This is how I know I am going to burn in Hell

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: CreationBro

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: dfnj2015
This is how I know I am going to burn in Hell

My sense of humor did it for me.

What's Hell like?

I hear it's pretty indistiguishable from summertime Los angeles.

Actually, it's more like living in New Jersey.

My question was rhetorical as you already know, but Jersey? That bad huh?

There are a lot of bad areas, whether done so by people or otherwise. Funny thing is, the good areas can often be such a hop skip and a jump away from those nastier places.

They say "make the best of a bad situation".

True to a degree I suppose, but some areas can be pretty unforgiving, or simply don't jive well with some people. All depends.

Anyway, on the topic of Hell. I've heard some say it is a timeless void, a prison of sorts. Total and complete isolation for the sentenced soul. Not sure if eternity applies, if its timeless. Perhaps a cosmic "rehab" center for disobedient souls.

Another theory I have come across is that the punishment is to constantly relive the same life, over and over, until the soul finally does it "right".

Interesting I'd say. Couldn't tell ya for sure.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
I try to be reverent but my brain comes up with really terrible thoughts. If you accept that Jesus did miracles then Jesus is not really a human being like you or me. And if you accept Jesus is God, then since you cannot kill God, then Jesus did not really die on the cross. Since Jesus rose again after 3 days he didn't really die in the first place. It was more like a 3 day death timeout.

And since Jesus was able to do healing miracles, did he ever actually experience any physically suffer during his crucifixion. Again, I'm really not trying to be irreverent. But my brain takes me to places where I have these weird thoughts with regards to logical consistency.

Did Jesus actually die for our sins?

Jesus before He died was a Power from Father/Source inside the vessle known as the human body which is designed with nerves that experience sensations such as pleasure and pain. One example:

Mark 5:30 ►

At once Jesus realized that power had gone out from him. He turned around in the crowd and asked, "Who touched my clothes?"

Later, Jesus standing as a Power source made it to the tree of life/cross. He was laid out on it. It was similar to the tree with the "apples" that was said by God not to be eaten from but Adam & Eve did and in doing so they now knew good and evil and had to deal with all that those things involved.

Some people call evil, sin. That "apple" tree, knowing the consequences of good and evil is a "stage" of advancement/enlightenment. The NEXT stage of advancement/enlightenment is the cross/tree provided by the SPEAKER POWER from God Source in the human vessle known as Jesus and to settle matters of good and evil within you - as the kingdom is within. Jesus said those matters within you can't be divided, just like a house divided falls apart or evil can't drive out evil. So in the age of enlightenment we are in from the "apple" tree, the next level up is the cross/tree that we all CAN eat from. We are not forbidden from doing so. It's a big "yes, please do." It's about loving God, yourselves and others. Sounds so easy and it maybe was for some, who really knows, but once eating from this tree, eating the bread and drinking from the Jesus Christ tree/cross, most of us find it really hard to fully advance in as it becomes the narrow path as small as an eye of a needle, trying to access it, and many give it up as the evil one keeps many weighted down, BUT faith itself is enough to sustain and keep eating from it, to keep going and follow Jesus because faith activates that "mustard seed" (those seeds are super tiny,) of love for others, yourself and God. So one can keep going and moving up instead of spiraling down.

Jesus said to those listening to him that we are his MOTHERS, brothers and sisters. That's your family, you're His family. One sister or brother is not "greater" than the other, God in Jesus loves us all.

The thief who confessed to Christ on the tree/cross Jesus was laid out on, BEFORE Jesus died, He said to him 'Today you will be with me in Paradise."

Before our Lord died. Not after our Lord died. This is textual biblical proof He didn't have to do it this way, "dying for our sins." In addition to that, faith in the text is proof by mere faith, although faith is not really mere to the faithful, it is POWERFUL; mere to those who have little.

"The thief's conversion is sometimes given as an example of the necessary steps one must take to arrive at salvation through Christ: awareness of personal sin, repentance of sin, acceptance of Christ and salvation's promise of eternal life. Further, the argument is presented that baptism is not necessary for salvation since the thief had no opportunity for it. However, in some church traditions he is regarded as having a baptism of blood."

en.m.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: dfnj2015

He is one with the father, he who see's me see's the father, he said it himself, no one come's to the father but by the son.
Yes he died on the cross, while he is Jesus he is also both the holy spirit and the father in heaven, the son was word - spirit of God - manifest as flesh upon this earth and yes angels have been known to manifest time and again but this was something quite different you see Jesus not only manifest he did so through a woman, went through the whole cycle from crying babe to full grown man and is actually a MAN albeit a man made of the substance of God, all the nerves the blood and the flesh the same as any healthy human being, all the sensation and even our limited brain, he even begged the father in the garden to lift the cup of woe he had to drink but accepted the father's will for the Father is supreme and while one with Jesus is also a separate being that Jesus actually worship's.

