Airliners And F-15s Involved In Bizarre Encounter With Mystery Aircraft Over Oregon

originally posted by: Woody510
Are you thinking the communications were being listened to and when they realised the F15s were heading towards they were told to stand down?

Yes, as Sammamishman suggested, they decided they were drawing too much attention and stealthed up and called in daddy LOL

originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: FredT

Military or demonstration bird that found out he was drawing too much attention and retracted any radar reflector, changed altitude to out side contrail height and effectively disappeared to all concerned.

Maybe... it was testing its own signature, monitoring the aircraft chatter in the air corridor and the radar on the ground as it adjusted its return 'profile'.

Could it have been another nations stealth air asset?

Although I concur it was man made, there was another scenario where' unknown' objects buzzed an alaskan aircraft, under the same conditions.

The military ground tracking station even chimed in.

"...intermittent primary return in trail, in trail, I say again..."

a reply to: FredT

Must be something quite far in to development if there were no chase aircraft?

Maybe heading North to Alaska for cold weather testing?

As for why the F15s "couldn't find it", I tend to agree with the one reddit poster. They probably took too long to get airborne and simply didn't proceed to the right area. You would think our air defense would be more effective, especially after the failures on 9/11. But it's still sketchy. Information being communicated between agencies (FAA to DoD) gets jumbled and confused, especially when you're trying to do it quickly, and despite what you see in the movies we don't get fighters in the air at the drop of a dime. The pilots have to get in, do some preflight, taxi, etc. Someone like Zaph could give more details on everything they have to do. I was just a fuels guy. My point though is it's not like they constantly have guys in planes sitting at the end of the runway to take off. This all takes time.

a reply to: face23785

I know the RAF Qra can be from Lincolnshire to London in about ten minutes.

Worth a watch face of you have 20 minutes

originally posted by: Woody510
a reply to: FredT

Must be something quite far in to development if there were no chase aircraft?
Maybe heading North to Alaska for cold weather testing?

Great way to test a new Platform with some real world data. Scramble some F-15s late for show. Whatever it was it sounds like it works.

originally posted by: Woody510
a reply to: face23785

I know the RAF Qra can be from Lincolnshire to London in about ten minutes.

The straight-line distance between those 2 cities is 100 miles. Even if they left the moment they got the call, which is impossible, conveniently took off in the direction of London, and could get up to speed instantly, they'd have to fly at 600 miles an hour to make it in 10 minutes. Your interceptors are gonna do that in a combat configuration?

Whoever told you that didn't know what they were talking about.

a reply to: face23785

I added a video in an edit above you'd be surprised how quickly they get airborne and they can be given permission to go above the speed of sound so it's not that impossible to believe. Plus they're an interceptor if they couldn't go above 600mph they'd be useless.

a reply to: Woody510

I watched it. I have an idea what they do, I was stationed at one of the US's alert bases while I was in the Air Force. I'll admit I was a little too dismissive, so I'll apologize if I came across as an ass. My point was that, the entire notification process and getting them in the planes is the part people don't take into account. I did a little reading on the Typhoon. It can supercruise at mach 1.2 with a combat load. So yes I was mistaken to blow off the 600 mph talk. However, even at mach 1.2, it would take 6 minutes to fly from that RAF base to London. And that's without taking into account that you have to accelerate and gain altitude to fly at that speed, so in reality it would take longer than 6 minutes. That leaves less than 4 minutes to receive the notification, run out to the planes, get the rest of your gear on (you're already wearing some), taxi and take off.

In a real world scenario, from the time you have a non-responsive aircraft to the time interceptors actually reach it, it would be longer than 10 minutes. That's all I was trying to get across in regards to the incident this thread is about. It takes longer than people think to launch the F15s.

originally posted by: FredT
So both the FAA and NORAD are now confirming that there was indeed a mystery aircraft sighted over the Oregon and California border on October 25, 2017. Civilian airlines were able to visiualy track the aircraft which was not transmitting ADS-b nor TCAS but rather was being tracked by Oakland Center with their primary radar (which was intermittent) at FL35-40. F-15 were scrambled from the 142 squadron, but it unclear why they did not intercept it.
ATC Chatter:
archive-server.liveatc.net...

Speculation that it was a drug flight IMHO is nonsense. Drug dealers are criminals but not stupid. To fly that high in controlled space would be stupid. Also, it was faster than the 737 that were near it.

Were the F-15 told to RTB as it was a drone or other shadowy airframe. But it was not stealth and it was flying in the the day time.

Perhaps a drone got away and they are trying to keep it quiet?
www.thedrive.com...

Curious about this as I am in Oregon. One night not long ago, there was an aircraft that I watched traverse the night sky, and was visible for quite some time. It piqued my curiosity because the lights on the aircraft weren't what I normally see, and there's a lot of air traffic in my area due to the municipal airport/national guard.

