web cast where he blatantly tried to hoax a paranormal moment of objects being thrown. You can see his failure in this attempt, I'm sure anyone reading this topic knows what I'm talking about. Following that, and feeling like I had just wasted my time watching his movie, I then see he said "The Authorities" coerced him to perform an obvious hoax to discredit himself. Maybe he should have taken a page from Sgt. Clifford Stone and just relied on his fantastic stories to sell the idea that he is actually "Starseed" some kind of interplanetary sperm bank.

So this story brought me back to ATS today. After using the search feature I see that nobody else seems to buy this story either, thankfully. But I do know that so many people with their hearts do believe that people are abducted and taken into UFO's for experiments and other purposes. I've seen many documentaries (mostly independent and posted on Youtube) with an abductee so believable with tears in their eyes as they proclaim their supernatural experiences of interplanetary travel, forced pregnancies and other genetic experiments. Even Stan Romeneck was a good enough actor to make me believe that he believed what he was saying.

So my question to the forum is this, are there any fantastic stories in this vein that you feel are truly un-debunkable? Post a source for mine and others education if you feel there is something we should know about. For me I've always been so enamored with Travis Walton, I love "Fire in the Sky" so much that I want to believe in it. In my Walton research over the years I've found that more or less I believe him. But again I have an emotional attachment to the story and I admit I do want it to be true, so that clouds my judgement. What about you? Is there an abduction story that is un-debunkable?

a reply to: BiffJordan

I don't know that it's un-debunkable but the Travis Walton case has stood the test of time.

a reply to: BiffJordan

Hey man, wanna play some poker??

a reply to: BiffJordan

A hint: If they're actively making money and notoriety off of it- it stinks, most likely.

Abductions are real and happen for different reasons because many different groups take who they want when they want....there is no one single linear story to follow …..there are many stories to learn....and every experience is individual....because of organised high level deceptions using MSM and internet conduits there is a massive volume of intentionally misdirecting data floating around carrying 1/2 truths and partial truths just hoping to slow down the process of individuals accepting and understanding this reality they have been suppressed from learning.

I have been abducted multiple times but this is irrelevant unless I meet someone taken by the exact same group...and even then my memories and others are not supposed to be remembered......so only a minute % of that % of abductions can even be utilised by an abductee like me....on one hand this makes it almost impossible to meet others abducted by a specific group that was until the net came along and now it is easier to spot the false misdirects and by proxy easier to find the truthful similar ones.

If you really want to learn research the WOMEN who have been abducted and remember genetic dynamics involving babies for they are taken by a similar group ….try to find yourself ONE type of abduction to learn about AT A TIME....then you will form an accurate big picture.


All I was given from my abductions was a firm push to learn about this planets cycles and what to expect....and its NOT GOOD...I was given a glimpse of a potential future with a realistic visual of the odds of survival for anyone anywhere and then an opportunity to rise above it....I chose to stay here and work with it baby ….lol...anyone who has been shown scenes of devestation and has been told that their abductors are collecting a large DNA pool with which to replace people here if it is needed are victims of the group who took me or are beneficiaries if you choose to see it that way....

In a nutshell this is what I learned....watch the movie 2012 ACCEPTING THAT THIS IS WHAT IS REALLY COMING …. then reverse the last 2 digits to read 2021....then understand this is the timeline for real...and then think about how you could possibly prepare....then accept that THERE ARE WAYS FOR YOU TO PREPARE AND PLACES TO DO SO IN.....no one has to go quietly into the night...although billions will....oil is FRESH NOT MILLIONS OF YEARS OLD and is a renewable resource and we are one of its ingredients.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: BiffJordan

I don't know that it's un-debunkable but the Travis Walton case has stood the test of time.

Except that one time he went on a game show and was hooked to a lie detector test and didn't pass when they asked if he was abducted...

I don't put any real faith in lie detector tests, or game shows, but that always struck me as funny.

a reply to: one4all

You've been abducted? I have some questions- I am completely unsure if I have been abducted, but according to someone (I forgot who) on here, I've been going on trips my whole life...

