MGTOW - Men Going Their Own Way, Thanks Feminism

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy

originally posted by: bulwarkz
The woman or girl you use for an example

I don't use anyone, I share pleasurable time with my female friends who are going their own way just like me.
It's fantastic, cooked food for me, I do practical jobs, share a bottle of wine, watch a chick flick cozy on the couch, bit of intimacy later, works well without having a committed relationship. All my single female mates the same, it's great.

The various anti right groups are very out there. For example, there's a guy who is a prominent member of them right now who raped his wife for a decade, forced her to have children, he did so so that he could use the children as f-toys (as he put it), the wife got away and committed suicide, says children make better spouses than wives because they don't spout off feminist crap, and so on. He's the front runner Republican House candidate in his district right now.

This is his subreddit www.reddit.com...

Everyone involved with the mgotw, incel, etc crowd is looney, and should be locked up. It's only because we have a President that brags about getting away with sexual assault that these people are being emboldened.

Oh gosh, I won't get into politics because I'm in the UK and the silly MGTOW thing isn't really a thing here. I only learned about it from this thread.
...but they do just seem like a load of nuts whining about women lol

originally posted by: Aazadan
The various anti right groups are very out there. For example, there's a guy who is a prominent member of them right now who raped his wife for a decade, forced her to have children, he did so so that he could use the children as f-toys (as he put it), the wife got away and committed suicide, says children make better spouses than wives because they don't spout off feminist crap, and so on. He's the front runner Republican House candidate in his district right now.

This is his subreddit www.reddit.com...

That sounds awful, haven't heard about that one, but it doesn't surprise me. Have a link to the story? There are a lot of guys in the Blackpill/Incel category who are becoming more and more vocal about wanting to act out and that's a bad thing. Some of the MGTOW guys have tried to give them advice about how to voluntarily accept their situation and make peace with it, but Incels and even the true forced loneliness guys are self-radicalizing.

Everyone involved with the mgotw, incel, etc crowd is looney, and should be locked up. It's only because we have a President that brags about getting away with sexual assault that these people are being emboldened.

There is a joke I read about the differences between the assorted camps that gave me a laugh:

Incel: Why can't I win the game?
Pick up artist (PUA): Here is how to win the game, buy my book to find out how!
MGTOW: Yeah, I'm not playing this game.
Men's Rights Activist (MRA): We must fix the game!

You're one of the smarter guys on ATS. It would be interesting to hear your thoughts about some of the things that have been discussed (here and here in particular).

I know it's hard to put aside your emotional reaction and to want to defend women by default. As guys we have a natural desire to protect. The reddit MGTOW crowd tends to be more negative towards women than I agree with, but they have a valid point. The anger comes from a place of being wronged no different than many feminists were furious with men after how they were abused (similar to the story you're commenting on).

The lack of respect both ways is going a long way to making things more and more inhospitable and unstable. That is why I said earlier the whole thing looks like it is going to boil over into a culture war. Everyone feels like they are the odd man out. Saying, "MGTOW, INCEL, etc crowd is looney, and should be locked up" just shows you are not being as introspective about what's happening as you are capable of. Hopefully it doesn't come down to picking a side because if that day comes, the country, if not the world, will without a doubt fall into a horrendously violent civil war along political, sexual, and gender lines.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy

originally posted by: Mishmashum

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Mishmashum

Dude, I'm mocking the whole MGTOW thing as a movement or organisation. It's ridiculous.
Do you go on MGTOW forums and whine about women to each other?
Absolutely hilarious.

But you don't even understand what you are mocking because you don't understand the labels. How do you know you are not mocking yourself?

I'm not in some silly movement whining about women online lol
I'm just a human dealing with fellow humans, male or female.
Can gay guys join MGTOW as well if they are treated bad by their partners, or is it just an exclusively 'whine about women' club?

You actually hit the nail on the head for my opinion.
I am mgtow because all relationships are now gay relationships. Everything is treated as permanantly temporary.
100% commited...for now.

