How do carcinogens cause cancer?

It is my understanding that ionizing radiation sometimes knocks out electrons that are used by atoms to create a bond with one another. If those atoms happen to be the protiens in our DNA it creates kind of a 'smeared blueprint' that our cells use to replicate and could create bad copies or too many copies. Thats my understanding of how ionizing radiation causes cancer. If its wrong, please correct.

What I dont get is how things like smoking or other chemicals cause cancer. And nothing ive seen explains in detail how it does. What is the smoke or other chemicals doing and how is it doing it?

a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Me as a layman:

- enzyms working on duplicating the DNA/RNA can be "distracted" by cancerogen materials, so that the copy isn't 1:1
- for experts: This is a map of biochemical pathways, Part 1: Metabolic Pathways, Part 2: Cellular and Molecular Processes Fun!

originally posted by: Whoisjohngalt
It is my understanding that ionizing radiation sometimes knocks out electrons that are used by atoms to create a bond with one another. If those atoms happen to be the protiens in our DNA it creates kind of a 'smeared blueprint' that our cells use to replicate and could create bad copies or too many copies. Thats my understanding of how ionizing radiation causes cancer. If its wrong, please correct.

What I dont get is how things like smoking or other chemicals cause cancer. And nothing ive seen explains in detail how it does. What is the smoke or other chemicals doing and how is it doing it?

Some chemicals like Benzene which are found in cigarette smoke are known carcinogens. Benzene is a ring of six carbon atoms in a hexagonal shape. As with other polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons it causes cancer. It has two rings of electrons on either side of the carbon ring. The ionic charge can detach ions and atoms from other molecules like DNA.

I'll keep it simple

1 Smokers have been known to live to over 100

2 Cigarettes will never be banned - plausible denial ability - who can blame the internal combustion engine

3 Then there is Fukushima.....(Links for Fukushima too numerous to list)


"Diesel Exhaust Causes Lung Cancer – Now What?"

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Much of the current regulatory activity has been focused on the workplace. Many countries lack workplace regulations, and many others have regulations that need re-evaluation by quantitative risk assessors in light of the new research findings.

However, EC exposure levels have been decreasing over time in these Australian mines, so use of recent measurements likely results in an underestimation of lifetime exposure, and thus, an underestimation of excess lung cancer deaths. Australia has a recommended level of occupational exposure to EC of 100 μg/m3, but no workplace regulations exist (5). This lung cancer risk exceeds levels that are acceptable in Europe and the U.S., leading the investigators to call for “the implementation of stringent occupational exposure limits for diesel exhaust” (5).

"atmospheric background ionizing radiation"

www.arpansa.gov.au...

What about artificial sources of radiation? Sometimes artificial sources of radiation are also included as ‘background’ radiation. Medical diagnostic tests and treatments are the largest source of artificial (or man-made) radiation exposure in Australia.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Me as a layman:

- enzyms working on duplicating the DNA/RNA can be "distracted" by cancerogen materials, so that the copy isn't 1:1
- for experts: This is a map of biochemical pathways, Part 1: Metabolic Pathways, Part 2: Cellular and Molecular Processes Fun!

I like the layman answer. As for the chart, i think you may be thinking im smarter than i am. I once put on a shirt and wore it to the grocery store without realizing the coat hanger was still in it and sticking out the top.

originally posted by: stormcell

originally posted by: Whoisjohngalt
It is my understanding that ionizing radiation sometimes knocks out electrons that are used by atoms to create a bond with one another. If those atoms happen to be the protiens in our DNA it creates kind of a 'smeared blueprint' that our cells use to replicate and could create bad copies or too many copies. Thats my understanding of how ionizing radiation causes cancer. If its wrong, please correct.

What I dont get is how things like smoking or other chemicals cause cancer. And nothing ive seen explains in detail how it does. What is the smoke or other chemicals doing and how is it doing it?

Some chemicals like Benzene which are found in cigarette smoke are known carcinogens. Benzene is a ring of six carbon atoms in a hexagonal shape. As with other polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons it causes cancer. It has two rings of electrons on either side of the carbon ring. The ionic charge can detach ions and atoms from other molecules like DNA.

Perfect! Thank you!

originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
I'll keep it simple

1 Smokers have been known to live to over 100

2 Cigarettes will never be banned - plausible denial ability - who can blame the internal combustion engine

3 Then there is Fukushima.....(Links for Fukushima too numerous to list)


"Diesel Exhaust Causes Lung Cancer – Now What?"

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Much of the current regulatory activity has been focused on the workplace. Many countries lack workplace regulations, and many others have regulations that need re-evaluation by quantitative risk assessors in light of the new research findings.

However, EC exposure levels have been decreasing over time in these Australian mines, so use of recent measurements likely results in an underestimation of lifetime exposure, and thus, an underestimation of excess lung cancer deaths. Australia has a recommended level of occupational exposure to EC of 100 μg/m3, but no workplace regulations exist (5). This lung cancer risk exceeds levels that are acceptable in Europe and the U.S., leading the investigators to call for “the implementation of stringent occupational exposure limits for diesel exhaust” (5).