Are there encounters where there is no trauma, and one goes home giggling about what they just experienced?

I was visited by a grey 25 years ago. I woke up to his grinning face, and tried to slug him (I missed- he disappeared). Would I still be taken, and likely knocked out to the point I'd never know?

I should have asked this first: What species takes you? I have a rendering I did of an alien my wife saw while a ship hovered 20ish feet away from us- got a really detailed description (this was the non traumatic encounter). I named him Beldar, thanks to his head.. Wife says he was built like a bodybuilder, and had turned on the cabin light, yet. Oddly... I didn't see him- but I was concentrating on the ship, construction- or trying to, while being an absolute fool. I was trying to hitchhike for all I was worth.

This guy look familiar?




I have also (shut up, you bunch. You know who you are) just about run the complete gamut of paranormal, in your face stuff. All I'm missing on my paranormal bingo card is being possessed, and meeting Bigfoot. Is this a normal side effect of being taken?

ATM, It's all I can think of. What I'm going for is information. I've been trying to get all I can for some time now.

a reply to: BiffJordan

I tend to be in the camp thinking the extraterrestrials are a million years more advanced than we are currently. So with that level of technology I find it very hard to believe we are being physically abducted. If they are here then I think billions of people being nano-probed real time in ways that are completely undetectable. Just think how far we have advanced with airplanes since 1903. That's 115 years ago. Just imagine where our technology will be in 500,000 years. Molecular based DNA nanobots with unlimited quantum vacuum power cells and subspace radios with unlimited communication range.

I just think extraterrestrials a million years more advanced than us would need absolutely NOTHING from us other than entertainment.

originally posted by: BiffJordan
snip
For me I've always been so enamored with Travis Walton, I love "Fire in the Sky" so much that I want to believe in it. In my Walton research over the years I've found that more or less I believe him. But again I have an emotional attachment to the story and I admit I do want it to be true, so that clouds my judgement. What about you? Is there an abduction story that is un-debunkable?

I don't accept claims of alien abductions and at the top of my list is Travis Walton, he rankles me. Closely followed by the Hills whose own psychiatrist said he didn't believe the abduction claim.

Here are some reliable sources which might help you see Travis Walton in a different light. Read with an open mind.

Travis Walton’s Alien Abduction Lie Detection Test
Michael Shermer
michaelshermer.com...

"Profitable Nightmare of a Very Unreal Kind"
by Jeff Wells (from The Age, Melbourne, Australia, 6 January 1979)
debunker.com...

Monday, February 13, 2012
Travis Walton vs. Philip J. Klass
badufos.blogspot.com...

Larry King Live – Walton UFO abduction case (3/12/1993)


Wednesday, December 23, 2015
Dr. Simon Reveals his Real Thoughts on the Hill "UFO Abduction" Case
badufos.blogspot.com...

originally posted by: The Shrike
I don't accept claims of alien abductions and at the top of my list is Travis Walton, he rankles me.

What are the chances the extraterrestrials are just advanced enough that they need to abduct us to study us. It's makes no sense. If the extraterrestrials are here studying us their technology is most likely so advanced we would just never be able to detect as they analyze and probe every cell in our bodies remotely from outer space or even light years away.

a reply to: BiffJordan

Have you not seen that clip of Stan Romanek being interviewed over a Skype call? Things start flying across the room in back of him...and then, you can see him flick a pen with his hands. It goes flying behind him and he acts surprised...but he was too stupid to realize his hands were in the frame. He is a total fraud.

As are most others with these stories, I think.

ETA: I skimmed your OP which is bad enough, but I skimmed it sloppily becUse I see that you addressed the clip I'm referring to. So, ignore my useless post 😡

a reply to: BiffJordan

But I do know that so many people with their hearts do believe that people are abducted and taken into UFO's for experiments and other purposes.
...
So my question to the forum is this, are there any fantastic stories in this vein that you feel are truly un-debunkable?

