At 200,000 acres, 'very extreme fire behavior' seen in Lodgepole Complex

originally posted by: saabster5
Lodgepole Complex

300 personnel so far. Type 2 management team already in place. Looks like it is getting the attention it needs. More than likely will go to a type 1 management team. When that happens they will get highest priority for firefighting resources. Type 2 still gets priority for personnel/equipment.

In all honesty, Smokey bear and put out all fires has led to the extreme fire behaviors seen in the West. Unhealthy forests caused by terrible stewardship have made most if not all national forests ticking time bombs as far as extreme fire behavior is concerned.

Anyway, hope you stay safe up that way.

I thought about your post and thought about it and thought about it and just got angrier and angrier. You have no idea what you are talking about. These people DO NOT have enough support. You can Type one and Type 2 management and talk out your ass all you want to, it sounds good but it is not even close to the reality.

This is typical of what has been going on on Facebook all day.

"PLEASE!!! Urgent, __________________ and _______________ went down to _________ ranch this morning to take food/supplies. they are right now using the phone to call me. The _____________________ pastures are literally burning up, fire coming from all directions. The only people working on it are LOCAL with 4 pumpers. ANY BLM that they have talked to say this isn't their jurisdiction and can not help them. They are out of options and need help!! also please note, they do not know personally any of the BLM they have seen. We all know locals are doing everything they can and more so please no nasty PM's."

I took out names and locations for privacy reasons. But this is what is going on. Desperate people, who are on their own because the professionals working the fire are overwhelmed and spread too thin.

Mosby may be a lost cause. Someone was panicking earlier and was pretty sure Jordan was in serious trouble. These are entire towns that may be lost to this fire. It is 0% contained and is only growing. It most certainly does NOT have the "attention it needs" so STFU, you clueless know-it-all.

If you are in the business of fighting fires or public safety it is morons like you that are the reason why this thing isn't getting the attention that it needs.


I don't know where you are getting your information but there are not "300 personnel" on that fire. They hope there will be soon because they are starting to call people in. How dare you minimize this when you have no idea what is going on. I want to slap you.

Current info

Crews and engines have begun arriving from Ohio, West Virginia, Missouri and New York and the hope is that they will soon have 300-500 firefighters working to control the blaze.

Shame on you.

a reply to: redhorse

Is lodgepole in Canada? That's what the map shows me when I look.

Is the fire in Montana near Lincoln where the ongoing earthquakes are at?

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: redhorse

Is lodgepole in Canada? That's what the map shows me when I look.

Is the fire in Montana near Lincoln where the ongoing earthquakes are at?

No, not Canada. This fire is in Garfield County Montana.

Not near Lincoln.

Rumor has it. Hope it's true.

a reply to: redhorse
Sorry to hear, I didn't have get a chance to check into what they were saying before replying, glad you clarified for your thread. I also do agree 300 people helping if it were true, and with these mass fires, more help is always needed.

a reply to: dreamingawake

According to the latest BLM information there are 215 people working that fire, not counting locals. They expect more on the way and they do say more people are coming in from out of state, but it is hard to say how many. There were never 300 people on that fire today or before today, and even if there were, that is not nearly enough, and it is certainly has not been addressed appropriately like saabster5 was trying to imply.

Winnett and Jordan fire departments are asking for donations for fuel. FOR FUEL! They have literally (and certainly figuratively) ran out of gas.

There was a rancher on Facebook who talked about how they went to try to get their brood mare band out of the way of the fire. About 20 mares, many with foals at side. They found em', on the edge of the fire. The horses ran out of the smoke and one of the colts was on fire. They were panicked and ran back into the smoke. Irretrievable. It's just heartbreaking.

This fire has burned approximately 220,000 acres. That is 340 square miles. That is a little better than 25% of Rhode Island.

As far as I know, Mosby and Jordan are still standing but this thing is a monster like no one has ever seen.

