POTUS pardons Hammonds

a reply to: StoutBroux

Since we obviously are of opposing viewpoints.

Any discussion with you would turn into a ping pong match.

I don't do ping ping.

originally posted by: testingtesting
a reply to: blackrussian63

So the Hammonds have admitted guilt?.
Don't you have to admit guilt to be pardoned?.

Where did you get that ?

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: StoutBroux

Since we obviously are of opposing viewpoints.

Any discussion with you would turn into a ping pong match.

I don't do ping ping.

Good. Then I will join
Do some research on who Obama pardoned vs. who Trump has pardoned
There ARE no opposing viewpoints.
You are incorrect in yours , as one cannot debate using a false comparison via rhetoric.

Once again Trump has no regard for morality or the rule of law.

If I set fire to the White House tomorrow do you think Trump will pardon me???

Dwight Hammond has served approximately three years in prison, and his son Steven has served four years, according to the White House.

That seems like long enough to me unless it's meant as a political punishment. I doubt they would have done more than a year if it were not for the political nature of it.

a reply to: Blaine91555

Especially when you learn that the judge in their case looked at the 5 year mandatory minimum sentence, called it ridiculous, and gave them much less time. And then his decision was overturned.

They also paid off over $400,000 to the feds. Soeeycif my digure is wrong, I'm going on memory. But they paid.

a reply to: blackrussian63

Since I refuse to give CNN revenue, I won't click the link. You're supposed to insert key text into your Original Post, to let us know what you're talking about. Only Hammond I know is the the piano guy.

originally posted by: Gothmog

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: StoutBroux

Since we obviously are of opposing viewpoints.

Any discussion with you would turn into a ping pong match.

I don't do ping ping.

Good. Then I will join
Do some research on who Obama pardoned vs. who Trump has pardoned
There ARE no opposing viewpoints.
You are incorrect in yours , as one cannot debate using a false comparison via rhetoric.

Something tells me, in research, I'd come out with different answers then you.

a reply to: StoutBroux

BTW -- Forbes ran twice for Republican president.

Hard to consider Forbes (your link) as an unbiased source.

Maybe you are interested what other medias are saying about this. Source: Spiegel online

Imprisonment "unfair" Trump pardoned ranchers convicted of arson

Donald Trump has pardoned two ranchers who were imprisoned for setting fire to cover up poaching. The case in 2016 led to armed protests by anti-government militia
-----------------------------------

US President Donald Trump has pardoned two ranchers whose condemnation two and a half years ago sparked massive protests from an anti-government militia. The White House called the incidents of arson "inconvenient" for 76-year-old Dwight Hammond and his 49-year-old son Steven Hammond. Both are "devoted family people" and respected members of their community in the western coastal state of Oregon.

The Hammonds were convicted for firing on state grounds to cover up poaching. Dwight Hammond initially lost three months' imprisonment, his son a one-year sentence. However, one appellate judge found the sentences too low and increased them to five years each. They had to return to jail.

Armed protest after appeal

The belated increase in their sentence triggered the armed protests of an anti-government militia called Citizens for Constitutional Freedom at the beginning of 2016. Militia officers, along with other activists, occupied the Malheur Deer Park in Oregon for 41 days. One of the squatters was shot dead by the police.

The leaders of the campaign included the brothers Ammon and Ryan Bundy. However, the Bundy brothers and other squatters were unexpectedly acquitted by a federal court in October 2016.

The Obama administration should have appealed

The White House now blamed President Barack Obama's predecessor government for several years in detaining the Hammonds. The five-year prison sentence was caused by their "overzealous" appeal.

The pardon also justified the White House with the fact that the evidence was not clear. The Hammonds had denied arson. According to their depiction, they had run out of fire, which they had laid on their own ground to fight, among other things, wild plants.

Trump has already made a number of pardons since he took office one and a half years ago. Some of them are highly controversial - such as those of former White House staff, Lewis "Scooter" Libby, who was implicated in the affair of disguising a secret agent during the administration of President George W. Bush, as well as the "toughest sheriff in America "Joe Arpaio has become known.

Merkur.de

Verdict triggered protests
Trump pardons ranchers convicted of arson

US President Donald Trump has pardoned two ranchers whose condemnation two and a half years ago sparked massive protests from an anti-government militia.

