Banking Industry IT Systems Hanging On A Thread.

This is nothing. The whole banking system has been hanging on a thread for the past 15 years. This is the result of massive IT outsourcing. I worked at the senior level in the banking industry for over 6 years in more than 3 banks, and I can tell you that the only reason that something like this hasn't happened before is pure luck. There have been many, many other IT problems that have happened that the public has not seen that the banking industry has hidden from the public where they have been very lucky that they have been able to contain it.

This is not a hack or a security issue. It is a direct result of outsourcing IT to totally incompetent programmers who work from overseas. Mainly South Asia, yes India.

You should all be prepared for a big IT banking crash one day. I'm not kidding here. I programmed a lot of this stuff, and I can tell you that the outsourcing being done results in programming code that is like a teenager wrote it.

I can only speak of Canada of course, since this is where I have been working.

www.torontosun.com...

www.cbc.ca...

I work closely with many of the banks in the northeast US, directly with their IT staff.
Very little outsourcing, but very few competent IT staff, too...

originally posted by: lordcomac
I work closely with many of the banks in the northeast US, directly with their IT staff.
Very little outsourcing, but very few competent IT staff, too...

Outsourcing has been rampant here in Toronto, and has been for the past 15 years. Most of the code I have seen that has been written by the Outsourced programmers, mostly from India, is like stuff you learn from the the back of a PC magazine. I have had co-workers who have lost their jobs where they were making $50 an hour to Indians who just came into Canada who are working for $20 an hour. But their code is childlike. Immigration here is a joke. You can pretty much walk right in and get permanent residence status, (a Green card in the US.)

IT is a nightmare now because everyone expects to have everything in the world and have it work perfectly, while management, instead of acting based on reality, are only interested in making themselves look important by saving money or starting projects, whether they're feasible or not.

I work at an oil company and we just outsourced all our email servers to microsoft. We have had infinite problems and bad performance as we force everyone to change over to Office 365. And of course they all want to have dozens of folders, thousands of emails, and big shared mailboxes and expect everything to work fast and perfectly, while IT is often understaffed and overworked.

originally posted by: CB328
IT is a nightmare now because everyone expects to have everything in the world and have it work perfectly, while management, instead of acting based on reality, are only interested in making themselves look important by saving money or starting projects, whether they're feasible or not.

I work at an oil company and we just outsourced all our email servers to microsoft. We have had infinite problems and bad performance as we force everyone to change over to Office 365. And of course they all want to have dozens of folders, thousands of emails, and big shared mailboxes and expect everything to work fast and perfectly, while IT is often understaffed and overworked.

Ha, so true. I can't tell you how many times I have had a manager come through, try to implement a system that never works, then leaves in the middle as it is failing. I'm sure they then go onto another job and do the same thing. But because they leave in the middle of a system that they implemented, that never worked, they are never at fault. Then the rest of us are left to do the clean up, and a lot of the time blamed for the system's failure.

a reply to: CB328

Understaffed, overworked, underpaid...

Living the dream

Are you guys new to the Industry? Outages happen across the Internet all the time.

I'm not sure what all the commotion is about.

a reply to: Starbuck799

If there is a problem in Canada, would it be safe to assume that it would be contained?

a reply to: Starbuck799

Can you give more details? You mention outsourcing IT but then you talk about programmers which are a totally different division.

In the US, our banks, and more broadly the financial sector in general hires the best of the best. Wells Fargo has a very good CS division, Goldman does too. Then there's the quants and trading firms which are well known for having zero tolerance for f-up's. Literally only the best of the best can get into those places.

I don't see how anyone incompetent could do those jobs, they're far too competitive, and they're often resilient against out sourcing since you need access to the physical machines in production environments to test code since it all comes down to writing things in ways that can shave fractions of milliseconds off of existing runtimes.

originally posted by: seasonal
a reply to: Starbuck799

If there is a problem in Canada, would it be safe to assume that it would be contained?

The problem is with the Interac system, so it could be Worldwide.

a reply to: Starbuck799

That is what I was afraid of. One system gets violated and they can gain access to more secure systems-kind of a stepping stone of sorts?

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: Starbuck799

Can you give more details? You mention outsourcing IT but then you talk about programmers which are a totally different division.

In the US, our banks, and more broadly the financial sector in general hires the best of the best. Wells Fargo has a very good CS division, Goldman does too. Then there's the quants and trading firms which are well known for having zero tolerance for f-up's. Literally only the best of the best can get into those places.