I am too old to care so I just game the situations now. No reason not to take advantage of the few perks that come from this ruinous game of cat and mouse it has become.
I am not mad at women at all. I hate the wheel.
Turning it all into a sex negotiation ruins it all. It used to be more. The ideal that was love.....has become gay

Women don't need defense. #metoo is doing them in just fine. You know how many male owned private companies just toss their resumes in the trash.

We don't want to play anymore. We want what is ours. And ladies, it's not you.

Our time, money and freedom is far more valuable to us than you are.

originally posted by: Mishmashum
That sounds awful, haven't heard about that one, but it doesn't surprise me. Have a link to the story?

politicalwire.com...

This guy actually did time for trying to kill Obama, and this is his second run at office.

There are a lot of guys in the Blackpill/Incel category who are becoming more and more vocal about wanting to act out and that's a bad thing.

In recent years, a lot of groups have become more radicalized, the incel crowd has been radicalized more than most though.

You're one of the smarter guys on ATS. It would be interesting to hear your thoughts about some of the things that have been discussed

I don't think women are any worse than men in this regard. If you consider it ok for a man to sleep around, then equality means you should also find it ok for women to do the same thing. For every male PUA out there, there's going to be a female version as well. That doesn't bother me one bit.

I gave my opinion on the dating scene before, but my opinion on it is that most people want to score personal victories while dating. Instability in relationships comes from an unequal balance in power where one side wins too much. In practical terms I think this means that people should seek SO's that have similar income, similar levels of free time, similar level of looks, and so on. Basically, I think that 10's should stick to 10's, and 4's should stick to 4's and that partners should be worthy adversaries of each other. Not only should a potential partner be your best friend, but they should be your arch rival. That way equality in the relationship is maintained.

I can give a personal example of this that I saw in action recently. My dad and his girlfriend were together for 11 years. They both worked 60-80 hours per week, every week. Recently, my dad retired and he suddenly had a lot of free time. It ended their relationship almost instantly because my dad now had a lot more time to devote towards their relationship while his girlfriend didn't. While my dad never asked for more time, it left his girlfriend feeling like a lesser contributor. Those types of situations should be avoided.

originally posted by: bulwarkz
Everything is treated as permanantly temporary.
100% commited...for now.

All relationships are temporary. In the most extreme of cases, one person is going to die before the other and the relationship will end.

In a more typical case, in a long term relationship people grow and change. After 5 or 10 years the people who got together are no longer going to be the same people that they were at the start. What they offer each other isn't necessarily going to be what the other person wants any longer and that's a completely rational reason to end a relationship.

a reply to: bulwarkz

I love all my female friends who I'm intimate with, just none of us want to commit to monogamy.
They are the same as me, so if I'm labeled MGTOW they must be WGTOW, or we agree that HGTOW (humans) is more appropriate as an acronym.
I think the whole silly labels thing for men who whine about women is lame as # though.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Apart from mother in laws mind.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: bulwarkz
Everything is treated as permanantly temporary.
100% commited...for now.

All relationships are temporary. In the most extreme of cases, one person is going to die before the other and the relationship will end.

In a more typical case, in a long term relationship people grow and change. After 5 or 10 years the people who got together are no longer going to be the same people that they were at the start. What they offer each other isn't necessarily going to be what the other person wants any longer and that's a completely rational reason to end a relationship.

I thank you for being honest.
Real love is grown between 2 that bind.
Without a covenant based relationship where 2 are commited to work through hardship together it is destined to dissolve and dissipate instead through the same hardship that could have deepened love instead.
You see, love today is following the gay model where partners are temporary and everything is based on sexual attraction, which is the weakest category in the "love" scale.

Physical attraction is little more than chemicals.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: bulwarkz

I love all my female friends who I'm intimate with, just none of us want to commit to monogamy.
They are the same as me, so if I'm labeled MGTOW they must be WGTOW, or we agree that HGTOW (humans) is more appropriate as an acronym.
I think the whole silly labels thing for men who whine about women is lame as # though.

