Ecstasy trials for combat stress

If you make it back you can be happy. I've read in the past BBlockers are extremely effective...but not nearly as much fun I guess. Personally I don't see any great problem with using any drug to help people. I hope it works. Wait til the guys in Iraq hear this.



Here's another link discussing its use in postraumatic stress:
mdma.net...

The FDA and the Spanish Ministry of Health have concluded that the risk/benefit ratio is favorable under certain circumstances for clinical studies investigating MDMA-assisted psychotherapy. Both agencies have approved pilot studies in chronic posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) patients who have failed to obtain relief from at least one course of conventional treatment.
-------------------------------
The possibilities for its use in psych counselling are endless. We may well see it being used as an adjunct to people's acceptance of therapy in a wide variety of problems.


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AhHah. Hangon. You don't have to be a Vet! The govt is offering it to us ALL. Whoohooo.

clinicaltrials.gov...;jsessionid=6C655113C890FEFEEC4F82493CC5276F?order=13

Eligibility
Ages Eligible for Study: 18 Years - 70 Years, Genders Eligible for Study: Both


[edit on 17-2-2005 by ZeddicusZulZorander]

First the "War on Drugs"

Then "After the war on drugs"

It amazes me that MDMA was supposed to be the new scourge, turning the brain into swiss cheese, permanently depleting seratonin levels even after 1 hit, now when it suits them, the government changes its tune again.

No wonder many kids think anti drug campaigns are full of crap. They are.

Edit: sh... to crap

[edit on 17-2-2005 by deevee]

So now we are going to make junkies out of our vets from Iraq, this is just fantastic, miracle drugs to make you happy and like that you can go back to your family and go latter psycho on your wife and kids.

MDMA IS NOT ECSTACY! X or E is a cocktail drug nowadays, there is even a cottage industry supplying testing devices, you know the same ones the Cops use to determine right on the scene what a suspicous substance may be? MDMA Is considered by Psychologists to be nearly a perfect drug with few side effects compared to alternatives, the reason it got banned was it was Intoxicating but anothing thing it did is it opened a person up easing discussion between patient and doctor. Talk about something the gov't DIDN'T want in the hands of the populace

It would be helpful if the submitter had his concluding paragraphs following the quoted information.

Sofi, thanks as always for giving us some scientific feedback.

Whoever wrote this story, make your intro paragraph worthy of a submission, it's a good story.

MDMA was discovered as an unplanned by-product of research by a German company in 1912. In the 50's it was studied by the US for use as a truth serum (though there are allegations the Nazis used it for the same reasons). For similar reasons it was used by some psychiatrists in the 60's and 70's as a reconciler tool for couples and families. Anyone whose taken it (as I did for much of a year) can attest to its ability to completely break down inhibitions and 'make' people say what they really mean, as opposed to alcohols ability to merely loosen inhibitions.

The main dangers come from when its sold illegally (as ecstacy) when it's often cut with many different substances like heroin, horse tranquilizers or innocuous (on their own) powders like talcum powder or flour.

In its pure and regulated form and in the right hands it could be powerful tool to help traumatised soldiers. It could enable them to access and openly talk about memories that might have been otherwise been suppressed. If used as part of psychological sessions and not prescibed like some kind of paracetamol, it could be very beneficial for sufferers of many types of trauma IMO.


EDIT: I know about the dangers of depleted serotonin, before anyone asks.

[edit on 17-2-2005 by kegs]

[edit on 17-2-2005 by Romeo]

Ecstasy is MDMA, or 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine. It belongs to a family of drugs called "entactogens," which literally means "touching within." Other drugs in this category include MDA, MDE and MBDB. MDMA is a Schedule I synthetic, psychoactive drug possessing stimulant and hallucinogenic properties. MDMA possesses chemical variations of the stimulant amphetamine or methamphetamine and a hallucinogen, most often mescaline. Before it was made illegal in 1985, MDMA was used by psychiatrists as a therapeutic tool, and was used as an appetite surpresant.
Studies are currently underway in Spain and Israel assessing MDMA's effectiveness in the treatment of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD).

All you need to know ...
The link above is a page with facts about MDMA.The page itself may seem a little 'cute' but does not effect the facts writen about the drug.



MDMA surfaced briefly as one of a number of agents used in clandestine US military research during the 1950s. The CIA's Project MK-Ultra was investigating new techniques of brainwashing, espionage and mind-control. MDMA, code-named EA-1475, was tested at the US Army's Edgewood Arsenal in Maryland. However, unlike '___' or the ill-named "truth drug" scopolamine, MDMA was used only on animals: mice, rats, pigs, monkeys and dogs. Thankfully, MDMA's military potential was not realised. For although MDMA is no infallible truth-serum, its effects on the human user might indeed be abused for sinister purposes by skilled interrogators. The heightened emotional responsiveness, lowering of defensive barriers, openness and sense of closeness to others induced by MDMA can promote an honesty of self-disclosure that might be manipulated for malign ends. Fortunately, this hasn't yet happened on an organised scale.
mdma.net

So looks like this isnt the first time for this.

