UFO Existence 'Proven Beyond Reasonable Doubt,' Says Former Head Of Pentagon Alien Program

a reply to: Aazadan

OMG Boba Fett has arrived on earth, maybe Trump or Kim has a bounty on his head coz that thing looks like Slave1 lol

originally posted by: charlyv
It is Unidentified Aerial Phenomena now, and I like that because it carries a lot less baggage.
Even so, no mention of Extraterrestrials or vehicles, as those definitions require physical proof.

What we have are anomalous fast moving, appearing, disappearing, hovering, illuminated atmospheric phenomena that appear intelligently controlled.

Possibilities:

-Military dark projects
-GeoPhysical energies
-Us in the future, visiting.
-Dimensional entities
-Spiritual beings
-Probes from and extraterrestrial source
-Aliens in vehicles from and extraterrestrial source.

One or more of the above will probably be correct, but disclosure is still as elusive as ever.

The things you list I would agree on too friend. The us visiting from the future is sure one I have pondered too and think quite possible. Hence our ability to not make contact yet, as to make contact could cause problems with that. Hence us not being ready, I guess we would not be ready until that point.

Probes also, very likely. Probes that are already here.

So I may of missed it. But where is the proof if it has been proven beyond all reasonable doubt?

Proven means proof exists yes?

Isn't that how proven beyond reasonable doubt works in a court? That there is undeniable physical evidence that anyone can witness, and that no one is capable of denying?

Be great when we stop getting hearsay, opinions and potato cam photos and get some actual evidence even blind freddy could not doubt.

It's the one common thing I have noticed on this subject over the decades. We always hear of the proof and that there is no doubt, but still to this day not a single person who claims to know the truth has given anything to verify any of their claims.

Do I believe other life exists in this or any other Universe/Dimension other than that on Earth? I sure do.
Do I believe anyone has ever released any real evidence to verify this? No.
And I honestly, and sadly, doubt I will ever see any in this life time.

Eye witness testimony alone will never cut it for me regardless of the topic.

originally posted by: charlyv

This one might be believable in part.
Why do some of these nutjobs pick Venus.
Has to be a nasty place.

The language seems a bit tricky too!

originally posted by: charlyv

This one might be believable in part.
Why do some of these nutjobs pick Venus.
Has to be a nasty place.

Ill just place this Here

1968
Ice caps on venus?
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
or
science.sciencemag.org...

The measurements by Venera 4 of the equatorial surface temperature indicate that the microwave readings were high, so that the polar ice caps may be allowed to exist in the face of the 10-centimeter readings of polar temperature. Life seems to be distinctly possible at the edges of the ice sheets

and NASA Site!

2004
Was Venus Alive? 'The Signs are Probably There'
By Henry Bortman, Astrobiology Magazine Managing Editor | August 26, 2004 07:00am ET
www.space.com...



2008
The North Pole of Venus
www.nasa.gov...

Although the size and mass of Venus are similar to the Earth, its thick carbon-dioxide atmosphere has trapped heat so efficiently that surface temperature usually exceeds 700 kelvins, hot enough to melt lead.

2016
Venus Express' dying moments rewrite what we know about the planet: Probe reveals the poles are colder than anywhere on Earth and covered by 'atmospheric waves'

Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk... ic-waves.html#ixzz52RqJyMv5
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
www.dailymail.co.uk... ic-waves.html

Esa's Venus Express probe gathered data during its last few months
The planet's polar atmosphere is up to 70°C colder than expected
Atmosphere at the poles is also much less dense than predicted
Polar region was found to be dominated by strong atmospheric waves

So WHOS is BS.ing WHO?

a reply to: Wolfenz

2016
Venus Express' dying moments rewrite what we know about the planet: Probe reveals the poles are colder than anywhere on Earth and covered by 'atmospheric waves'

Yes. The lower reaches of Venus' thermosphere (at 130-140 km above the surface) are colder than anywhere on Earth.

The broader significance of these differences is that the assumptions of solar zenith angle symmetry underlying VTS3 are too simplistic for high latitudes, where other factors such as winds may lead to polar temperatures in the lower thermosphere being cooler than expected from solar forcing alone.

www.nature.com...

So WHOS is BS.ing WHO?