When he was scourged he felt that pain and it was real pain, the pain of a healthy man with all his nerves working, he felt the suffering as he was forced and whipped dragging the tree through the streets, he felt the thirst, the pain, the betrayal emotional and physical yet as he died he cried to the FATHER to forgive us for he knew as he said WE KNOW NOT WHAT WE DO, I shall forgive them what they do not know.

Islam is false the work of Satan so do not be tempted to follow the blind into there hole, they are not the Goats' at the lord's left as some have tried to excuse them either, if you can not understand then there is only one person to teach you, ask God himself, pray if you can or just ask with all you are for him to show you.

Of ask your mother to pray for you.

When Jesus saw His mother and the disciple whom He loved standing nearby, He said to His mother, “Woman, here is your son.” 27Then He said to the disciple, “Here is your mother.” So from that hour, this disciple took her into his home. 28After this, knowing that everything had now been accomplished, and to fulfill the Scripture, Jesus said, “I am thirsty.”

This disciple was the archetype Christian, Christ died for all of us he so loved his father, he is one with the father yet seperate and the father so loved us that he gave his son in our place (We still have to repent and accept the blood of christ).

Because Christ is Spirit made flesh when he made the bread and wine his flesh and blood it was not just ceremony he actually imbued himself upon them but he is a sentient God not a blind act of nature, in fact he created nature in the first place so he know's whom he will take unto himself and who is just eating the wafer and drinking the wine for the sake of it.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: ElectricFeel
a reply to: dfnj2015

God is ONE.

"Remember the former things, those of long ago; I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me."

Isaiah 46:9

"Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
And there is none like unto Him."

Quran, Chapter 112

Yeah but he Koran, come on, some muslims kill people for questioning it
What is your god scared of, people questioning it


Jesus was before creation, its your human mind that cant grasp the concept of the Trinity

Yes, the Trinity.

“I and the Father are one” (John 10:30) Jesus is claiming He is one with Father. Equal to Him. Jesus is not claiming to be a messenger or prophet of God like in Judaism or islam where it is clear in their belief that Moses says he is one and Mohammed says he one. Jesus says He's one with the Father. Even the Quran itself states that. Their messages do not equal freedom. Jesus's does.

In both Judaism and Islam blasphemy was, a crime punishable by death according to their laws. When Jesus asked the Jews why they were planning to kill Him, they answered, “For blasphemy, because you, being a man, make yourself God” (John 10:33). Then right after that; in 34, Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’ 35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside.

For those whom Jesus Christ is Lord, we know that the only blasphemy is against the Holy Spirit and the only evil/sin that can't be forgiven.

"The sin of the religious leaders, blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, was a refusal to accept the witness of the Holy Spirit to who Jesus was and what He had come to do, and then submit their lives to Him. Jesus said concerning the Holy Spirit, “When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment” (John 16:8)."

billygraham.org...

originally posted by: dfnj2015
If you accept that Jesus did miracles then Jesus is not really a human being like you or me. And if you accept Jesus is God, then since you cannot kill God, then Jesus did not really die on the cross.

You are not being asked to choose between the two options.
The teaching of the church has always been that Christ is both God and man. As a man, of course he could die.
That is why I dislike and never use the slightly misleading slogan "Jesus is God".

a reply to: LABTECH767

I have been watching your posts for some time and it is this post that I am now sure you are truly a child of God. Without stroking your pride I want to tell you that I KNOW....you might not but I do.... you have met God before in this life ....probably in a lucid dream BUT maybe....just maybe you met one of them also in person. I know this because very few know....what the the trinity true is. You accurate description was shown to you, you did not figure this out on your own. Yahweh, Yeshoua, and Holy Spirit are one.....identical looking like triplets..... and yet all three are one.

I have met God on more than one occasion, just like many others have. Why he chose to visit me, I do not know. My guess is he knew how much it would mean to me and how it would change my life for the better.