People minimizing this is what is causing the problem and I'm still so pissed at that poster for putting up that misinformation and nonsense, all for what? To look smart and like he's got a level head when he is almost certainly no where near this fire, or near Montana for that matter. He is talking completely out his a$$ and people are listening because he tried to make it sound like he knew what he was talking about with a little lingo.

I seriously want to kick the # out of him, and if he's too big, watch someone kick the # out of him. He deserves it.

a reply to: redhorse
Guessing just searched it up instead of looking more into it? I hope no deception, too much around these types of sites.

These fires bother me personally not only the people in danger and loosing everything but also of animals being so frightened, hard to help them in such a case. Yes, indeed, heartbreaking.

Recent news source says it's growing to 250,000 acres.
Source

"I've never seen one out here like this in my lifetime," said local rancher Skye Chamberlin, who owns threatened property in the Musselshell River valley. "It's just so dry. (The fire) does what it wants."

That should be a lesson to all of us to be careful in this very dry season(going on record for the Pac NW anyway would figure similar for MT?)

It only took 90 minutes for the fire to make that run, Olson said. He said that one local fire chief reported water and retardant did nothing to slow the fire -- something he'd never seen before.

There's soo many fires going on in the Pac NW now, which might be why the news isn't covering this one locally for me, which sometimes they do cover MT. I'm happy you shared this and really hope it helps out, even if just a few re-share it on social media or they find it on net searches, just a little can go a long way if more know about it. More attention should be given, of course. I wouldn't have heard of it as of yet-not in contact with some family at the moment including those that live in NW MT.

originally posted by: dreamingawake
a reply to: redhorse
Guessing just searched it up instead of looking more into it? I hope no deception, too much around these types of sites.

These fires bother me personally not only the people in danger and loosing everything but also of animals being so frightened, hard to help them in such a case. Yes, indeed, heartbreaking.

Recent news source says it's growing to 250,000 acres.
Source

"I've never seen one out here like this in my lifetime," said local rancher Skye Chamberlin, who owns threatened property in the Musselshell River valley. "It's just so dry. (The fire) does what it wants."

That should be a lesson to all of us to be careful in this very dry season(going on record for the Pac NW anyway would figure similar for MT?)

It only took 90 minutes for the fire to make that run, Olson said. He said that one local fire chief reported water and retardant did nothing to slow the fire -- something he'd never seen before.

There's soo many fires going on in the Pac NW now, which might be why the news isn't covering this one locally for me, which sometimes they do cover MT. I'm happy you shared this and really hope it helps out, even if just a few re-share it on social media or they find it on net searches, just a little can go a long way if more know about it. More attention should be given, of course. I wouldn't have heard of it as of yet-not in contact with some family at the moment including those that live in NW MT.

Thanks for staying interested and I hope you're right this will do at least a little bit to get the word out. I think the Pacific Northwest can be similar to Montana. I hope you guys aren't as dry as we are right now. Praying for rain right now. It's about all I can do.

It's personally tough because I know these towns. I know these people. I've known a lot of them since I was a kid. I played basketball against them in high school and partied with them. The edge of this fire is maybe 70 miles away from me. I can see the main smoke cloud from it and when the wind shifts that smoke keeps me in my house because of my asthma. While I think things would have to really go sideways for this fire to be a threat to us, at this point, I don't know, things keep going from one unbelievable to another.

A day closer to containment.

Lodgepole Complex

Monday, July 24 – 9:30 p.m. 250,000 acres – 20% Contained Firefighters were aided with more favorable weather on Monday, helping to increase the containment to 20%.

Current Situation
Total Personnel 611
Size 250,000 Acres
Percent of Perimeter Contained 20%
Estimated Containment Date Wednesday August 02nd, 2017 approx. 12:00 AM

It's slow and steady work. Can't have the entire nation respond in one day, although that's usually how long it takes to these kind of incidences when structures and towns are threatened. Not trying to minimize what's going on out there, just giving a view from someone who used to do this.

a reply to: redhorse

Happening in Southern France too:

news.sky.com...