Well, Biff, I don't think there is such a thing as an un-debunkable story. All tales require proof before they can be fully believed. The reason I tend to believe that people have been abducted is not so much what they say when lucid, because they usually don't remember very much or they recall things that make no logical sense. I'm more convinced by what they reveal during hypnotic regression sessions, and the level of consistency which is apparent in that data across the wide range of people who experience these events. I'm not convinced they are 100% telling the truth but I've spent a lot of time trying to understand how the human mind works and I know that during such altered states of consciousness a person will lower their psychological barriers to some extent and have a deeper connection to their subconscious thought processes, allowing them to see through any veils or mental blocks which may have been imposed on them.

When some one claims that aliens can alter their memories and cover up memories with so called "screen memories" it sounds very fantastic and outside the realm of what is believable. However, I've come to understand there are very real mechanisms in the human brain which can allow this to happen and human hypnotists such as Derren Brown have rigorously demonstrated it is possible to cover up memories and even make a person believe things that aren't true. It's nothing but psychology, and if the abduction phenomena is indeed real, the abductors clearly know a thing or two about human psychology and how to manipulate our thought processes the way a hypnotist would, because we know the memories are still there and can be accessed by regression techniques.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
they analyze and probe every cell in our bodies remotely from outer space or even light years away.

That's not how physics works.

originally posted by: wylekat
a reply to: one4all

You've been abducted? I have some questions- I am completely unsure if I have been abducted, but according to someone (I forgot who) on here, I've been going on trips my whole life...

Are there encounters where there is no trauma, and one goes home giggling about what they just experienced?

I was visited by a grey 25 years ago. I woke up to his grinning face, and tried to slug him (I missed- he disappeared). Would I still be taken, and likely knocked out to the point I'd never know?

I should have asked this first: What species takes you? I have a rendering I did of an alien my wife saw while a ship hovered 20ish feet away from us- got a really detailed description (this was the non traumatic encounter). I named him Beldar, thanks to his head.. Wife says he was built like a bodybuilder, and had turned on the cabin light, yet. Oddly... I didn't see him- but I was concentrating on the ship, construction- or trying to, while being an absolute fool. I was trying to hitchhike for all I was worth.

This guy look familiar?

I have also (shut up, you bunch. You know who you are) just about run the complete gamut of paranormal, in your face stuff. All I'm missing on my paranormal bingo card is being possessed, and meeting Bigfoot. Is this a normal side effect of being taken?

ATM, It's all I can think of. What I'm going for is information. I've been trying to get all I can for some time now.

My abductions always included some degrees of emotional trauma because of the memory retention and some included physical trauma...however the physical trauma was because of a failure of their SOP....the emotional trauma was because of my personal ability to remain awake and aware during my abductions and to retain memories.


One might find the experience worth giggeling at if you thought it was a dream.


Seven different groups three of which were humans very much like us.None looked like your picture....it looks like a Paracas skull.


It is SOP with some group that you do not retain memories of your abduction event.....this process clearly doesn't work on all of us.

a reply to: BiffJordan

One of my favourite 'abductee' cases is the Stanford, Kentucky one. Three women driving home one night think an aircraft is crash-landing in front of them. The bright red light stops in front of them and resolves into the shape of a flying disc. They start screaming and begin to lose control of the car and feel burning heat from this thing. It's all over and they arrived home, unnerved and jittery, to find it's over an hour later than it should be.

They go straight to the neighbours to gabble about what had happened. One of them had lost her earrings (iirc) and another had her watch going very fast before stopping. Two had reddened faces like sunburn.

Soon enough the incident spread by word-of-mouth and UFO researchers started to call in. One of them, Dr Leo Sprinkle, was big advocate of hypnotic regression. The ladies did the regression sessions and described being held captive. I'm not a great fan of hypnosis because it's earned very limited credibility over the years with practitioner misuse and amateurs playing God with people's minds. In spite of that, the hypnosis tapes are fascinating and it's hard to explain where the women got the imagery from.

In one part, one of them seems to be describing being submerged in what sounds like a breathable gel. She half-chokes as it's in her lungs and surrounding her. The environment smells musty and the whole recollection is unpleasant.

