Science: No Such Thing as Race!

originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
There are biological differences in bone structures, etc. How do you think they can tell race by the skull and other things, when a bones are found?

We all have our differences. Celebrate that. In the end though we are not so different, on a cosmic level.

What you are explaining is the basics and dumbed down version of how evolution works and isolated populations have different physical traits.

Genetically and molecularly we are all the same.
Race was a made up term during the ages of exploration. It only stuck around because science had to catch up and prove the idea was false.

As some has already said it's more of a political slang now days to just get straight to the point that this person isn't white, or brown, or black or what ever, that they must be of another race.

Racism itself, the idea that human beings can be divided along lines of "race", is a superstition. Two tall men of different races are more similar to each other than a short and tall man of the same race.

Then why do all different colored people act/live so different?

I disagree with "science".

That's false. If you raise a child born in Madagascar in Denmark, he will act/live like the Danish.

Yeah, one of my useless college degrees is in Sociology, and we learned pretty quickly that the whole notion of "race" was foggy when it was first introduced and has become even more irrelevant since so many different ethic varieties have moved around and interbred all over the world.

I guess that if you really wanted to hate somebody you could hate them for some kind of genetic haplotype they have, but that seems pretty silly.

This is a subject that comes back again and again.

I did a thread on it some time ago www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
That's false. If you raise a child born in Madagascar in Denmark, he will act/live like the Danish.

Exactly. Check out the interview in this clip, starting around 3:09 minutes:

originally posted by: GetHyped

originally posted by: Jefferton
Then why do all different colored people act/live so different?

I disagree with "science".

This thing called "culture". But disagree with reality you want, I guess.

Ummm...cool...a Yoda-ism...

Correct you are...untruthful you are not...

I loves me some Yoda-isms...






YouSir

a reply to: StallionDuck

Awesome, so we can automatically expect everybody in America to set aside their unscientific superstitions and their unproductive/dangerous activities and behaviors and abide by what accepted scientific knowledge and consensus tells us?

Amazing.

So, along with race we can do away with anti-abortion activism, global warming denial, creationism, anti-vaxxers, etc.?

I’m sure you have your explications of how we can all leave those nonsicial beliefs coming up in future essays, right?

Awesome!

originally posted by: Gryphon66
I’m sure you have your explications of how we can all leave those nonsicial beliefs coming up in future essays, right?

To paraphrase somebody much smarter than myself: "Progress is made one death at a time."

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: Gryphon66
I’m sure you have your explications of how we can all leave those nonsicial beliefs coming up in future essays, right?

To paraphrase somebody much smarter than myself: "Progress is made one death at a time."

Personally, I would love it if OP’s “thesis” were accurate. Come, let’s look at the matter scientifically and see what the data tells us. Let’s stop believing in the non-existent and start following rationality in our lives.

Of course that’s not how it works, and neither is the simplistic “there is no biological basis for race” claim accurate.

The OP’s article from “Science Alert” points to one study that reviewed the relationship of genetic markers to skin color.

Guess what the conclusion was? We all have genetic markers that determine our skin color. Shocker, no?

Therefore, we can just ignore 6000 years or so of history and culture that does recognize differences based on skin color, culture, religion, etc. etc.

I wish.

Funny, for me I didn’t have to have a set of genetic markers tell me that people are just people, and should be treated the same regardless of any characteristic they have. That’s the idea of equality that so many here still have such issues with.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Biology and genetics is black and white, there is no grey area. It either is, or isn't we don't have strange alien DNA floating around in our species gene pool.

I see what you're saying, but you are trying to fight for keeping the 'race' card. When in reality, we are all humans who have different cultural and ethnic backgrounds. Calling someone else from "that race" of people, tells me that it's become a more than just identifying their physical appearance but it insinuates they are either inferior or superior because of their skin color alone, never mind where they come from, where they grew up, what traditions they follow from what ever culture.

What if a brown person was born in say Wales, third generation, but grew up as a Muslim, has dark skin, etc, etc. Are you going to base judgement off their skin color? Guess you'll just ignore they are a citizen, follow the laws, grew up with friends and went to school, what have you.

That's when racism comes into play. And science needs to be at the forefront to battle it. Because we all know what happens when a them and us mentality gets out of control, and we are witnessing it right now in today's world, again.
It turns into tribal politics.

a reply to: StallionDuck

But...but... I'm a Neo-Marxist...I mean a Justice Warrior. My whole world view falls apart if I can't stick everyone into arbitrary groups (as defined by me, "race" being huge) and then hyperventilate over who is oppressing whom! If I am not allowed to convolute and conflate language, it's a micro-aggression!

