Entire County Refuses to Obey New Gun Control Law, Declares Itself Gun Owner Sanctuary

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

And, lets play that scenario through a bit. Let's say the IL gov decided to send in the NG to enforce LAWs (let's ignore Posse Comitatis too while we are at it, so the U.S. Army cannot be called in). The media will LOVE that coverage....and it will be played 24/7, riling up the pro-2nd amendment movement, the NRA, and all sorts of bad press. Given enough bad press, and spun properly, the Gov could be signing his own resignation by forcing the issue of an anti-constitutional action.

Yeah, that will work out well, but not for the Democrat political machine. It will likely result in the mobilization and strengthening of the Conservative parties in that state to vote out all those that back this legislation.

Not a smart move politically IMO.

a reply to: Krakatoa

Ah interesting thank you
I was curious because I know things are massively different to the UK. Here the government can deploy regular troops on the streets pretty much on a whim if they wish.

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

And, lets play that scenario through a bit. Let's say the IL gov decided to send in the NG to enforce LAWs (let's ignore Posse Comatatis too while we are at it). The media will LOVE that coverage....and it will be played 24/7, riling up the pro-2nd amendment movement, the NRA, and all sorts of bad press. Given enough bad press, and spun properly, the Gov could be signing his own resignation by forcing the issue of an anti-constitutional action.

Yeah, that will work out well, but not for the Democrat political machine. It will likely result in the mobilization and strengthening of the Conservative parties in that state to vote out all those that back this legislation.

Not a smart move politically IMO.

Other than the governor using the ING to impose an unconstitutional order, if a governor activates their respective NG's it does not violate the posse comitatus, they are activated in Title 32 US Code, meaning they can enforce local law, they are not activated under federal authority.

Still bad no matter how you slice it, but a governor can activate them without violating posse comitatus, potus cannot.

originally posted by: Grimmley

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

And, lets play that scenario through a bit. Let's say the IL gov decided to send in the NG to enforce LAWs (let's ignore Posse Comatatis too while we are at it). The media will LOVE that coverage....and it will be played 24/7, riling up the pro-2nd amendment movement, the NRA, and all sorts of bad press. Given enough bad press, and spun properly, the Gov could be signing his own resignation by forcing the issue of an anti-constitutional action.

Yeah, that will work out well, but not for the Democrat political machine. It will likely result in the mobilization and strengthening of the Conservative parties in that state to vote out all those that back this legislation.

Not a smart move politically IMO.

Other than the governor using the ING to impose an unconstitutional order, if a governor activates their respective NG's it does not violate the posse comitatus, they are activated in Title 32 US Code, meaning they can enforce local law, they are not activated under federal authority.

Still bad no matter how you slice it, but a governor can activate them without violating potus cannot.

Yeah, I updated to clarify what I was saying. Which was that the NG can be called, but NOT the U.S. Army, etc... which are restricted under Posse Comitatis. Limiting the discussion and scenario to ONLY the IL State NG.

a reply to: 727Sky

It's pretty ####ing sad when a county has to declare itself a sanctuary in order to enjoy a constitutionally protected right.

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: Grimmley

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

And, lets play that scenario through a bit. Let's say the IL gov decided to send in the NG to enforce LAWs (let's ignore Posse Comatatis too while we are at it). The media will LOVE that coverage....and it will be played 24/7, riling up the pro-2nd amendment movement, the NRA, and all sorts of bad press. Given enough bad press, and spun properly, the Gov could be signing his own resignation by forcing the issue of an anti-constitutional action.

Yeah, that will work out well, but not for the Democrat political machine. It will likely result in the mobilization and strengthening of the Conservative parties in that state to vote out all those that back this legislation.

Not a smart move politically IMO.

Other than the governor using the ING to impose an unconstitutional order, if a governor activates their respective NG's it does not violate the posse comitatus, they are activated in Title 32 US Code, meaning they can enforce local law, they are not activated under federal authority.

Still bad no matter how you slice it, but a governor can activate them without violating potus cannot.

Yeah, I updated to clarify what I was saying. Which was that the NG can be called, but NOT the U.S. Army, etc... which are restricted under Posse Comitatis. Limiting the discussion and scenario to ONLY the IL State NG.

Oh, and I wonder how many of those NG troops who took an OATH to uphold the U.S. Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic, would follow an unconstitutional order?

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: Grimmley

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

And, lets play that scenario through a bit. Let's say the IL gov decided to send in the NG to enforce LAWs (let's ignore Posse Comatatis too while we are at it). The media will LOVE that coverage....and it will be played 24/7, riling up the pro-2nd amendment movement, the NRA, and all sorts of bad press. Given enough bad press, and spun properly, the Gov could be signing his own resignation by forcing the issue of an anti-constitutional action.