You tell me. Your source:

When Dr Müller-Wodarg and colleagues gathered their observations, Venus Express was orbiting at an altitude of between 81 and 87 miles (130 and 140 kilometres) near Venus' polar regions, in a portion of Venus' atmosphere that had never before been studied.

source

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Wolfenz

2016
Venus Express' dying moments rewrite what we know about the planet: Probe reveals the poles are colder than anywhere on Earth and covered by 'atmospheric waves'

Yes. The lower reaches of Venus' thermosphere (at 130-140 km above the surface) are colder than anywhere on Earth.

The broader significance of these differences is that the assumptions of solar zenith angle symmetry underlying VTS3 are too simplistic for high latitudes, where other factors such as winds may lead to polar temperatures in the lower thermosphere being cooler than expected from solar forcing alone.

www.nature.com...

So WHOS is BS.ing WHO?

You tell me. Your source:

When Dr Müller-Wodarg and colleagues gathered their observations, Venus Express was orbiting at an altitude of between 81 and 87 miles (130 and 140 kilometres) near Venus' polar regions, in a portion of Venus' atmosphere that had never before been studied.

source

well apparently they are not getting all the fact of Information,
then again we are talking about NASA .
I guess time will tell hopefully in my life time


Although Venus has a thick Canopy.. it wasn't always like that...

just tales of Mythology, that our own Earth had a Canopy..
not so much Evidence we had that . if it were plausible.

could there be life on Venus near the poles or Mars ?

just bacteria single-celled organisms

but hey, an Outpost for Major Sentient Life for sure
leaving Earth undisturbed by them .

is more likely ... Right

thats what Man from Earth was planing too do on the Moon and Mars ..
since the 60s.

a reply to: Wolfenz

well apparently they are not getting all the fact of Information,

You have more reliable sources, I'm sure.

What is surprising to me we haven't got a sign of anything was hidden for 50 years. Is American ufology just stories and they're not there at all to disclose? Seems to me this will blow over soon and people will be back to thinking lights are UFOs with aliens in them. If they got exotic materials Bigelow should be parading this stuff and the media would be wall to wall coverage discussing this nonstop. Debunkers will have a field day if the best evidence we produce from this a 30-second video.

originally posted by: Aazadan
Thought I would post this one. It's not every day a mainstream site quotes government officials saying we've got actual UFO's out there.

www.newsweek.com...

So... They confirm that there are things flying around that we have no idea what is.

UFO has always been, and will always be, nothing more than unidentified objects that happen to fly.

Yet most of the people will most of the time insist it means "Extraterrestrial Woo-Hoo Space Hopper".

a reply to: mortex
a reply to: BlackProject

Even though they are not saying aliens or vehicles, it is a real important stake in the ground. I think we all know they are vehicles of some kind, and who is in them is the billion $ question. I think it is going to come out soon, but I still have reservations about the impact. There are still a lot of crazies on this planet that just do not function well on revolutionary news.

The US government's program may have been doomed from the start by them contracting Robert Bigelow to gather and evaluate the data. The evidence the program should be opened up for evaluation, but we should be prepared to jettison whatever Bigelow had to say about it.

Here's my recent piece on the reporting on the story and some of the issues the media has yet to consider while hyping it.
UFOs, the Media, the Military & Dreams of Discovery

Still waiting for that proof beyond reasonable doubt here.

Is not proven beyond all reasonable doubt the topic here? Or are we doing the usual ATS thing of discussing everything and anything but that?

Topic "Hey here's an article on subject A."
Reply 1. "Here's some pictures totally unrelated to subject A."
Reply 2. "Here's some discussion about Unicorns."

User "Here's a logical question about subject A?"
Reply 1. "Here's some crickets"
Reply 2. "Here's some stuff related to subject B. Which is similar but totally unrelated to subject A."
Reply 3. "Here's an answer to every question not related to subject A."
Reply 4. "I have zero hard proof, but my father owned a government contracted company. I'll say crazy # and you'll believe it, agree with me otherwise here's some insults.."
Reply 5. "here's something that will get me stars and flags but not actually further the cause. Because that is what matters in life. pixels!!!!."

I still cannot see where this is proven beyond a reasonable doubt, all I see is one guys opinion, and a billion other peoples opinions on that opinion.