//sarc off//

Minor genetic variation does not a "race" make. All humans are the same species. They all differ a little bit but so does every other species on the planet.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Gryphon66

Biology and genetics is black and white, there is no grey area. It either is, or isn't we don't have strange alien DNA floating around in our species gene pool.

I see what you're saying, but you are trying to fight for keeping the 'race' card. When in reality, we are all humans who have different cultural and ethnic backgrounds. Calling someone else from "that race" of people, tells me that it's become a more than just identifying their physical appearance but it insinuates they are either inferior or superior because of their skin color alone, never mind where they come from, where they grew up, what traditions they follow from what ever culture.

What if a brown person was born in say Wales, third generation, but grew up as a Muslim, has dark skin, etc, etc. Are you going to base judgement off their skin color? Guess you'll just ignore they are a citizen, follow the laws, grew up with friends and went to school, what have you.

That's when racism comes into play. And science needs to be at the forefront to battle it. Because we all know what happens when a them and us mentality gets out of control, and we are witnessing it right now in today's world, again.
It turns into tribal politics.

Indeed, from my last paragraph, anyone should be able to tell that I'm not in favor of racial discrimination. That you choose to refer to the matter as "the race card" gives a pretty good indication of the narrative that you're ascribing to.

Generalizations that "we are all humans" is just fine. It doesn't begin to address the history of racism in this country, the racism that blatantly exists at this moment among many, nor the long and short term effects of racist beliefs.

I can't speak to your "what if" scenarios as they are basically extended loaded questions.

Racism exists and it exists around the world. Pretending that it doesn't isn't going to make it go away.

Working to overcome beliefs and entrenched inequities AND educating people as individuals and as cultures will contribute to the eventual reduction of the phenomenon.

Pointing to one study that makes the statement that eleven or so genetic markers determine the level of melanin will not. I take no joy in pointing that out.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Therefore, we can just ignore 6000 years or so of history and culture that does recognize differences based on skin color, culture, religion, etc. etc. I wish.

Help me out. Does this imply skin color equates with culture or religion when it comes to history?

If so, please expound.

a reply to: StallionDuck

If it is okay to judge a person, to define a person by the color of their skin instead of by the content of their character, then it must be okay to judge a woman by the size of her boobs.

After all, it is just another physical characteristic.

originally posted by: ABNARTY
a reply to: Gryphon66

Therefore, we can just ignore 6000 years or so of history and culture that does recognize differences based on skin color, culture, religion, etc. etc. I wish.

Help me out. Does this imply skin color equates with culture or religion when it comes to history?

If so, please expound.

There is zero implication in my comment. History abounds with references to cultures that recognized any number of differences between individuals and peoples and made political decisions (usually related to domination, conquest and slavery) based on those they found inferior.

Making a determination that other is inferior due to skin color/hair texture is referred to generically as racism.

As far as religion serving as a factor ... the Romans persecuted the Christians, when the Romans became Christian they persecuted the pagans, the Muslims attacked and destroyed their own pagans, Christians attacked Muslims, Muslims attacked Christians ... and almost everyone hated the Jews.

As far as clashes between "cultures" ... the Greeks are a perfect example .... classifying anything that was non-Greek as "barbarian" (which continued into the Roman period).

Is that what you were asking?

a reply to: Gryphon66

Therefore, we can just ignore 6000 years or so of history and culture that does recognize differences based on skin color, culture, religion, etc. etc.

I wish.

I agree with you about the race aspect. We could never ignore the tribalism centered around "race", and how it was used to foment hatred and oppression. Any superficial phenotype, such as skin color, is not an adequete indicator of anything save for what one's parents may have looked like.

As for religion, culture, etc. I disagree. Some are manifestly better than others.

Then again, we won't be able to banish the superstition of race by continuously evoking it. Positive discrimination, for instance, is just as racist as negative discrimination and for the exact same reasons.

There is no such thing as races..

We are the one human race.

If a Japanese women and Inuit man mate a human is born.

There are no sub species of human..

Race is a concept made by man to cause division.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Gryphon66

As for religion, culture, etc. I disagree. Some are manifestly better than others.

I wasn’t commenting on relative quality, merely that religious and cultural differences are used much like race to divide.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Gryphon66

Positive discrimination, for instance, is just as racist as negative discrimination and for the exact same reasons.

You’d have to be more specific here.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Gryphon66

As for religion, culture, etc. I disagree. Some are manifestly better than others.

I wasn’t commenting on relative quality, merely that religious and cultural differences are used much like race to divide.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Gryphon66

Positive discrimination, for instance, is just as racist as negative discrimination and for the exact same reasons.

You’d have to be more specific here.

You’re very right. Tribalism is a dangerous mindset. You can hear the death of civilizations when hearing people thinking with their race or clan.

Examples would be affirmative action or race-based college applications. It’s institutional racism.