A series of massive wildfires are raging across parts of southern France and Corsica, in areas popular with tourists. Up to 900 hectares of forest has been engulfed in flames, threatening homes on the island of Corsica, off the southern French coast. A further 860 hectares has been ravaged by a blaze in the Vaucluse department in the Provence-Alpes-Cote d'Azur region.

Add to this what happened in Portugal:

www.theguardian.com...

Wildfires that killed 64 people in Portugal have been brought under control, firefighters have said, as the government insisted it was still too early to say whether the disaster could have been handled better. Portugal’s worst forest fire broke out on Saturday in the central municipality of Pedrógão Grande before spreading to neighbouring areas including Góis, Pampilhosa da Serra and Arganil. Many of those who died were killed in their cars as they tried to flee the flames, which also injured more than 250 people. Portugal wildfires – in pictures View gallery The fire in Pedrógão Grande, which ravaged 30,000 hectares (74,000 acres) of forest, was only doused late on Wednesday after firefighters contended with searing heat and rapidly shifting winds.

Seems to have been pretty bad this year.

originally posted by: saabster5
A day closer to containment.

Lodgepole Complex

Monday, July 24 – 9:30 p.m. 250,000 acres – 20% Contained Firefighters were aided with more favorable weather on Monday, helping to increase the containment to 20%.

Current Situation
Total Personnel 611
Size 250,000 Acres
Percent of Perimeter Contained 20%
Estimated Containment Date Wednesday August 02nd, 2017 approx. 12:00 AM

It's slow and steady work. Can't have the entire nation respond in one day, although that's usually how long it takes to these kind of incidences when structures and towns are threatened. Not trying to minimize what's going on out there, just giving a view from someone who used to do this.

Oh Bull#. You said that the fire was getting attention that it needed, which, at that time was the opposite of the truth. You absolutely did tried to minimize.

At this point, people have responded and we have firefighters coming in from 34 states to help. Donations are pouring in, but in the meantime it's still out of control. I hope your report is correct, but everything I had said the thing was still 0% contained as of last night. I hope they're getting a handle on things. I hope your report is correct.

When you wrote that post, you were condescending, dismissive and misinformed and I still would like to kick your ass for trying to stymie my efforts to get information out just so you could feel big and special for a second. People desperately needed help that they weren't getting and you were trying to say that they were getting it.

a reply to: redhorse

Well it wasn't my intention to come across as any of those things you mentioned. Just wanted to give information from federal side of things. These reports are usually updated a couple times per day. The Incident Commanders send the information to the dispatch which get sent to the Geographic Area Command Center (GACC) which prioritizes the incident in order of resource allocation due to a number of factors. Structures lost bumps the incident higher on the list as well as life-threatening events. Response time for ordering resources is usually a day maybe two at the most. In two days, the Lodgepole complex went from 300 personnel to over 600, and there are probably more on the way. Shipping water tenders, dozers or other heavy equipment takes time because they are usually transported by low-boy, especially if it is an out of state resource (have to follow DOT procedures for rest times). Ordering hand crews can take a couple days to arrive, sometimes they get flown to the area, have to get a bus to transport them to the incident, have to check out tools and whatnot.

It sometimes is difficult to see the progress on these events. Having Inciweb has been a great tool implemented to let the general public know what is going on. When I first started fighting fire, there were basically zero tools for the public to know what was going on except for usage of a Public Affair Officer on a large scale incident. Nowadays that information is updated usually twice a day and anyone with internet access can find that info. It is unfortunate that the west has been hit by extreme temperatures this summer, especially when some areas had such a great winter/spring as far as moisture is concerned. But then again, that moisture usually means grasses are the thing that grows the most, which in turn makes the fire even more extreme when the summer months hit and temperatures and humidities drop significantly.