[I vote no on this topic submission. There are no extrea links. I'd've liked to have seen some links to technical papers on mdma usage, particularly on neurophysiology and pyschology. A link to a page on the history of its usage as a therapeutic drug would be interesting too]

devee
It amazes me that MDMA was supposed to be the new scourge[...]now when it suits them, the government changes its tune again.

MDMA has a long history of therapeutic usage. Infact it predates it popular abuse by a number of years. Its still, I beleive, used in ongoing therapuetic studies and sessions.

www.maps.org...
Psycholytic Therapy with MDMA and '___' in Switzerland
[treatment[]Dr. Bloch worked with administrations of 125 mg of MDMA alone. The other therapists, Styk and Widmer, used 125 mg of MDMA for the first three or four sessions; after that they gave '___' in dosages ranging from 100 mcg to 400 mcg. Duration of therapy ranged from participation in only one drug session (in one case) to nine years and three months[...] [patients problems]Patients were asked to list all the reasons that led them to begin psycholytic therapy, both major as well as minor. Social and interpersonal problems were reported by 66.9% of the patients. Psychological symptoms were also reported by 66.9% of the patients[...][one of the other reasons given was]problems in military service [...][results]To summarize, the percentage of patients who considered themselves to have experienced good improvement or slight improvement during their psycholytic treatment was 85.1%. After treatment, that percentage climbed to 90.9%. As a point of comparison, in a follow-up study undertaken by Mascher (1967) in Germany, 62% of the 82 patients treated by Leuner et al. considered themselves to have experienced good improvement or slight improvement.

The top site is also a general site for mdma research.
Here's a similar abstract attain via google scholar
A method of conducting therapeutic sessions with MDMA
Acute psychological effects [of mdma]are attenuated by the serotonin uptake inhibitor citalopram
Potential Human Neurotoxicity of MDMA ('Ecstasy'): Subjective Self-Reports, Evidence from an Italian Drug Addiction Centre and Clinical Case Studies
Psychobiological problems in heavy ‘ecstasy’ (MDMA) polydrug users
[...]Verbal Memory in Individuals Who Stopped Using [mdma]

marg
So now we are going to make junkies out of our vets from Iraq,

MDMA doesn't really result in chemical addiction.

Neurobiology of addiction and implications for treatment
Neuroimaging studies [...] to measure 5-HT[serotonin] transporter levels in persons who are regular heavy ecstasy users report reduced levels.

BUt this doesn't apparently result in addiction to the drug.

Death and Dependence: Current Controversies over the Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors
Recent years have seen a considerable media interest in the adverse effects of the selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors. This has led to claims that these antidepressants may lead to suicide and homicide and that they cause dependence or even addiction[...]In this article I review the basis of these claims and show that many seem to emerge from the misinterpretation of evidence and the use of imprecise definitions

I take that, perhaps erroneously, to mean that effectively doing what X does does not necessarily lead to addiction.
I haven't been able to find any articles in this preliminary search that supports the idea that the stuff is addictive. Soldiers given it, especially in a therapeutic setting, are probably going to have nothing to worry about.
Hell, the little bastards are probably taking the stuff anyway!
'Hey, this isn't good X, its not even stamped, where's my Ufos and double stacked mitsubishis goddamnit!?'

here are some more interesting references:
Effects of dose, sex, and long-term abstention from use on toxic
effects of MDMA on brain serotonin neurons(pdf)
Mood, cognition and serotonin transporter availability in current and former ecstasy (MDMA) users

[edit on 17-2-2005 by Nygdan]

'Hey, this isn't good X, its not even stamped, where's my Ufos and double stacked mitsubishis goddamnit!?'

Used before?

This is kinda a funny drug.No real studies have been done that determine much.
We know you get high,you like to touch and jack-jaw alot.
Side effects I have seen are memory and thought process issues.

I think the only study is going to be for the benifit of the gov and rightfully so,not the public.
I dont see MDMA becoming something over the counter like Zoloft or anything.

Originally posted by SMR
Used before?

I like to take notice of the weird lingo some groups use, numsayin?

No real studies have been done that determine much.

I think that the studies show that it does infact cause lots of temporary problems and results in long term irreversible brain-damage even with complete abstinence from usage.

I dont see MDMA becoming something over the counter like Zoloft or anything.

oh, heck no, its a schedule one drug, right alongside crack-cocain heroin and crystal meth. Its not going OTC or even presecription anytime soon.

MDMA for the treatment of post tramatic stress syndrome? I can say on personal experience that it does help. Although, I am surprised the FDA is allowing this.

American soldiers traumatised by fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan are to be offered the drug ecstasy to help free them of flashbacks and recurring nightmares.

I took a lot of Ecstasy in my earlier years, and I can say for certain that you can't sleep very well on it. It felt good, but my mind never stopped running. Maybe it was just me.

