Breaking - FusionGPS was a subcontractor for the FBI - ran 702 inquiries w/out FISA

originally posted by: DanteGaland
Yes. 4Chan as a "source".

The SAME social forum that claimed to have hoaxed the Steele Dossier

Yeah.

Remember that?

I remember when 4chan put out the Mandalay Bay crime scene photos and named the perp as Stephen Paddock hours before the media was forced to "break" the story.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Perhaps I missed it. Where in the text of the order does it state Fusion was the contractor?

It's also interesting that it states the information those "contractors" had access to was stored only on FBI systems and it was not disseminated further.

Also, does Fusion do quite a bit of work with the FBI? It stated those contractors were trained on FBI minimization processes. It stands to reason that a private contractor would not put their staff through that training unless they are going to work frequently with FBI systems.

I think this is an authentic piece, though there are a couple phrases in the text that seem a bit "odd". But without a lot more info, I'm not sure it says what some think it says.

a reply to: introvert

If I am not mistaken it goes back to Nunes's investigation. Where the FBI paid Steele while at the same time the FBI was providing info to Steele. FusionGPS was the company contracted by the law firms to handle the Trump dossier info and if I remember correctly information provided to Steele ended up in the dossier which in turn was used to "corroborate" the dossier to the FISA court. FusionGPS in turn contracted with Steele.

The only way FusionGPS had access to the info they did is if they had access to the FISA material.

FusionGPS is behind the dossier. They get access to FISA material to add weight to the dossier. Steele is contracted to create the dossier. FusionGPS provides their info to Steele. Later the FBI meets with Steele, gets information from him while at the same time giving Steele info.

Using this setup creates several sources "independent" of the FBI with information that corroborates the info the FBI has. Without knowing how the sources got the info the dossier looks genuine. Knowing the sources of where the info comes from destroys that illusion since it confirms the "evidence" was in fact manufactured by all 3 entities conspiring together. FusionGPS already lied when they claimed there was a mole inside the Trump camp and have since walked that claim back. The only other avenue is if FusionGPS received the information in question from another source.

That is my theory based on available information however Nunes is suppose to disclose this info sometime this week regarding FISA abuse by the intel community to spy on US citizens. The Inspector General report also comes out on Monday. I do not believe the timing of Nunes claims / disclosure and the IG report are coincidental.

You could be correct regarding FusionGPS not being the company subcontracted by the FBI. I have not been able to read the entire linked document yet so its possible it is disclosed there as well.

a reply to: introvert

I have to agree that the name of the contractor is redacted, so we don't know with certainty at this point that it is fusion.

Though regardless of who the contractor was, it still seems like the fbi was acting very inappropriately. I will want to see more info though.

Having said all of that, it is reasonable to speculate that it could be fusion, as long as we are honest that we don't have certainty.

I look forward to more documents coming public that explain the fbis actions

a reply to: DanteGaland

Gosh you just know it's bull from the hyperbolic language of the very first paragraph.
Then the fake looking documents. Who falls for this?

a reply to: Sillyolme

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: DanteGaland
a reply to: Swills
a reply to: kurthall
a reply to: Sillyolme


* - Top Secret FISA Court Order - President Obama Spying on Political Enemies - Complete set of documents in question.

The image in the op is from page 83 in the document link above the first twitter image.

Now that we have the complete 80+ page source document we can forgo anymore bitching about the sources talking about this.

a reply to: ExVoto

Also not their first foray into satire either. They are to be taken with tons of salt not just a grain.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Yeah no thanks. I already know who falls for this.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Xcathdra

Yeah no thanks. I already know who falls for this.

and we all know who ignores inconvenient facts.

So you are intentionally ignoring the source document for the sole purpose of trying to debunk it?

ooooook

Maybe read the source document first.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Regardless of the theories we think are possible, we will not know anything certain unless we get more info. If this document is real, which I have no reason to doubt that it may be at this point, it does not state specifically what some are claiming, including the individual in your OP.

It also important to note that the document gives sources for it claims, which are noted as "Id" in the text. So we will have to see if anything comes us this, in regards to Fusion, and if that source material comes to light but at this point I have no reason to believe it is connected.

a reply to: Xcathdra


Perhaps the FAKE NEWS awards should be delayed until after Devin Nunes makes his "bombshell" announcements? Those announcements probably won't change the award ranking, but may add more fuel to the fire that burns the liberal MSM to a crisp.

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: introvert

I have to agree that the name of the contractor is redacted, so we don't know with certainty at this point that it is fusion.

Though regardless of who the contractor was, it still seems like the fbi was acting very inappropriately. I will want to see more info though.

Having said all of that, it is reasonable to speculate that it could be fusion, as long as we are honest that we don't have certainty.

I look forward to more documents coming public that explain the fbis actions

I thought Fisa stuff was very top secret kinda stuff. How in the hell are private contractors getting their hands on it even? If the contractor is Fusion GPS, it's game over.

a reply to: introvert

Fair enough..

As a side note so people can understand the documents classifications -
Source - **PDF**

The source talks about the various levels of classification as well as the restrictions. The list below pertains to the 80+ page source in the op and can be found on page 20 on the source in this link (the bolded ones below are whats on the pages in the document). It explains what each means.