Jesus was involved in making Adam and Eve....it was HIM who blew into Adam's nostrils and made him alive. Jesus made mankind from dust and returned to "buy back" or yet "PAY" the debt for those people who have repented and accepted him as Christ and savior based upon prophecy and his fulfillment of the OT prophecies.

There is ONLY one way to God (The Father) and it is through Yeshua (Jesus) - He who will judge ALL mankind - living and dead - KING of KINGS, LORD of LORDS, the only savior for mankind, The Father's first creation, his beloved Son to whom he has been given the keys to heaven, earth and hell - life and death. REASON WHY ALL OTHER RELIGIONS ARE FALSE. ONE WAY ONLY .......like a one way street ..... much narrower than a two way street - for the path to God is a narrow path....easy to fall off.

My biggest fear is not a burning hell with punishment but God rejecting me for who I am, Having my creator look at me in the eyes and tell me that he wants nothing to do with me would be too much for me to bear.

I can feel it..... like many of you.....I do NOT belong here on this planet .... separated (a barrier between me and heaven) from my God.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
I try to be reverent but my brain comes up with really terrible thoughts. If you accept that Jesus did miracles then Jesus is not really a human being like you or me.

Jesus was wholly God and wholly man.

But He claimed to do what He did through the Holy Spirit and that we, who follow Him, would do greater things.

And if you accept Jesus is God, then since you cannot kill God, then Jesus did not really die on the cross. Since Jesus rose again after 3 days he didn't really die in the first place. It was more like a 3 day death timeout.

His physical body was tortured to death.

The Roman soldiers would not have allowed a living man to be taken down from the cross.

And since Jesus was able to do healing miracles, did he ever actually experience any physically suffer during his crucifixion. Again, I'm really not trying to be irreverent. But my brain takes me to places where I have these weird thoughts with regards to logical consistency.

On the cross, Jesus mouth dried out extremely and although he refused drugged wine, He did accept a second drink of cheap sour wine. The dryness of mouth is a symptom of organ failure. If He noticed a dry mouth, I'm pretty sure he noticed the pains of His ordeal.

Did Jesus actually die for our sins?

Yes, without doubt.

originally posted by: CreationBro
Yikes.

Seems like a good time for a vegan agoraphobe though.

His diet consists of arugula, bottled air and tissues. No meat for chubs these days.

Bla, bla, bla, JESUS, JESUS, JESUS. People are not thinking about the original question. You can't kill God. So Jesus never really died. You can't have it both ways and be logically consistent.

RE: "I and the Father are one” (John 10:30)

I am one with Fantasy Football. It's a figure of speech not physical manifestation. If you accept Jesus is God it has consequences. God cannot die. There's no other way to put it.

a reply to: dfnj2015
"You are not being asked to choose between the two options.
The teaching of the church has always been that Christ is both God and man. As a man, of course he could die.
That is why I dislike and never use the slightly misleading slogan "Jesus is God"."
My answer still holds good. You are creating an artificial and unnecessary difficulty. Nobody is denying that Jesus is a man (I once wrote a thread on the subject), so he was as vulnerable to death as anybody else.

Hell.....that 4 letter word created by man for man to hold man down using fear. There is no such place as hell, the only place it exists is in your mind. Same as heaven.

a reply to: dfnj2015

Yes, He did. The same way you or I will.

Jesus had a body just like we did, and He had a soul as a man just like we do.

He is God and was man.

Do you think His body didn't somehow feel all the same agonies, fears, and doubts ours did? Do you think that because He was in the flesh that He was immune to all that entails? No. He had to undergo the whole experience, including the death of that body. He died.

The flesh is a powerful tether, and it's the biggest stumbling block in our time here. In order to become the perfect sacrifice for us to reconcile us to the Father, Jesus had to live and overcome all the same things we try and fail to overcome ourselves. So, yes, He was both God and man.

a reply to: dfnj2015

Bla, bla, bla, JESUS, JESUS, JESUS. People are not thinking about the original question. You can't kill God. So Jesus never really died. You can't have it both ways and be logically consistent. RE: "I and the Father are one” (John 10:30)

Jesus said: according to Apostle John

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
-------------------------------------------------
Jesus said: according to the same Apostle John

John_20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
--------------------------------------------------

Your same author has just confirmed that Jesus did die and that He was not The Most High EL as He was Jesus. Have you considered that the mystery of the Christ is not revealed to any of us? We only think we know ---

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: dfnj2015
"You are not being asked to choose between the two options.
The teaching of the church has always been that Christ is both God and man. As a man, of course he could die.
That is why I dislike and never use the slightly misleading slogan "Jesus is God"."
My answer still holds good. You are creating an artificial and unnecessary difficulty. Nobody is denying that Jesus is a man (I once wrote a thread on the subject), so he was as vulnerable to death as anybody else.

