MK ULTRA & Project MONARCH information Thread ALL Info 1 spot.

originally posted by: KansasGirl
a reply to: tadaman

Debunking by tarot card is ridiculous....but to be fair, that OP was suspect.

Not really suspect

in the Air Force.....they did me and looked like rooky's y's on purpose....in a barracks in 1972.......plainclothes dudes in a corner room never seen....and at 4 am they had a problem hiding me....and themselves, their presence meant look out boys..........the dream was unreal...and the Spirit in me shut their young azzes down.....the night before for no reason they took my buck knife.......illegal to take a short blade buck knife since everyone has had one....am I right.....twas a forced orgasm....woke evrybody up within four rooms on that floor....Lowry Air Force base, home of the retrain bunch..................tell me

a reply to: verschickter

One of the few college courses I took was a hypnotism class by an ex army contractor that performed his profession for the army during the cold war.

My first day I asked him what techniques could I teach myself to combat being hypnotised.

I then became a blip on that guys radar. It was strange for the rest of the course.

There was an officer, dont know what branch but you could tell he was military, and not regular military. The professor and this guy immediately started insider talking about things on day one and singled out certain students that could not be let into the circle. I was one.lol

The professor chose this guy and a few others to study the rest of us while we were taking a class about hypnotism. Really we were being programmed to see who was REALLY susceptible to hypnotism and they were gaining insight on what personality types are better suited for hypnotism.

I am convinced the professor was running a side experiment on us. There were all sorts of cues that the class was falling for.

So maybe a song would come on in a video we were watching and everyone starts bopping their feet to it after the professor cues them verbally or with a quick gesture... He and I would make eye contact and the fact that I wasnt bopping along would stand out.

He liked to think that I wanted to stand out by my failures. He said so to the military man. I was just in war mode because he was programming us and I came with the intent of learning effective countermeasures to hypnotism.

Only those who accepted the programming would pass from what I could tell.

I mention all this because I noticed that the OP was familiar with hypnotism like you alluded to. Either by training or by exposure. I suspect we saw the same choice of words and reactions.

I believed her. She reminded me of my class towards the end of the course. They were actively using the professors techniques on themselves as part of the routine. They would speak and act in a conducive manner towards the professors programming.

She reminded me of a victim after suggestive programming, not an actual handler.

The handler role given to victims to personify is used to normalize the effect of the trauma by making a victim act out against another victim. They later think to their own actions as a "master" instead of what they feel when a "master" does the same to them. That locks it all in.

A large part of the effort is to populate these groups with former victims. The victims that accept the programming become the next generation of handlers.

I think that is why we picked up on her ability to fit into that role. She was probably closer to the end of the "training", turned out to not be a devoted and dependable handler, so they used her to test measures they will employ on victims that manage to resist their programming.

Who knows, but that wasnt a typical ATS troll thread. I think that in the future, we should expect more of these people to come out and seek a witness to their lived horrors.

More are resisting, breaking free, and getting ridiculed. I guess the people behind this cant just kill them all. Life is not a movie.

They may be mostly small and unconnected groups that share insight and some resources at specific times when its safe to meet up.

I think, they are all isolated cells so one cant be linked to another....so if they dont do something, maybe that group is weak and they never will do that.

They all pretend to be connected and untouchable to their victims. Some groups may be, most are small and limited in their resources and survivability from what I can tell.

One victim could in theory, kill or have arrested the entire group in their local area and the other groups may never even know.

IMO, They dont just call each other from one group to another. There may be exceptions and special occasions, but they are so scared of getting caught when they arent in the act that they probably just hide from everything and everyone.

a reply to: TheJesuit

Yea.

Give those meddling, abusive bastards some "feedback".


Here's one for them.

a reply to: Mousygretchen

I might have believed her if it weren't for the sensational sex talk every second line. 

You never met a victim of extreme and prolonged sexual abuse. She was not lying about that part as far as I could tell. That behavior is all the designed outcome.

I cant be sure of anything over the internet. How you are all so convinced that she is a liar is not logical to me.

The ones who REALLY insist that this is all BS, I actually think are complicit in these types of crimes.

Hi, I was one of the debunkers on that one thread. It was painfully obvious the OP was full of it. I did a google search on their name and found some questionable stuff. They were malicious when it came to posting reviews as well as had an ad on a sex site.