* - Risk Sensitive (Classification//RS)
* - For Official Use Only (U//FOUO)
* - ORCON (Classification//OC)

Clearly identifies or reasonably would permit ready identification of intelligence sources or methods that are particularly susceptible to countermeasures that would nullify or measurably reduce their effectiveness. May be used only with Top Secret, Secret or Confidential

* - Controlled Imagery (Classification//IMC)
* - Restricted Data (Classification//RD)
* - Formerly Restricted Data (Classification//FRD)
* - Sources and Methods Information (Classification//SAMI)
* - Not Releasable to Foreign Nationals (Classification//NF)
* - PROPIN (Classification//PR)

Used to identify information provided by a commercial firm or private source under an express or implied
understanding that the information will be protected as a proprietary trade secret or proprietary data believed to have actual or potential value
• May not be disseminated outside the federal government in any form without the express permission of the originator of the intelligence and provider of the proprietary information
• Precludes dissemination to contractors irrespective of their status to, or within, the U.S. Government without the authorization of the originator of the intelligence and provider of the information
• May be used with Top Secret, Secret, Confidential or Unclassified

* - Authorized for Release to (Classification //REL)
* - Critical Nuclear Weapon Design Information (Classification//(RD or FRD)-CNWDI

originally posted by: pavil

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: introvert

I have to agree that the name of the contractor is redacted, so we don't know with certainty at this point that it is fusion.

Though regardless of who the contractor was, it still seems like the fbi was acting very inappropriately. I will want to see more info though.

Having said all of that, it is reasonable to speculate that it could be fusion, as long as we are honest that we don't have certainty.

I look forward to more documents coming public that explain the fbis actions

I thought Fisa stuff was very top secret kinda stuff. How in the hell are private contractors getting their hands on it even? If the contractor is Fusion GPS, it's game over.

The op discusses the "loop hole" in the FISA laws where 702 "inquiries" apparently do not need a FISA court approval. Also it claims the FBI gave the people from (presumably) FusionGPS access to the FBI network to do this. I am not familiar with how that would work so......

a reply to: Xcathdra

I love it how politicians, lawyers, TV newscasters all dance around legalese so as to confuse, confound and provide confirmation bias to the eager-to-be-offended.

Here is the short, around the campfire, version:

Obama, Hillary and everyone working for them used whatever means were at their disposal to get info on Trump during the 2016 US Presidential campaign, so they created a document in order to carry out their agenda of spying on all-things-Trump. They did this with impunity because the TV's were belly-laughing at the thought of a Trump presidency and it was a 'shoe-in' for Ol Dodgy to gain the throne. They didn't count on Trump winning and their little game being exposed.

.......and at the head of this snake you can guarantee Ol Dodgy was calling ALL the shots.

a reply to: Sublimecraft

I agree and it certainly makes sense when you consider Clinton's "outburst" after her Matt Lauer interview where she supposedly yelled at her staff / Donna Brazile saying if Trump wins we all hang.

The left tried to get the Russia dossier covered in the media about a week before the election and no one took it. Clinton sent out a tweet on Oct 31st talking about Trump and Russia. I assume the intent was to get it out in order to get Clinton elected, which did not work.

I don't know about the source and legitimacy of this but it wouldn't surprise me. I lost faith in the FBI to be non-partisan.

One thing is for sure, Trump knows the truth. Everyone acts like he doesn't know and he gets his latest news from Fox, but he's the most powerful man in the world and he knows everything weeks before it comes out, but he's keeping quit and dropping hints.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Yeah, I looked at the document. This isn't a reference to Fusion GPS. First off, look at the length of the redacted name:



That's clearly not "Fusion GPS." It appears to be about the size of 4 capital letters but it could be 3. Also, it says that this sharing of raw intel (stored and accessed on FBI computers) ended April 18, 2016.



That's months before Steele was contracted. In fact, it predates every item on any related timeline including the discovery of the DNC hack by weeks months (see edit below, this was initially found in March), the release of any documents by months, Manafort joining he campaign by months, Carter Page's trip to Moscow by months, etc. It would also appear to be during the period that Fusion GPS was still being paid by the Washington Free Beacon as that ran basically until Trump clinched the GOP nomination at the end of May.

ETA:

This apparently violation of minimization procedures was discovered on March 9th, 2016 which really pushes it out of the timeframe. There's a second violation cited and that second violation seems to involve the installation of some sort of analytical tool by an IT contractor working for a different federal agency.



It appears that the violation of minimization procedures in this second instance was (page 86):

*redacted* however, is not a federal agency and the *redacted* personnel who worked with the information were "not directly supervised by or otherwise under the direction and control of *redacted*"

What seems to be discussed here is the installation of some sort of data access tool for an unnamed government agency, conducted by a contractor. It would be interesting if this turned out to be Palantir. And since the employees of the contractor were not federal employees, any access to any data would have had to be under the direct supervision of that agency.

Potentially concerning stuff but there's nothing here pointing to anything involving Fusion GPS, the Trump campaign, the dossier, the FISA warrants, etc.

Funny thing about contractors and the FBI.

Contractors have the same exact access as the FBI employees whom they work with.

Say a contractor decides to become a FBI employee and applies.

They fail the process and are deemed unsuitable for employment.

You would think that obviously, they would be dismissed from their contracting position that allows them the same access.


Nooooooooooooo.... they just stay on as a contractor.


Been there, seen it happen.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Good sleuthing! Those violations indicate that the DOJ (FBI?) was not being overseen properly when Loretta Lynch was running things.