Comet C/2017 K2: Hubble Spots Rare Visitor from Oort Cloud

originally posted by: Blue Shift
I'm still not entirely convinced that there is such as thing as an "Oort Cloud," and I'm not aware of any proven mechanism by which a comet -- certainly not a single comet -- in it might be sent sailing out of it on a long elliptical solar orbit. Well, gravity perturbations, of course. Eh. Prove it.

Well, all those long-period and hyperbolic comets we've been observing must come from somewhere. Either there is indeed a cloud of comets gravitationally bound to the Sun, or they just randomly traverse the interstellar space and happen to end up flying through the inner Solar System.

a reply to: wildespace

they just randomly traverse the interstellar space and happen to end up flying through the inner Solar System.

It's late so...

I'm still not entirely convinced that there is such as thing as an "Oort Cloud," and I'm not aware of any proven mechanism by which a comet -- certainly not a single comet -- in it might be sent sailing out of it on a long elliptical solar orbit. Well, gravity perturbations, of course. Eh. Prove it.

You have to remember one thing. Any object in a solar orbit that far out is going to be moving extremely slowly. That being the case, it would only take a relatively gentle gravitational perturbation from a passing star to rob the object of ALL of its orbital velocity. This would effectively stop the Oort Cloud comet in its tracks, and the result would be a "sun dive". Of course, those gravitational perturbations from stars could just as easily accelerate a comet in the Oort Cloud, and eject it into interstellar space.

We have to wait years for this one!

Dang

originally posted by: Mogget
You have to remember one thing. Any object in a solar orbit that far out is going to be moving extremely slowly. That being the case, it would only take a relatively gentle gravitational perturbation from a passing star to rob the object of ALL of its orbital velocity. This would effectively stop the Oort Cloud comet in its tracks, and the result would be a "sun dive". Of course, those gravitational perturbations from stars could just as easily accelerate a comet in the Oort Cloud, and eject it into interstellar space.

Interesting theory, which I have never seen proven for any specific comet. What we have then is a possible mechanism by which a hypothetical comet might be pulled out of a hypothetical cloud of space debris. Science?

BAD EDIT

a reply to: SeaWorthy

Interesting

Jewitt said that NASA's James Webb Space Telescope, an infrared observatory scheduled to launch in 2018, could measure the heat from the nucleus, which would give astronomers a more accurate estimate of its size.

www.nasa.gov...

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: Mogget
You have to remember one thing. Any object in a solar orbit that far out is going to be moving extremely slowly. That being the case, it would only take a relatively gentle gravitational perturbation from a passing star to rob the object of ALL of its orbital velocity. This would effectively stop the Oort Cloud comet in its tracks, and the result would be a "sun dive". Of course, those gravitational perturbations from stars could just as easily accelerate a comet in the Oort Cloud, and eject it into interstellar space.

Interesting theory, which I have never seen proven for any specific comet. What we have then is a possible mechanism by which a hypothetical comet might be pulled out of a hypothetical cloud of space debris. Science?

The existence of the Oort cloud is a direct result of planetary disc mechanics, as described in various mathematical models based on Relativistic physics. This, in addition to the aforementioned fact that those comets have to come from somewhere. Here's a post that captures the details a bit better.

From: www.reddit.com...

There are several points of evidence that the Oort Cloud exists, though it is indeed still a hypothesis and lacks direct observation.
The first is indirectly observational, as proposed by Ernst Öpik back in 1932 as the source of long-period comets. This was revised by Jan Oort in 1950. All you need to determine an orbit is three observations of the object, separated in time. The greater the separation in time and the more observations, the more certainty we have in its orbit. Comets with periods longer than Pluto's must, by definition, have come from beyond Pluto. Pluto's orbit basically loosely defines the extent of the Kuiper Belt (30-50 AU).
So there needs to be a source for these bound objects, and interstellar ones don't cut it because if they're interstellar, then they should not be on bound orbits.
The second is theoretical: Solar system formation models predict that the formation of the giant planets would have scattered small icy objects into the outer solar system. While some would be given enough energy to completely escape the solar system, others would be scattered out to the hypothetical Oort Cloud.
Third, we've seen Kuiper Belts around other star systems, and it's likely that the Oort Cloud is a continuation of the Kuiper Belt, so this may be evidence for Oort Clouds as well.
So if we need a source for long-period comets and the orbits work out to this cloud beyond the Kuiper Belt, dynamical models predict that the bodies would exist there, and we see similar dynamical structures around other stars, then that's fairly compelling evidence it exists.
But, you are correct that, at present, it is not technologically possible to view comets that are members of the Oort Cloud that are still in the Oort Cloud. Viewing a chunk of ice 1/4 of the way to the nearest star is simply not possible ... yet. "

a reply to: Dudemo5

Solar system formation models predict that the formation of the giant planets would have scattered small icy objects into the outer solar system.

I guess rocky objects and even small planets too.
I have a hard time understanding how they see objects outside our system with all the debris in the way. Especially when they get such really great pictures.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: Dudemo5
I have a hard time understanding how they see objects outside our system with all the debris in the way. Especially when they get such really great pictures.

Space is big. Really big. "All the debris in the way" is more like a handful of dust particles in a room.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

On forth the blue kachina marches.....

originally posted by: Aeshma
a reply to: SeaWorthy

On forth the blue kachina marches.....