Washington - Trump has signed the pardons for Dwight Hammond (76) and his son Steven Hammond (49) on Tuesday, informed the White House. According to US media reports, in 2012 they were convicted of arson on public land for which they had grazing rights. After they were released, a federal court ruled that their sentences were too low.

The Hammonds returned to prison in early 2016. The higher prison sentences of five years each lead to right-wing militia officers in protest occupied for weeks in administrative buildings of the Malheur National Park. They criticized the central government for abusing its power and questioning its authority. The Hammonds case exemplifies the conflict between farmers and ranchers in the western US and the central government that controls large parts of the farmland.
"Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond"

Trump also advocates more self-determination rights of citizens in a weaker central state. The White House said that the evidence in the case was contradictory and that the higher prison sentences were "unfair". "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond." Prior to the Hammonds, Trump had pardoned five convicts or reduced their sentences since taking office.

Translated with google.translate, as all the others bc I am lazy.

Kurier.at, an Austrian newspaper

Trump pardoned ranchers convicted of arson

The case had triggered the armed occupation of a natural park. The White House called the sentences "unfair".

US President Donald Trump has pardoned two ranchers whose condemnation two and a half years ago sparked massive protests from an anti-government militia. The White House on Tuesday called the prison sentences for arson for the 76-year-old and his 49-year-old son "unfair". Both are "devoted family people" and respected members of their community in Oregon.

Dwight Hammond and his son Steven had been convicted for firing a state fire in the western coastal state to cover up poaching. Dwight Hammond initially lost three months' imprisonment, his son a one-year sentence. However, one appellate judge found the sentences too low and increased them to five years each. They had to return to jail.

The belated increase in their sentence triggered the armed protests of an anti-government militia called Citizens for Constitutional Freedom at the beginning of 2016. Together with other activists, the militiamen occupied the Malheur Wildlife Park in Oregon. The occupation lasted 41 days and kept the whole country in the breath. One of the squatters was shot dead by the police.
Trump blames Obama

The leaders of the campaign included the brothers Ammon and Ryan Bundy. The Bundy brothers and other squatters were unexpectedly acquitted by a federal court in October 2016. In contrast, the Hammonds, who had distanced themselves from the occupation, remained in prison.

The White House now blamed President Barack Obama's predecessor government for several years in detaining the Hammonds. The five-year prison sentence was caused by their "overzealous" appeal.

The pardon also justified the White House with the fact that the evidence was not clear. The Hammonds had denied arson. According to their depiction, they had run out of fire, which they had laid on their own ground to fight, among other things, wild plants.

Trump has already pronounced a whole series of pardons since he took office one and a half years ago. Some of them are highly controversial - such as those of former White House staff, Lewis "Scooter" Libby, who was implicated in the affair of disguising a secret agent during the administration of President George W. Bush, as well as the "toughest sheriff in America "Joe Arpaio has become known.

And a final one:
T-Online acting here not only as a news-aggregator, but as a news-provider, too. Source: dpa

After arson
Trump pardons convicted ranchers

When a federal court extended a sentence against two ranchers, ultra-rights go to the barricade. US President Trump intervenes - pardons the livestock farmers.
-----------
When a federal court extended a sentence against two ranchers, ultra-rights go to the barricade. US President Trump intervenes - pardons the livestock farmers.

US President Donald Trump has pardoned two ranchers whose incarceration triggered an armed occupation in a national park in Oregon. Trump has signed the pardons for Dwight Hammond (76) and his son Steven Hammond (49) on Tuesday, said the White House. According to US media reports, in 2012 they were convicted of arson on public land for which they had grazing rights. After they were released, a federal court ruled that their sentences were too low.
In 2016, ranchers will be imprisoned again

The Hammonds returned to prison in early 2016. The five-year prison sentences each resulted in ultra-right militia officers occupying the administrative buildings of the Malheur National Park in protest for weeks. They criticized the central government for abusing its power and questioning its authority. The Hammonds case exemplifies the conflict between farmers and ranchers in the western US and the central government that controls large parts of the farmland.

Trump also advocates more self-determination rights of citizens in a weaker central state. The White House said that the evidence in the case was contradictory and that the higher prison sentences were "unfair". "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond." Prior to the Hammonds, Trump had pardoned five convicts or reduced their sentences since taking office.