It's good to have debunkers here. While this is a site for the unknown mostly, this is a site where you can weed out the bs to get to the real stuff. I will forever be here to debunk bs like this. I researched heavily into MK Ultra over the years and find it fascinating. However, I do not find it fascinating people sensationalize themselves for attention.

a reply to: Soulece

That doesnt spell out liar to me. Unless you are saying that she is a method actor. Thats typical behavior from survivors.

Aggressive, defensive posture, sexual disassociation, prostitution and the such.

Even if not a monarch victim, she may be a sexual abuse victim trying to find closure, so MK ultra is chosen as an explanation because it fills in many answers. She may truly believe it even if its not true.

I think that the ability to debunk what is bunk, is a critical skill we all need. I just think people enjoy it more than they employ it for fact checking. Not saying that is what you did.

There were people that outright refused to believe that any of this could even be possible. Those are the easily convinced and the actual perpetrators who fill those ranks.

I think many wanted to give the benefit of the doubt to the OP who honestly wasnt looking too great by posting what she did.

Most just wanted to develop the conversation and learn something about a subject that is shut down WAY too quickly in most cases.

a reply to: tadaman
Now the thread gets rolling! It´s great to meet someone who knows what he´s talking about.

Let´s pretend for a moment this was the real deal. My guess would be like yours and here is why:

Alongside of other things, it was the way she described the female handlers appearance and aura in the black dress it made the impression she was a very powerful person in her eyes. I know it´s just text on a screen but if I consider all the other things she wrote, definitly subject, not handler. Could be a clever ruse, too.

I´m not a professional in the sense of earning money but that´s my guess. One thing is clear, whoever that wrote knows at least enough to maybe fool us both.

Think about it, there are others like you and me. We both could have pulled that off, except maybe for the extreme graphic wording. It wasn´t easy to read for certain.

He and I would make eye contact and the fact that I wasnt bopping along would stand out.

What did you think at that moment?
-Damn I´m effed, I´ll be his special project from now on, maximum paranoid mode.
-Maybe we can team up.

It´s so frightening easy once you understand how the human mind operates. In my experience, it´s really true that feminin persons, male or female are much more responsive to subtle cues and once you set them up for a rapid inductions, chances to fail with that are towards zero. The younger the better it works.

I remember the first time when I set up a close friend (female, 30, a bit insecure and shy, emotional). She asked me if I´d do a bit relaxation on her because she heard how relaxed, lightweight and happy the others all felt after a session.

Normally I set up a camera but since we were not alone, I skipped that and thought I´d test a rapid induction, set a trigger and then wake her up to see how she´s responding. No interesting things to see on video here.
So anyways I looked her deeply in the eyes while I stepped into her private space, grabbing her right hand gently swinging it up and down but slowly working my way "down" with her hand and that moment I saw her confusion, pulled the right hand and snapped my fingers besides her ear.

That was it, she was introduced and I started talking her deeper and deeper into trance while slowly letting her body sink into the couch. She wasn´t responding at all so I changed to a very demanding voice and that did the trick. It´s totally against my intuition that I had to order her to relax. It has never been that easy before. It went that far that I had to bring her up soon after, because both I and her safekeeper realized she was having a little to much fun and since the camera was offline I was feeling very uneasy about that. So I brought her back again and she was like, "when do we start".

Her friend then told her she is finished for the day. I bet she was jealous. Hell I would have been, too. In the follow sessions I refrained from the heavy relaxation part but the soft voice wasn´t working at all.

My conclusion with this is that she was very emotional, shy and that´s basically a mirror of herself when I tried the soft voice, she was too familar with it, I guess. She needed someone to tell her what to do, instead of guidance. Class A submissive person. Does that make sense to you?

cheers

a reply to: verschickter

He and I would make eye contact and the fact that I wasnt bopping along would stand out. 


What did you think at that moment? 
-Damn I´m effed, I´ll be his special project from now on, maximum paranoid mode. 
-Maybe we can team up. 

I thought, damn. I am playing the role of nemesis to the group dynamic.

I figured that he would just use me in juxtaposition of a more preferable example.

There was one time we were talking about freedom fighters vs terrorists and cases of makeshift Manchurian candidate type attacks. I mistakenly voiced a more anti war argument and mentioned prolonged military involvement in both cases. That today we have both state sponsored terrorism and state sponsored rebellion.

The way I was shutdown was spectacular, he was so eloquent. I thought about it later, and I was just injected with the words he set, and he read me clear and guided the complete shutdown to my prior thought.