It is beautifully blue at least at this point in these pictures! Chinese space station falls and shortly after a blue star, misquoted as it will be making people believe the two objects are the same one. Of course, shortly would have to be 5 years...

The ninth and final sign of destruction is described by White Feather as, "You will hear of a dwelling-place in the heavens, above the earth, that shall fall with a great crash. It will appear as a blue star. Very soon after this, the ceremonies of my people will cease.

a reply to: SeaWorthy
The blue colour was added in the picture, the original image is black-and-white. hubblesite.org...

The comet would most probably look greenish due to diatomic carbon (C2) sublimating off its surface. www.slate.com...

a reply to: SeaWorthy

And that five years, can't come soon enough. I'm keeping an eye on this one.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

Thanks worth a bump for sure, looks like the trajectory is perpendicular to the orbital plane of our solar system so it may not affect things too much.

Worth keeping an eye on though.

originally posted by: wildespace
a reply to: SeaWorthy
The blue colour was added in the picture, the original image is black-and-white. hubblesite.org...

The comet would most probably look greenish due to diatomic carbon (C2) sublimating off its surface. www.slate.com...

Thanks can you link where they say it has been tinted blue? I can't find that info on your link or elsewhere and when I look at the full-size original here it is still blue. Not that it matters that much but they always show it blue everywhere I look.
www.spacetelescope.org...

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
A Very unusual and extremely interesting visitor that will be on its closest approach 14 Jul 2022. Interestingly the coma is not in the form of a tail and a large coma like this has never been seen so far out from the sun where it is still very cold. It is coming from the Oort cloud they say but I would think this would mean more objects would possibly coming with it.
I wonder if the coma will be interacting with earth when it nears the sun.

C/2017 K2 (PANSTARRS), or ‘K2,’ was discovered on May 21, 2017 by the Panoramic Survey Telescope and Rapid Response System (Pan-STARRS) in Hawaii.

Slightly warmed by the remote Sun, K2 has already begun to develop an 80,000-mile-wide fuzzy cloud of dust, called a coma.

“K2 is so far from the Sun and so cold, we know for sure that the activity — all the fuzzy stuff making it look like a comet — is not produced, as in other comets, by the evaporation of water ice,” Dr. Jewitt explained.

Based on the Hubble observations of K2’s coma, the astronomers suggest that sunlight is heating frozen volatile gases — such as oxygen, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, and carbon monoxide — that coat the comet’s frigid surface. These icy volatiles lift off from the comet and release dust, forming the coma. “I think these volatiles are spread all through K2, and in the beginning billions of years ago, they were probably all through every comet presently in the Oort Cloud,” Dr. Jewitt said.

www.sci-news.com...

This illustration shows the orbit of K2 on its maiden voyage into the Solar System. Hubble observed tis comet when it was 1.5 billion miles from the Sun, halfway between the orbits of Saturn and Uranus. The farthest object from the Sun depicted here is the dwarf planet Pluto, which resides in the Kuiper Belt, a vast rim of primordial debris encircling our Solar System. Image credit: NASA / ESA / A. Field, STScI.
Closest approach can be seen here
theskylive.com...

The site lists it's close approach distance as being 1.8 astronomical units with an astronomical unit being the distance from the sun to the earth.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
A Very unusual and extremely interesting visitor that will be on its closest approach 14 Jul 2022. Interestingly the coma is not in the form of a tail and a large coma like this has never been seen so far out from the sun where it is still very cold. It is coming from the Oort cloud they say but I would think this would mean more objects would possibly coming with it.
I wonder if the coma will be interacting with earth when it nears the sun.

C/2017 K2 (PANSTARRS), or ‘K2,’ was discovered on May 21, 2017 by the Panoramic Survey Telescope and Rapid Response System (Pan-STARRS) in Hawaii.

Slightly warmed by the remote Sun, K2 has already begun to develop an 80,000-mile-wide fuzzy cloud of dust, called a coma.

“K2 is so far from the Sun and so cold, we know for sure that the activity — all the fuzzy stuff making it look like a comet — is not produced, as in other comets, by the evaporation of water ice,” Dr. Jewitt explained.

Based on the Hubble observations of K2’s coma, the astronomers suggest that sunlight is heating frozen volatile gases — such as oxygen, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, and carbon monoxide — that coat the comet’s frigid surface. These icy volatiles lift off from the comet and release dust, forming the coma. “I think these volatiles are spread all through K2, and in the beginning billions of years ago, they were probably all through every comet presently in the Oort Cloud,” Dr. Jewitt said.

www.sci-news.com...

This illustration shows the orbit of K2 on its maiden voyage into the Solar System. Hubble observed tis comet when it was 1.5 billion miles from the Sun, halfway between the orbits of Saturn and Uranus. The farthest object from the Sun depicted here is the dwarf planet Pluto, which resides in the Kuiper Belt, a vast rim of primordial debris encircling our Solar System. Image credit: NASA / ESA / A. Field, STScI.
Closest approach can be seen here
theskylive.com...

The site lists it's close approach distance as being 1.8 astronomical units with an astronomical unit being the distance from the sun to the earth.

a reply to: MissSmartypants

The site lists it's close approach distance as being 1.8 astronomical units with an astronomical unit being the distance from the sun to the earth.

Yeah I know, we will see in a few years.

Interesting number 12-21-22

inclination i = 87 . 6 , and a perihelion passage on UT 2022 December 21

PDF

www2.ess.ucla.edu...