Let's be very precise. As I said in the original post, if you accept Jesus did miracles, then Jesus was NOT a "man" like you an me. Are you able to perform the same miracles? So if Jesus was able to perform miracles then he is not a man in the normal sense. I have not met anyone in my life who was able to heal the blind using special powers.

I am not creating an artificial and unnecessary difficulty. You just are ignore simple logic on purpose. Something cannot be two things at the same time. If Jesus was "both God and man" then Jesus was not just a man. Men die. God's rise from the dead. Men do not rise from the dead after 3 days. You cannot kill God, therefore, Jesus never died on the cross. No harm, no foul.

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: dfnj2015

Bla, bla, bla, JESUS, JESUS, JESUS. People are not thinking about the original question. You can't kill God. So Jesus never really died. You can't have it both ways and be logically consistent. RE: "I and the Father are one” (John 10:30)

Jesus said: according to Apostle John

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
-------------------------------------------------
Jesus said: according to the same Apostle John

John_20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
--------------------------------------------------

Your same author has just confirmed that Jesus did die and that He was not The Most High EL as He was Jesus. Have you considered that the mystery of the Christ is not revealed to any of us? We only think we know ---

You people are just blind idol worshipers because words have no meaning for you. How can Jesus be one with the Father but also have to ascend? One implies he's already one with the Father. Ascend implies Jesus is separate from the Father. It's simple words with simple meanings.

I think Jesus was a Jewish Rabbi and was a man. I think the story we read in the Bible is made up stuff by men. You have to suspend intelligence to accept it's truth.

a reply to: ketsuko

Jesus did not die. He rose 3 days later so he lived.

originally posted by: openyourmind1262
Hell.....that 4 letter word created by man for man to hold man down using fear. There is no such place as hell, the only place it exists is in your mind. Same as heaven.

I agree. Fear is a tool used to motivate and control the weak minded.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
a reply to: ketsuko

Jesus did not die. He rose 3 days later so he lived.

So then Lazarus was not a man?

There are a few accounts of people who had died living again thanks to Christ in the Bible. Lazarus is only the most famous.

According to you, none of those people died either.

Or else, you accept a miracle for those people, but you refuse to accept one in the person of Christ. Why would that be?

And upon thinking for a bit, it occurs to me that rejecting this greatest miracle of all is the one that keeps you from accepting salvation. It's the belief in the greatest miracle - the resurrection - that brings salvation. All things are possible through God, including that greatest of miracles and gifts.

You want to fall back on Islam because you are limiting God but I thought it was a tenant of Islam that all things are possible for God. Why would this one thing not be?

originally posted by: dfnj2015
So if Jesus was able to perform miracles then he is not a man in the normal sense. I have not met anyone in my life who was able to heal the blind using special powers.

Miracles happened through other people in the Bible. God did the work.

Something cannot be two things at the same time.

This is a rule which you have created to suit your own argument. That is what makes the objection artificial.
You have no authority to say that it's impossible

Men die. God's rise from the dead. Men do not rise from the dead after 3 days. You cannot kill God, therefore, Jesus never died on the cross. No harm, no foul.

As a man, he died. In the power of God, he was raised from the dead.
You are still making arbitrary rules to suit your own purposes, and as such they have no value in debate.

Look, I've just invented an arbitrary rule of just the same kind which states that "dfnj2015 can never be right in an argument." This rule proves that you must be wrong.

a reply to: dfnj2015

Let's be very precise. As I said in the original post, if you accept Jesus did miracles, then Jesus was NOT a "man" like you an me. Are you able to perform the same miracles? So if Jesus was able to perform miracles then he is not a man in the normal sense. I have not met anyone in my life who was able to heal the blind using special powers.

John_14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

The same author (Apostle John) now tells us that there would be other humans that could do the same as Jesus did and even greater that He did.

Does that mean that they are also gods and not die?