The three women went on to have symptoms of PTSD and life changes. This doesn't mean it was necessarily an 'alien abduction,' but it does mean (to me) that something traumatic occurred to all three and it started with the 'crashing plane.'

a reply to: one4all

One might find the experience worth giggeling at if you thought it was a dream.

It was a pretty solid experience, both of us witnessed the thing, her dog didn't even care- he had found a tasty spot on the road to lick. Reason I asked was- I had read through abduction experiences, and ours was extremely unusual, especially in that regard. Missing time? Didn't care. Taken aboard? I was making jokes about probably being thrown back off after doing Shatner impressions in the pilot's chair. Not to mention the alien, who turned on the interior lights so we could have a good look.

Seven different groups three of which were humans very much like us.None looked like your picture....it looks like a Paracas skull.

Seems the alien itself doesn't match up to 'known' groups, either. I'd guessed it was in the realm of the weirder ETs, like with the Flatwoods Monster. Also of interest- my wife's eyesight is.. meh. To her to have described this being in the detail I was getting, and well- her 'artistic' imagination is almost non existent as well- so making up something like this is well out of the realm of possibility, as well- PLUS her reaction- "Oh, look. An alien."- she may as well have been describing the weather- it's one of the reasons why I'm fuzzy as to what happened abductionwise, because such sharp, exacting details do escape her attention. Not to mention the ship was 20ish feet up, and away from us. I got a glorious view of the bottom, some of the side, and I could see the wraparound windshield, and some lights inside, but not really an alien, per se. Plus, the exterior lights were giving off (no, I'm not kidding) classic, stereotypical, straight from photoshop and J. J. Abrams lens flares. I even took off my glasses, thinking it was some weird effect- and there they still were. So, seeing pointy head there wasn't happening for me.

Plus, like I said, I was acting like a damn fool as well.

It is SOP with some group that you do not retain memories of your abduction event.....this process clearly doesn't work on all of us.

Or, in some people's cases- I think that whatever they do, you either build up an immunity to it, or they manage to break whatever portion of the brain that they abuse. Then, like a mental sunburn, one ends up sensitive, whether they want to be or not.

a reply to: BiffJordan

Sure, how about the Betty Hill case...

Yes, I know all about the different ideas put forth here. The issues with the reports, etc. BUT, there is one little pesky bit of information brought forth by Betty, and that is her "star map"

This case cannot be "put to rest" until that map is properly explained, and that gets very difficult in view of the actual astronomy and astrometrics involved. Then there is the raw mathematics...in this case the actual probabilities of Betty's map existing and defining actual "real world" stars.

Did you all know that all of the "map stars" (the ones with some sort of line associated) are suitable for supporting "advanced life"? These stars are all K, G, or F class stars...IF they were random, they would mostly be class M stars. Curiously Betty's doesn't contain much by way of Class M stars (if made up it should be mostly class M), and has only 1 mystery star.

In any case, I recommend that those with the desire and skills do a very deep dive on the map, it can be quite interesting.

a reply to: BiffJordan

Interesting post and it got me thinking... I personally don't know of any actual un-debunkable cases, but there are cases that the 'UFO community' (or rather the people who make a living from UFO stories, sorry, "research") would claim to be so.

In particular, the Betty and Barney Hill abduction. Listen to Old Stan and Marden talk and you would think it was a slam-dunk certainty, but then again they've got dollars and cents riding on it.

The Hill abduction case seems to be deemed beyond reproach by the Old Stans and Mardens of this world, but for me it's one of the weakest and flimsiest on the market. A couple with a collective racial chip on their collective shoulders seem exactly the sorts to spin a tall tale involving alien-nazis. And the only evidence is the hypnotic regression sessions (no, not counting the story about the stains on Betty's dress, for obvious reasons).

originally posted by: james1947
a reply to: BiffJordan

Sure, how about the Betty Hill case...

Interesting, I just said the opposite. It's just a story made up by a mentally fragile couple.

I forgot about the star map, but it's not evidence in any way shape or form; the 2d data was plucked out of Betty's subconscious but there's no way to prove it was placed there via an alien abduction. Chances are it was sheer coincidence.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Yes, because we, the humans, are the most intelligent species in the universe and know all of physics secrets..