The aircraft I saw had one extremely bright, intermittent, flashing white light on the bottom of it. Bright enough that it lit up almost the entire belly of the aircraft (light was on the bottom.) No other visible lights from what I saw, and I watched it the entire time it was visible. It was traveling straight north to south, no deviation in its flight whatsoever. I believe I messaged Zaphod to see if he could identify it from my description but I never recieved a response.

I wish the light on it was just a tad bit brighter, or that it was at a lower altitude because I couldn't quite make out the size or shape of it. It was traveling fast, and I easily watched it for at least 5 minutes until it was out of my field of vision. I also do not remember the date that it happened. I want to say it was before Oct 25, but I cannot be 100% sure.

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Woody510
a reply to: face23785

I know the RAF Qra can be from Lincolnshire to London in about ten minutes.

The straight-line distance between those 2 cities is 100 miles. Even if they left the moment they got the call, which is impossible, conveniently took off in the direction of London, and could get up to speed instantly, they'd have to fly at 600 miles an hour to make it in 10 minutes. Your interceptors are gonna do that in a combat configuration?

Whoever told you that didn't know what they were talking about.

I would give Woody the benefit of the doubt and watch his video. The Eurofighter Typhoon could easily cover that distance in 10 mins even spending 5 mins on the ground. Full afterburner at Mach 2 would take 4 mins.

originally posted by: Craigmkd

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Woody510
a reply to: face23785

I know the RAF Qra can be from Lincolnshire to London in about ten minutes.

The straight-line distance between those 2 cities is 100 miles. Even if they left the moment they got the call, which is impossible, conveniently took off in the direction of London, and could get up to speed instantly, they'd have to fly at 600 miles an hour to make it in 10 minutes. Your interceptors are gonna do that in a combat configuration?

Whoever told you that didn't know what they were talking about.

I would give Woody the benefit of the doubt and watch his video. The Eurofighter Typhoon could easily cover that distance in 10 mins even spending 5 mins on the ground. Full afterburner at Mach 2 would take 4 mins.

I already addressed this. See the post a few after the one you quoted. It can't fly mach 2 in a combat configuration.

I wonder if anyone would be willing to work up a transcript, with timestamps, of the relevant transmissions on those 2 tapes (only one is linked in the OP, but both are linked in the article the OP links to) for those of us who are pilot/ATC illiterate?

a reply to: face23785

I agree in the interceptor configuration it wouldn't hit mach 2 but between 1.5-1.7 for an short burst may be feasible.

a reply to: face23785

i have seen it done, its quite impressive, two jets in combat readiness sit off of the runway, the shout goes out they are in the air within a few minutes (strap, start, and gone) then if the intercept allows supersonic transit. Used to watch them get out of Leuchars before moving north to Lossie. They were damned quick leaving, especially when the Bears and the badgers came calling, they even pulled up on a few blackjacks to.

100 miles at supersonic is somewhere under 5 minutes and the Tyhpoon can climb at 318 m/s at full burn

Typhoons

Brakes-off to Take-off acceleration: < 8 sec
Brakes-off to supersonic acceleration: < 30 s
Brakes-off to Mach 1.6 at 11,000 m (36,000 ft): < 150 s

a reply to: Woody510

Normal supercruise is Mach 1.5 fully loaded

a reply to: weemadmental

Generally they're at Alert 15, but can be airborne a lot faster than that. The 15 posture gives them the ability to do things other than sit in the cockpit.

a reply to: face23785

This video has a shorter version of the atc communication, all the silences are removed. Audio starts at 47 seconds.

originally posted by: weemadmental
a reply to: face23785

i have seen it done, its quite impressive, two jets in combat readiness sit off of the runway, the shout goes out they are in the air within a few minutes (strap, start, and gone) then if the intercept allows supersonic transit. Used to watch them get out of Leuchars before moving north to Lossie. They were damned quick leaving, especially when the Bears and the badgers came calling, they even pulled up on a few blackjacks to.

100 miles at supersonic is somewhere under 5 minutes and the Tyhpoon can climb at 318 m/s at full burn

Those numbers just don't add up.

The Typhoon is capable of supersonic cruise without using afterburners (referred to as supercruise). Air Forces Monthly gives a maximum supercruise speed of Mach 1.1 for the RAF FGR4 multirole version,[165] however in a Singaporean evaluation, a Typhoon managed to supercruise at Mach 1.21 on a hot day with a combat load.[166] The Eurofighter Company states that the Typhoon can supercruise at Mach 1.5.

So 1.2 is a realistic speed to expect. The distance between the base and London is 100 miles. Do the math. It works out to 6 minutes, and as I said in a real-world scenario you have to factor in the time it takes to climb and accelerate so it would actually be more than 6 minutes. In addition to the notification and launch time, the 10 minutes claim is an exaggeration. 15 is probably more realistic. And yes I realize I'm splitting hairs here.

a reply to: FredT

This wasn't day time. It was early evening at least. The pilots are saying "good evening"and "good night". This might have been right at sunset, but it wasn't day time.