Yeah, that will work out well, but not for the Democrat political machine. It will likely result in the mobilization and strengthening of the Conservative parties in that state to vote out all those that back this legislation.

Not a smart move politically IMO.

Other than the governor using the ING to impose an unconstitutional order, if a governor activates their respective NG's it does not violate the posse comitatus, they are activated in Title 32 US Code, meaning they can enforce local law, they are not activated under federal authority.

Still bad no matter how you slice it, but a governor can activate them without violating potus cannot.

Yeah, I updated to clarify what I was saying. Which was that the NG can be called, but NOT the U.S. Army, etc... which are restricted under Posse Comitatis. Limiting the discussion and scenario to ONLY the IL State NG.

Oh, and I wonder how many of those NG troops who took an OATH to uphold the U.S. Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic, would follow an unconstitutional order?

The fact that we're even discussing the idea of it happening speaks volumes on how far into the hogsnip part of America has slipped. 53 years ago the National Guard was called in to defend Americans' rights and ensure equal application of those rights. Now, for the first time in this country's history, we have a sizeable swath of Americans calling for their rights to be stripped from them and, if needed, the National Guard be used to REMOVE rights...

What fustercluck confederation of dunces is this new normal being run by?

a reply to: burdman30ott6

The thing is though, unless you actually have some organised militia then the NG can and would 'take yer guns', events after Katrina pretty much set the precedent.
I imagine similar will happen in Effing county if it escalates, and with no organised resistance the NG would win the day.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: burdman30ott6

The thing is though, unless you actually have some organised militia then the NG can and would 'take yer guns', events after Katrina pretty much set the precedent.
I imagine similar will happen in Effing county if it escalates, and with no organised resistance the NG would win the day.

It's a numbers game. Would gun owners die? Absolutely many of us would. Who flinches first, who runs out of people first? The only certainty is the final outcome doesn't really matter to dead men on with side.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Would it escalate like that though do you think? Could this little county in Illinois really be the flashpoint?

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Would it escalate like that though do you think? Could this little county in Illinois really be the flashpoint?

I have no idea. I'm mostly familiar with the western US. There are definitely parts of the west where it would absolutely escalate to that point.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Wild west as they say I guess.
I imagine anyone standing for public office opposing such a stance would get the vote next time though.

a reply to: Krakatoa

I figured that was what you were saying, I just wanted to clarify it to be safe

a reply to: libertytoall

Wait? Pyle must be triggered because they brought facts to a witless commentary? Nope. You're actually the one who is triggered. As it's the first thing you could think of. SAD.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Lab4Us

'The fed's' has become adopted as a slang general term for 'authority' here in the UK, I perhaps should have just said 'the authorities'.
Illinois State Police only seem to have around 1700 sworn personnel, so I wonder how many citizens in that county have firearms. Could the governor call in Illinois National Guard? They have about 13,000 troops.

Yep, could go with National Guard as well, though I wonder how many of them have privately owned firearms at home? Not a road I would think the governor wants to go down.

Really a shame though. If not for Chicago and East St. Louis, Illinois could be a wonderful and beautiful state and people would probably quit leaving (and taking their tax $ with them). I grew up just North of St. Louis on the Missouri side (Florissant) and made many trips to Illinois for concerts at Universities and Fairs. Well, and to buy fireworks 😎. Haven’t been back since about 1980.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: burdman30ott6

The thing is though, unless you actually have some organised militia then the NG can and would 'take yer guns', events after Katrina pretty much set the precedent.
I imagine similar will happen in Effing county if it escalates, and with no organised resistance the NG would win the day.

While I don’t disagree with your premise, I’d argue Katrina and this are two very different situations. Some of those National Guardsmen (persons?) likely live in Effington and likely own privately owned weapons. Again, not something I think the Governor wants to deal with (though with the gun-grabbing, left, who knows?).

Would really suck if some tiny county like this kicked off the next US Civil War, but I guess wars have started over less.

originally posted by: Lab4Us
Yep, could go with National Guard as well, though I wonder how many of them have privately owned firearms at home? Not a road I would think the governor wants to go down.

That's a good point, but if the NG troops are not from the Effing county area would they even care?
It's a scary thought if that is a potential choice for a gov who wants to run with a gun grab.
It always boils down to humans at the end of the day, but humans consistently 'follow orders' unfortunately.

Thanks for the interesting reply, I always enjoy learning more about the structure of government control in other countries.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

That's just common sense freedom.

Two things sorely lacking these days, unfortunately.

Good for this county.

a reply to: KansasGirl

I believe what 727 specifically finds amusing is that someone is using the "sanctuary city" meme in an actual sane way.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Lol, nearly as many people live in my town than that county, good luck fending off the fed's when they come a calling.

That will sure be a very long wait, since feds aren't going to be enforcing state law, especially illegal or unconstitutional state laws. The only police available with jurisdiction will be state police.