Peace

Self prescribe and get caught- Prison

Fight someone's war and survive- Uncle Sam's your man

Correct ecstasy is MDMA. As Sardion2000 was saying, E is usually not pure MDMA nowadays. However, it's rare for the "fillers" to be hardcore drugs like heroine (contrary to the media scare), it's typically stuff like caffeine.

originally posted by Nygdan
I think that the studies show that it does infact cause lots of temporary problems and results in long term irreversible brain-damage even with complete abstinence from usage.

Studies show it causes temporary problems. Studies show irreversible damage only occurs if large quantity is taken on a fairly frequent basis. The human brain repairs and regrows...and irreversible damage occurs through the abuse of many substances...such as prescribed antidepressants. Keep in mind most studies are done with rats. So from my own human experience I can tell you problems are temporary but I don't abuse it.

originally posted by Nygdan
oh, heck no, its a schedule one drug, right alongside crack-cocain heroin and crystal meth. Its not going OTC or even presecription anytime soon.

Placing E right along those drugs isn't even controversial. Anyways E was a prescribed medication in the US before.


[edit on 082828p://18u22 by Lucid Lunacy]

I may be wrong,but it was used in the U.K. by marital counselors?
I have taken it a few times myself,and thought it was nothing special.Hot and cold flashes,enhanced colors,inability to use thought or memory,temporally.

The thing is,like said,mostly been tested on lab rats.The long term effects havent been shown in tests thus far,but with all drugs,you never know until that long time period is in place.
Pure MDMA isnt easy to find anymore in X/E as like any drug,it gets cut with other junk,cocktail if you will.Iv seen tests done on quite a few pills showing heroine,meth,caffeine,mescaline,even ketamine.

Holes in Brain:by Rick Doblin, Ph.D.
You also may have heard the stories that Ecstasy use causes holes to be formed in the brain. However, the claim that MDMA causes "holes in the brain" is not backed up by scientific research. For the full story about holes in the brain go here.A number of studies have looked at anti-oxidants like Alpha Lipoic Acid, Vitamin-C and E as a possible agent to prevent MDMA's neurotoxicity.

With the effects we see from this drug,being pure MDMA,I think it may be safe to say that it will help those with such disorders in 'getting their mind off things' and being able to let the euphoria take them to a happier place.


Disclaimer:
I do not condone the use of any drug including MDMA (Ecstasy/E )
My post is made for educational purposes only.

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Studies show irreversible damage only occurs if large quantity is taken on a fairly frequent basis.

Yes, but the 'frequent' users were people who had taken something like 30 hits of it over any period of time and the irreversible damage remained even when they permanently stopped using it.

smr
mostly been tested on lab rats

The brain dissection studies were done on rates with brain cells that act as a reasonable human model sure. The long term irreversible even if abstaining damage studies were based on human beings.

Holes in Brain

Yes, in fact I recall it being MTV that promoted this idea, in a 'poly-drug' abuser, someone who abused lots of drugs for a period of time. The 'holes' aren't holes of course but are areas of different levels of blood flow. I haven't seen any reserach that states that MDMA usage results in this.

[edit on 21-2-2005 by sardion2000]

Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Studies show irreversible damage only occurs if large quantity is taken on a fairly frequent basis.

Yes, but the 'frequent' users were people who had taken something like 30 hits of it over any period of time and the irreversible damage remained even when they permanently stopped using it.

Ive read alot of studies on the affects of Ecstasy. I'm almost inclined to go fish them all up and present them here. Nygdan what article or study are you referring to that specifically says irreversible damage occurs if a user takes somewhere around 30 hits over any given time.

Let's space that out and say the user takes one hit every other month. That's more then four years. Your are aware of the fact the brain repairs damage right? Now if the user took 30 hits in a months period that's probably more then the brain could handle and permanent brain damage would probably be a result. However, if you space it out, studies have shown the brain repairs what damage is done. It doesn't accumulate in the same way that say acid does. It's not stored in your spine and you don't get ecstasy flash backs. That's just not how ecstasy is processed in the body (maybe rat bodies).

Now I have known ALOT of ravers and I can tell you 30 hits is over a long period of time. A typical user does 1-2 hits of E at an event. They typically go to 1 event a month. Events are typically during the warmer seasons.

That's in the USA though. I have heard they are more frequent in England and Britian. Again keep in mind if you abuse it then yes brain damage will probably be a result. That is true for MANY subtances, including SRI's (anti-depressents)

[edit on 042828p://21u56 by Lucid Lunacy]

I can tell you this. And im speaking from first hand experience. Ecstacy will cure soldiers in the very short term. BUT, give them the drug once and they will like it, and probably keep using it to solve there problems. But it catches up on you eventually. Memory loss, depression, mood swings just to name a few of the side effects which I and most E users go through on a regular basis even months after taking the drug.
If any government gives their squaddies ecstacy they are just asking for trouble.

Other than that though i'll bet theres gonna be some wicked parties in downtown baghdad!!!