For your reading pleasure. Sometimes it is nice to see things from other points of view, I guess.

originally posted by: Blaine91555

Dwight Hammond has served approximately three years in prison, and his son Steven has served four years, according to the White House.

That seems like long enough to me unless it's meant as a political punishment. I doubt they would have done more than a year if it were not for the political nature of it.

Three years is enough for terrorism?

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: blackrussian63
Finally justice for the Hammond's,President Trump pardons Dwight Hammond and his son Steve "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond, both of whom are entirely deserving of these Grants of Executive Clemency,"

www.cnn.com...

From what viewpoint?

Do you think he should have pardoned the black grandmother? Or how about Jack johnson?

Why didnt Obama pardon any of them?

Jack Johnson - - Yes. Haven't followed the grandmother.

Trump does stuff that benefits him in some way. It's all about Trump.

I expect Obama was more serious about following protocol.

Following protocol would mean that grandmother would die in prison.

That's why we love Trump! Take that protocol, and you shine it up real nice and neat, then, Turn It Sideways and STICK IT STRAIGHT UP YOUR ASSOCIATE'S NOSE!

The love of a family isn't something that can be legislated and bureaucratized and red taped to death, Annee!

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: blackrussian63
Finally justice for the Hammond's,President Trump pardons Dwight Hammond and his son Steve "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond, both of whom are entirely deserving of these Grants of Executive Clemency,"

www.cnn.com...

From what viewpoint?

Do you think he should have pardoned the black grandmother? Or how about Jack johnson?

Why didnt Obama pardon any of them?

Jack Johnson - - Yes. Haven't followed the grandmother.

Trump does stuff that benefits him in some way. It's all about Trump.

I expect Obama was more serious about following protocol.

The love of a family isn't something that can be legislated and bureaucratized and red taped to death, Annee!

Tell that to the families on the border.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: blackrussian63
Finally justice for the Hammond's,President Trump pardons Dwight Hammond and his son Steve "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond, both of whom are entirely deserving of these Grants of Executive Clemency,"

www.cnn.com...

From what viewpoint?

Do you think he should have pardoned the black grandmother? Or how about Jack johnson?

Why didnt Obama pardon any of them?

Jack Johnson - - Yes. Haven't followed the grandmother.

Trump does stuff that benefits him in some way. It's all about Trump.

I expect Obama was more serious about following protocol.

The love of a family isn't something that can be legislated and bureaucratized and red taped to death, Annee!

Tell that to the families on the border.

No one is forcing them to try and enter a country illegally with a child in tow... They do this of their own accord. Stop using those people as political pawns.

originally posted by: JAY1980

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: blackrussian63
Finally justice for the Hammond's,President Trump pardons Dwight Hammond and his son Steve "Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond, both of whom are entirely deserving of these Grants of Executive Clemency,"

www.cnn.com...

From what viewpoint?

Do you think he should have pardoned the black grandmother? Or how about Jack johnson?

Why didnt Obama pardon any of them?

Jack Johnson - - Yes. Haven't followed the grandmother.

Trump does stuff that benefits him in some way. It's all about Trump.

I expect Obama was more serious about following protocol.

The love of a family isn't something that can be legislated and bureaucratized and red taped to death, Annee!

Tell that to the families on the border.

No one is forcing them to try and enter a country illegally with a child in tow... They do this of their own accord. Stop using those people as political pawns.

One woman interviewed - - gang members came to her door, actually knocked on her door, wanted her to send out her 14 year old daughter as a sex slave.

These areas are like Chicago was when run by the Mafia.

She ran because there was no other option to save her daughter.

This scenario is happening all over the world - - not just the southern border of America.

a reply to: Annee

Why shouldn't the Hammonds have been pardoned?

originally posted by: TheBadCabbie
a reply to: Annee
Why shouldn't the Hammonds have been pardoned?

My original question in this thread was (still is) - - from what viewpoint should they be pardoned?

That was/is my interest. I am not going to Jump to Why they shouldn't.

I disagree with the viewpoint "Government Overreach" as a legitimate reason.

So, back to my original question: "From what viewpoint should they be pardoned?"