"atmospheric background ionizing radiation"

www.arpansa.gov.au...

What about artificial sources of radiation? Sometimes artificial sources of radiation are also included as ‘background’ radiation. Medical diagnostic tests and treatments are the largest source of artificial (or man-made) radiation exposure in Australia.

Makes sense that diesel engines can cause cancer. I started link hopping around after stromcell mentioned polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and i guess burning anything can cause cancer. What a bummer.

Well generally California throws a dart at their board of of any product that works worth a damn, they call up all the big class action law firms they get in touch with god and let him know the new flavor of cancer of the day and then they get to slap their lovely Prop. 65 warnings on your great grandfather’s Johnson and return to to step one rinse repeat yada yada...
I kid of course being a someone who went through cancer the other replies are good info on the science got me interested again because the odds of my getting the type of thyroid cancer at my age were extremely low.

a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Ultimately, DNA is just a chemical and hangs together like all other chemicals do. You can disrupt it with a blast of radiation that causes ionization - i.e: that messes with the electrical charge of the outer electrons of the atoms. These outer electrons are called valence electrons and determine how atoms attract and stick to each other.

Also, by pumping up the power into the atom, it boosts the electrons into a higher and less stable orbit and they are more likely to be entirely bumped off the atom by photoelectric effect and to skip to adjacent atoms if their charge is right.

Some chemicals are primed to stick their noses in to the business of other atoms by having the right numbers of electrons in their outer shell, or not. These chemicals can disrupt the normal chemistry of DNA just by being what they are, and being close enough to the DNA molecule.

As well as the biochemical pathways maps, you can reference stuff like Structural Biochemistry/Nucleic Acid/Biology of Cancer

Remember that you don't have to memorize the map, because you can always look back at it. Just try and learn to read it in sections, you can then apply that learning and read other parts.

Happy discoveries

a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Chr0naut explained it really well.

Basically, a carcinogen sticks to DNA and changes its sequence. When that genetic mutation starts replicating and duplicating out of control you have cancer.

Any molecule with the skill to alter DNA is considered a carcinogen (the list is quiet long and it goes from food, natural compounds, man made chemicals, radiation, etc).

The problem is that sometimes the mutations stay dormant until one day they decide to wake up and start multiplying like there's no tomorrow. This is the reason why sometimes cancer appears 20/25 years after exposure to a carcinogen.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Me as a layman:

- enzyms working on duplicating the DNA/RNA can be "distracted" by cancerogen materials, so that the copy isn't 1:1
- for experts: This is a map of biochemical pathways, Part 1: Metabolic Pathways, Part 2: Cellular and Molecular Processes Fun!

Hey, that is a good metabolic reference. Better than the one I have in my bookmarks, I always have a problem finding that one quickly, the title does not have good identifying factors to it. I bookmarked this one too. The one I had is much more simple, but this one has more detail in it. In most cases the one I had was adequate, but when studying precise pathways this is better. The other one was easier to identify alternate pathways though.

To me this kind of stuff is easy to understand, although I have not studied all of the different metabolic processes in detail. Usually the pathways disrupted in far northern Europeans like Finns involve the same pathways. That is what interests me the most, people I share metabolic traits with. It is easier to understand if I test on myself to try to understand what disrupting a pathway results in symptom wise.

I have no clue how exactly radiation effects the replication of the cells, I have not gone that deep into it in that direction. The evidence seems conclusive that repeated exposure does cause replication errors though. The exact method of action on some things is not necessary when so many different studies conclude the same thing.

a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

I haven't studied the relationship of radiation effect on cancer creation much. I know it does cause cancer because so many sources conclude there is a relationship. I suppose I should study the method of action on that better, but there are many types of radiation and energy, they all act differently in how they modify our cells. These energy sources also interact with the foods we eat so depending on your diet specific types of cancer risk can be more relevant.

We do have replication checkers in DNA replication that check for damaged DNA. You would need to disrupt the function or communication of those. Cancer has many types, a tumor of lung tissue can grow on the liver if a energy signiture is not correct for the location. The stem cells form the tissue in the wrong place. Now tumors can become cancerous if a certain part of the DNA is mutated to moderate growth, and even there, the body does have a system for fixing that problem if everything is in proper communication. certain food chemistries and medications can interfere with the communication between cells in the body. You have to have a lot of wrong things in place to actually get cancer. Our food chemistry people are eating is messed up and food chemistry should be tied to epigenetic familiar traits and past diet based on historic eating habits of your ancestors. The ones to look at are those that were healthy, not try to use diet from an unhealthy person to replicate. Most epigenetic diseases can be controlled by eating the correct diet. It is not so simple in todays world. The energy connection you are talking about might disrupt metabolism.

a reply to: rickymouse

I think I read that Roche has paid salary to this guy for 40 years to complete this chart, he took this long to cartograph.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: rickymouse

I think I read that Roche has paid salary to this guy for 40 years to complete this chart, he took this long to cartograph.