Anyway, hope it all works out up that way. I grew up in the region (Southern MT), and travelled to many different towns to do wrestling meets and whatnot, so I know some of the area that is being impacted. It's unfortunate that the fires can't be put out with the wave of a wand, but on the other hand, when the fire is gone, the recovery from it will be quite spectacular. Flowers and grasses will start popping up within a few weeks, and within five years, the shrubbery will start showing up as well. Yeah it is harmful at the moment to the livestock and all that, but the livestock will absolutely be loving the abundance of grasses next year!

originally posted by: saabster5
a reply to: redhorse

Well it wasn't my intention to come across as any of those things you mentioned. Just wanted to give information from federal side of things. These reports are usually updated a couple times per day. The Incident Commanders send the information to the dispatch which get sent to the Geographic Area Command Center (GACC) which prioritizes the incident in order of resource allocation due to a number of factors. Structures lost bumps the incident higher on the list as well as life-threatening events. Response time for ordering resources is usually a day maybe two at the most. In two days, the Lodgepole complex went from 300 personnel to over 600, and there are probably more on the way. Shipping water tenders, dozers or other heavy equipment takes time because they are usually transported by low-boy, especially if it is an out of state resource (have to follow DOT procedures for rest times). Ordering hand crews can take a couple days to arrive, sometimes they get flown to the area, have to get a bus to transport them to the incident, have to check out tools and whatnot.

It sometimes is difficult to see the progress on these events. Having Inciweb has been a great tool implemented to let the general public know what is going on. When I first started fighting fire, there were basically zero tools for the public to know what was going on except for usage of a Public Affair Officer on a large scale incident. Nowadays that information is updated usually twice a day and anyone with internet access can find that info. It is unfortunate that the west has been hit by extreme temperatures this summer, especially when some areas had such a great winter/spring as far as moisture is concerned. But then again, that moisture usually means grasses are the thing that grows the most, which in turn makes the fire even more extreme when the summer months hit and temperatures and humidities drop significantly.

Anyway, hope it all works out up that way. I grew up in the region (Southern MT), and travelled to many different towns to do wrestling meets and whatnot, so I know some of the area that is being impacted. It's unfortunate that the fires can't be put out with the wave of a wand, but on the other hand, when the fire is gone, the recovery from it will be quite spectacular. Flowers and grasses will start popping up within a few weeks, and within five years, the shrubbery will start showing up as well. Yeah it is harmful at the moment to the livestock and all that, but the livestock will absolutely be loving the abundance of grasses next year!

Once again, STFU. You are a disgrace. An absolute waste of skin. People like you are the reason why this thing is out of control.

Federal Government Refuses Aid

TextHELENA — U.S. government officials have rejected Montana’s request for aid in battling a group of wildfires that have been classified as the nation’s top firefighting priority.

I hope you choke.

a reply to: redhorse

And a good day to you. A bit of an overreaction I would say, but everyone is entitled to their opinions. If another perspective is not what you were seeking, then I'm not sure what else I can say. I'm not sure how someone who links information to an incident is at fault for everything going wrong, but I guess that's just how it goes. Hope cooler weather and a bit of moisture heads to those affected.

originally posted by: saabster5
a reply to: redhorse

And a good day to you. A bit of an overreaction I would say, but everyone is entitled to their opinions. If another perspective is not what you were seeking, then I'm not sure what else I can say. I'm not sure how someone who links information to an incident is at fault for everything going wrong, but I guess that's just how it goes. Hope cooler weather and a bit of moisture heads to those affected.

A. All of your information has been wrong. All of it.

B. I am trying to convey how dire the situation is and you are trying to downplay it.

C. No I am not interested in "another perspective" that is patently incorrect every. single. time. and counterproductive to actually informing people about just how bad the situation is.

So yeah... # off you useless piece of #. I am out here watching people that I grew up with lose everything that they have, watching everyone run themselves ragged trying to help and still make sure that we are protected in our community because of the fire risk here, and I'm literally choking on smoke. I can barely leave my house. It's a living nightmare and your all over there trying to play like people are just overreacting and this fire has all of the support it needs, and it's absolute bull#.

You come on out here and start talking this way in this town. You'll be headed to the E.R. within an hour.

Just an update.

Fire is out. We are finding horses and livestock from the fire all the way over here. No telling who some of these animals belong to. One of the local vets put the word out trying to find who owned a nice paint filly that was found and had to be put down for her injuries.

Such a mess still.