It is quite possible that the path you choose determines the lvl of love you are capable of. You might have limited your ability to know a real, deeper form of love as you settled for the narcissistic version.
I believe you are sincere.
I also believe you have no idea of the love that forms from a covenant relationship with the one you love by honoring the covenant

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: bulwarkz

I love all my female friends who I'm intimate with, just none of us want to commit to monogamy.
They are the same as me, so if I'm labeled MGTOW they must be WGTOW, or we agree that HGTOW (humans) is more appropriate as an acronym.
I think the whole silly labels thing for men who whine about women is lame as # though.

I do not think you are mgtow.

a reply to: bulwarkz

I disagree.
You know nothing about say my love for my intimate female friends, some 20+ years, just because we don't commit to each other in sexual monogamy has no bearing to our love.
Don't project your own views on everyone else, it's lame.
And your gay line is pathetic, I know gay couples who have been monogamous for 20 years.

You sound like a caveman so go back to whining about women lol.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: bulwarkz

I disagree.
You know nothing about say my love for my intimate female friends, some 20+ years, just because we don't commit to each other in sexual monogamy has no bearing to our love.
Don't project your own views on everyone else, it's lame.
And your gay line is pathetic, I know gay couples who have been monogamous for 20 years.

You sound like a caveman so go back to whining about women lol.

I never whine about women. I have pity for what has happened to them actually.
This outcome is really harsh on the large majority of them.

And I stand firm in acknowledging that you most likely hardened yourself to ever even understand the TYPE of love that is GROWN from a covenant based union instead of what makes something hard or wet.

a reply to: bulwarkz

Covenant?
Again, don't project your own personal views on me or everyone else.
My love is deep and is equal to times I have been in a committed relationship, more in some ways.
MGTOW is lame.

The greek has 4 words to describe love.
The western use almost completely involves "eros" exclusively in its practical application.
Stergios, philia and agape are almost non existant in this narcissistic play on love that you describe. reply to: CornishCeltGuy

a reply to: bulwarkz

Lol okay Plato 😂

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: bulwarkz

Covenant?
Again, don't project your own personal views on me or everyone else.
My love is deep and is equal to times I have been in a committed relationship, more in some ways.
MGTOW is lame.

I see I went where you will not tread.
I accept now your love is deep and unselfish.
You convinced me

a reply to: bulwarkz

Lol you just can't handle the idea that people can be different to your world view.
Come on Plato, step your game up 😂

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: bulwarkz

Lol you just can't handle the idea that people can be different to your world view.
Come on Plato, step your game up 😂

Wait, wait.
I thought we agreed you are totally right and all your temporary relationships that I see as gay type temporary relationships are the same as the covenant based relationships where love is grown into maturity.
I agree your adolescant version is the same, ... in your mind

a reply to: bulwarkz

Lol again, your assertion that same sex relationships are all temporary and shallow just shows how little you have a clue of the real world. As I said, I have gay friends who have been in committed relationships for 20+ years. What, are you a fundamentalist Christian or something.
Your argument completely died when you came out with the gay line.
MGTOW is lame, and your attempts to project your own opinions of love into my life is equally lame.
Amusing though so I'll probably keep replying...a bit like my cat who toys with a half dead mouse.

EDIT
And they are not temporary relationships, they are female friends who I deeply love, some 20+ years. You haven't got a clue fella.


I'll meet you half way, when I pull a tourist and go back to her hotel room then that most definitely is pure sexual attraction, but when I get invited for home cooked food, share a bottle of wine, cozy on the couch watching a chick flick, followed by intimacy, that is genuine and deep love of many years. If you can't understand it that's your problem fella, not mine. But don't try to project your ideas of love on me, or try to give me one of your silly whining boys labels to me like PUA or MGTOW, it's pathetic, lame, and something only found on the internet posted by guys who haven't left their mom's basement.