I don't see how anyone incompetent could do those jobs, they're far too competitive, and they're often resilient against out sourcing since you need access to the physical machines in production environments to test code since it all comes down to writing things in ways that can shave fractions of milliseconds off of existing runtimes.

It's all about money here. Testing is pretty much non existant. If managers can lower the IT budget by hiring low pay immigrant so-called programmers for the length of the project, they will. If the project runs for a while with little problem, the project is deemed a success. But it's when the system gets a real workout where the big problems come up. Usually by then the managers and outsourced programmers are long gone.

originally posted by: Starbuck799
...
I can only speak of Canada of course, since this is where I have been working.

www.torontosun.com...

www.cbc.ca...

Oh, don't worry about the United States. Everything we do down here is just perfect. We'll never have any problems at all. We gots it all together!!!!

USA USA USA

WE'RE NUMBER ONE!

WE'RE NUMBER ONE!

originally posted by: seasonal
a reply to: Starbuck799

That is what I was afraid of. One system gets violated and they can gain access to more secure systems-kind of a stepping stone of sorts?

Like I said in an earlier post, this isn't a sercurity issue, it's a technical issue. I'm not sure if it is Worldwide, but the Interac system is Worldwide.

I've been suspecting and waiting for the "We have to have a bank holiday because we've been hacked by ___________" (fill in the blank: Russian hackers, Chinese hackers, Iranian hackers, ISIS hackers, disgruntled ungrateful American hackers, enraged and ignored Nigerian Prince hackers....)

When it happens, it will be a false flag to cover something a little deeper than computer hi-jinx. Yeah, I went there.

I have a kiddo that got a degree in IT, summa cum laude, but after a stint in the private sector and being horrified by it, she went DoD and her career and salary are taking off like a rocket. Just sayin'.....private sector IT has become somewhat nightmarish. Outsourcing IS an issue, as is H1B1 visas bringing cheap IT labor from Asia over to North America because they will take so much less than the natives will.

Too many cooks spoiling the pot, and Microsoft has more back doors than a whorehouse.

originally posted by: FissionSurplus
I've been suspecting and waiting for the "We have to have a bank holiday because we've been hacked by ___________" (fill in the blank: Russian hackers, Chinese hackers, Iranian hackers, ISIS hackers, disgruntled ungrateful American hackers, enraged and ignored Nigerian Prince hackers....)

When it happens, it will be a false flag to cover something a little deeper than computer hi-jinx. Yeah, I went there.

I have a kiddo that got a degree in IT, summa cum laude, but after a stint in the private sector and being horrified by it, she went DoD and her career and salary are taking off like a rocket. Just sayin'.....private sector IT has become somewhat nightmarish. Outsourcing IS an issue, as is H1B1 visas bringing cheap IT labor from Asia over to North America because they will take so much less than the natives will.

Too many cooks spoiling the pot, and Microsoft has more back doors than a whorehouse.

Well, you got that all pretty much right. But from what I have seen, the banks don't allow non-citizens to work any security code. Just normal transaction stuff. I wouldn't be worried about security, you should be worried about the banking system in general failing where you can't access funds for days, weeks, or longer.

Like what is happening right now. If you read the links in my OP, a lot of people can't pay their rent, cause they can't transfer funds to their landlords.

a reply to: Starbuck799

I would agree that the IT outsourcing to incompetent vendors is rampant across the entire class of industries, not just financial. I have seen it occur many times in my career. Not to name names, but on the biggest list. Sometimes it felt like some kind of vendetta to purposely wipe out some projects... other times, it was pure stupidity because no QA was done testing them out before letting them begin the project.

originally posted by: charlyv
a reply to: Starbuck799

I would agree that the IT outsourcing to incompetent vendors is rampant across the entire class of industries, not just financial. I have seen it occur many times in my career. Not to name names, but on the biggest list. Sometimes it felt like some kind of vendetta to purposely wipe out some projects... other times, it was pure stupidity because no QA was done testing them out before letting them begin the project.

Seen the same thing so many times, I can 't count.

That's what happens when you're running mainframes with tech from the 70s! COBOL needs to be put to bed....

We're are stuck with short passwords with no symbols to protect perhaps the most important account that we have...

a reply to: Starbuck799

Thoughts of a potentially lucrative consulting gig. Offer to be a front end "check out" for a company planning a big project "out there". Some nasty tests could weed out a lot of flak.