It was corraling the variables for a group in the sense of making the deviant feel isolated. I could not form a natural part of a group in his class outside of the dominant dynamic. We were all a little distrusting and intrigued at first. Many were just taken back and engulfed once things fell into place.

My conclusion with this is that she was very emotional, shy and that´s basically a mirror of herself when I tried the soft voice, she was too familar with it, I guess. She needed someone to tell her what to do, instead of guidance. Class A submissive person. Does that make sense to you? 

As a more Feminine person myself internally, yes.

Only a demand or a studied formulaic request would work on someone like that. Too demanding can cause evasiveness. Too soft and it becomes background noise to their own thought process.

I am no where near being well versed enough to quantify effective methods or counters to hypnosis but I will say that it comes natural to overcome people like oneself. If you keep growing then nothing can keep you as anything "other" than yourself for too long.

Nothing we face in life should feel like wearing someone elses shoes. Nothing anyone can do to you will throw you off if you have walked in those shoes on your own feet. That would be my best general advice.

If a fortified mind against illusions is the desired goal: Be mindful of yourself in the universe. The space you occupy personally. Make it the center. No matter where that dot goes, all of you is still where you need to be. This way you dont forget where you really are and who really is. True north.

Have a good one.



What would you say has the best possibilty of success for someone trying to recover from heavy programming;

More counter hypnosis, or step by step, methodic deprogramming (if possible) with full reveal and necessary recovery time??

a reply to: tadaman

I tested to center, that´s the perfect description I would gave while doing it. I did it with spirals and binaural beats, the help of my guidess but I have to say that I find it extremly hard to realize and then snap out of the beginning phase with a fast strobing light. It´s about 10-11Hz and it leverages a completely different principle.

There´s something those photocurrents doing very well and you can´t do much to stop it. That´s my impression.

What would you say has the best possibilty of success for someone trying to recover from heavy programming; More counter hypnosis, or step by step, methodic deprogramming (if possible) with full reveal and necessary recovery time??

I never had that case (it depends on what you mean). I guess it depends on my intuition and the type of programming and what I know about the handler at that moment. What do you understand under the term "heavy programming"?

Are you talking about traumatic encapsulation/honeycombing? If so:

- would not do it, to dangerous, that´s really not something one should try without holding at least a psychologic degree.

To be honest, until I know what you mean with heavy programming I can´t give you an answer that would also satisfy myself. We can do this private, too (u2u). There are some circumstances I would need to explain to you I´d rather not discuss in public. We´re bordering a topic that get´s a bit to private to share it with everyone, except ones that know what I´m talking about. Hope you (and others) understand that. Like I said, u2u just fine.

I´ve done deprogramming / trigger erases several times and no one ever complained. But it were my own suggestions, not from a stranger.

a reply to: verschickter

I meant reinforced over time. Yes trauma and prolonged indoctrination. Maybe even with a regiment of adrenaline training and physical conditioning as well.

Lets say a person is recovering after joining a violent cult that they lived with for a decade. They are showing signs of recovery but still lapse bask into their conditioning with regularity.

I ask out of curiosity. I would never dare practice hypnotism or even give an opinion to someone that is ill beyond that they should seek the respective professionals.

Would you override the conditioning with more programming that mirrors a natural state or just help the natural recovery process along? I am just curious which is more aligned with standard practices.

a reply to: tadaman
Oh you´re going that deep, okay.
Quick answer, I really need to rest asap ^^.
In this hypothetic situation (just as you, I would not do it):

Since "more" does not often help "more", I´d go with the gentle version, slowly trying to strip away the layers. I can imagine this as a very painfull or disturbing process, although using the gentle method. Asuming I would know when we hit the base, I would try to suggest some more positive thoughts but not in deep trance again but more like into the direction of ASMR.

I would try to blend it out slowly and not go nuclear into the other direction. But what am I talking about, I´ve no experience with that heavy conditioning, except for what I wrote you privately. But it was a non-hostile setting so I guess I have no clue.

a reply to: tadaman

I´d like to add, if the gentle version does not work, you can still use the "sledgehammer" with that route. That´s basicly the reason, I think you can´t damage much more when you try the gentle version first. But I only can speculate, can´t stress that enough.

a reply to: NerdGoddess

wellllll....that caught my interest.

I had a reading done about a year ago. The reader used a regular playing card deck to do it.
I didn't even know you could use playing cards for that.

If your up for it, would you be interested in doing a reading?

a reply to: TheJesuit

I was promised flashbacks , I want my second hit !