Or is a blurry planes 2 seconds of camera footage with what appears to be a cockroach in the middle of it, and some sounds like it's dubbed in audio track all we need for proof of reasonable doubt.

Oh well, someone from the government said stuff. It must be true. No one from the government is human and would ever lie to us now would they.......
Who needs proof of something proven beyond a reasonable doubt?
Nope, not me.

I feel it's been clearly proven that UAP/UFOs are real, and it even appears the government may be opening up to this fact.
My question, what are they? Who's inside?

They seem to be intelligently controlled, so from what I can come up with only gives so many options.
1) Aliens from somewhere in our known universe
2) Human's traveling from the future to our timeline
3) Intelligent beings traveling from an outside dimension into ours (like sticking your head into a pound filled with fish, who have never seen such a thing as something from outside the water).
4) Black Ops/Black Project tech from some country
5) The Nazi's really did make it to Antarctica and have some pretty fancy tech
6) Some hidden intelligent species on earth (Atlantis, Peoples from the center of our earth, etc.)

To me, any of the above seems amazing and reality changing. I don't particularly care which it is, but would love as much information possible about any of the above. Would be the most amazing discovery in human (at least recent) history I can imagine.

Not sure why we get so stuck on what the specific cause, and not dedicating ourselves to the search for the answer. Any of these would be amazing. With the possible exception of being a black project. That drives other questions such has how they work, who's are they, and why can't this be public and change our daily lives to it's potential.

~Winter

Oh well, someone from the government said stuff. It must be true. No one from the government is human and would ever lie to us now would they.......
Who needs proof of something proven beyond a reasonable doubt?
Nope, not me.

No one, not even the governments of countries with the tech, may have proof beyond any doubt. I am also fairly certain if this was fabricated, the government would have spoken out by now. So I believe those to be unedited, original footage. I suppose the head of the department that studied this phenomena and the pilot who saw the object could both be lying.. and the government isn't saying so? Naw.. don't think so.

As far as your comment.. proof beyond a reasonable doubt, that's exactly the terminology used by Elizondo to describe what they discovered.

But unless aliens land and shake hands with a world leader, I imagine some will never believe. Because there will always be the "super secret black project" excuse to fall back on.

originally posted by: fleabit
I am also fairly certain if this was fabricated, the government would have spoken out by now.

What is it that makes you so certain they would?
Many governments have a proven long history of denying, lying, fabrication, disinformation and keeping secrets from not just the world but their own people.

I am certain that kind of crap still goes on today.

I am happy to be proven wrong. Would love to be proven wrong and be shown without a doubt not made by man vehicles exist.

Just as you would expect the government to state something if it was all made up, is not the opposite also true, in that if claims involving anything within the government are true, would they not verify it just as readily?
I may of missed it. Where are all the officials backing this guy up and saying "yep, we got dem UFO's messing about"
Even if they do not know what these things are?

Lou Elizondo is basing all these 'revelations' on a report he found that was originally created within government channels as a joke.

Some if what he's saying is true--but inclusion of those truths are designed to give credence to the other 'facts' that he created for this little adventure ('venture', actually). Adding a germ of truth to any story increases the veracity of the complete assertion. For instance, if you're going to lie to the teacher and claim your dog ate your homework--it strengthens your case if you actually have a dog at home.

Full government disclosure is not the driving force here. It's business. This little group of ex-government officials, along with Tom Delonge, are teamed up to create media buzz. This is nothing more than a money-making opportunity. They're already selling hats, tee shirts, and charging speaking fees to appear and present their "insights."

There's a huge market for this sensationalized conspiracy stuff, and social media is the *perfect* marketing tool for it. When a person can supply to meet demand, thar's gold in them thar hills. It's entrepreneurship, capitalism, and The American Dream.

Cheers and happy new year to all.

Double post!

originally posted by: CardDown

The US government's program may have been doomed from the start by them contracting Robert Bigelow to gather and evaluate the data. The evidence the program should be opened up for evaluation, but we should be prepared to jettison whatever Bigelow had to say about it.

Here's my recent piece on the reporting on the story and some of the issues the media has yet to consider while hyping it.
UFOs, the Media, the Military & Dreams of Discovery

Hiya, Card. Good to have your knowledgeable take on this, Sir!

Excellent article and breakdown. Everyone should clicky!

a reply to: The GUT

i concurs well written article