That would be best viewed on a big screen with a projector, like an interactive white board. I got a smartboard from an auction which is at my daughters business and she uses it as a board to draw on, the other daughter just got a projector from a friend. Now I can hook it up as a teaching and research aid with the computer. I need to find a place to do this research and to teach my kids and their friends how these things interact. I seem to have steered or narrowed mostly into metabolomics now, most diseases and conditions interact with that. I took a few classes in that but the classes seemed to steer a person into finding medicines to fix conditions instead of altering the diet to get rid of the disease from forming.

a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Cancer is a mistake your body makes when replicating cells while fixing an “injury”. It accidentally creates a brand new life form that begins to replicate.

It doesn’t matter what injured cells your body is healing. There is still a chance it makes a mistake that begins replicating.

Radiation screws with the DNA of cells making the mutations more likely. Thus a replicating mutation has a better chance of forming.

Or atleast that’s my rudimentary understanding of it all.

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

Everything causes cancer because cancer is a mistake in the DNA of a cell when replicating more cells to heal an injury.

Some radiation and chemicals effect the DNA of a cell causing mutations more often. Which makes a cancer mutation more likely.

It is still all a crap shoot.

Carcinogens don't cause cancer simply or only because they are present and in your body ....they contribute to the multi-faceted environmental conditions required to trigger the pleomorphic bacteria carried upon parasites that we get from ingesting specific foods which then multiplies and resides within our bodies just waiting to MORPH into the form of itself that catalyses the conditions we call cancer....for this pleomorphic bacteria to catalyse the condition know as cancer certain chemical conditions and stressor conditions must be present internally and THEN specific chemicals must be introduced to the body which complete the COMBONATION LOCK NUMBER that releases the deadly phase of this common bacterias life...….basically they have learned to force peoples bodies into this internal state without people realising it by promoting diets and foods via cost controls that support this negative dynamic.....then they have in an organised collisional manner conspired to pollute our water sources and food soures and living environment with these KEYSTONE chemicals that are require to put together the caner and illness combonation number....they trick us or manipulate us to attack ourselves internally unknowingly and then they do everything they can to attack us externally and environmentally.....so as to put together the perfect storm and keep us all sick and dependant on their contrived BS drugs that are actually invented to support prolong and work symbiotically with the DISEASES THEY HAVE CATALYSED AND UNDERSTAND.


Carcinogens are some of these specific chemicals required to put together the combonation number I spoke of...these are the external components that must be introduced into an already parasite/bacteria infected and weakened body...and this is why in a scenario where 20 people work in an Office and ten get cancer and their Lawyers claim that there were CONTAMINANTS OR CARCINGENS IRRESPONSIBLY PRESENT they are 100% correct.....AND...when the defense Lawyers point out that the other TEN people are perfectly healthy proving that it could not in fact be the office environment giving these people cancer they are 100% correct.....but you see the TRUTH IS that the ten people who got cancer from the chemicals in the office were unfortunate enough to have successfully prepared their own bodies by unknowingly creating the perfect weak sick body conditions required to click some of those combonation lock numbers into place.....nd the other ten people who did not get cancer STILL HAVE THE DEADLY BACTERIA INSIDE THEM but were not weakened and chemically unbalanced enough to set those combonation lock numbers in place to support the incoming exterally originating chemicals to complete the sequence needed to cause the condition we call cancer and these people can work in that office for their entire lives and as long as they dont let their bodies become an alkaline petri-dish with perfect conditions t o solve 1/2 of the cancer/illness combonation number ….they will be fine.

Just my uneducated high school drop-out supposition here nothing more.

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: Whoisjohngalt

Cancer is a mistake your body makes when replicating cells while fixing an “injury”. It accidentally creates a brand new life form that begins to replicate.

It doesn’t matter what injured cells your body is healing. There is still a chance it makes a mistake that begins replicating.

Radiation screws with the DNA of cells making the mutations more likely. Thus a replicating mutation has a better chance of forming.

Or atleast that’s my rudimentary understanding of it all.

You perfectly described inflammation.....and also the process which is a byproduct of the actions pleomorphic bacteria participate in which triggers this generic type of body reaction.....an inflammatory core value software message is repeated and the response by the body is repeated...which triggers accelerated inflammatory catalysed and driven type abnormal growth.

Computers were based off of our bodies existing technology...every last idea connected to them is a copy of an existing natural method of communication or conduit of such.The brain is the hardware and everything else is software....viruses tweak the software to repeat itself needlessly and fool the hardware into doing things repeatedly the body doesn't need done which causes problems and glitches and even the smallest error can screw up massive areas .

Just a follow-up link.....www.youtube.com... metals/ carcinogens....same thing but different.....lol.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

Rezlooper did a great thread on Cancer

"We may have cured father-in-laws cancer naturally - symptoms are gone in three weeks!!"
www.abovetopsecret.com...