Swedish prosecutors drop Julian Assange rape investigation

a reply to: TrueBrit

Yeah, he struggled for some time and wouldn't when asked (I've heard it directly on the radio) specifically condemn the IRA when asked several times. Why is it relevant to this thread? I just thought he seems to decide to define his own idea of legality - it seemed quite appropriate.

However, now you've said that, you surely know full well that he and McDonnell have both been quoted praising terrorist groups, be they the IRA (McDonnell) or Hamas (Corbyn). Are you going to say that they never said such things? Are you going to say it was invented by the Conservative press? Please, go ahead, neither of the two gentlemen have ever denied it.

A Conservative Party member used to be a member of the IRA? That's very bad, but that's a member, I notice you don't say she is a councillor or MP so not sure what relevance that has - but fair point, if former membership of the IRA is sufficient for her to be expelled, then she should be. Mind you, former affiliation to any terrorist party should be an investigation into all parties, I wonder what they would find.

Actually, there is no more to discuss. You don't believe the theft and dissemination of classified material is a bad thing and couldn't in any way risk national security, I do. You think that by performing the dissemination Assange should be a hero in the UK, I don't. Not really anything else to discuss for me personally.

a reply to: uncommitted

You must have skim read my post, if you missed the part about Maria Gatland being the councilor for Croydon.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: uncommitted

You must have skim read my post, if you missed the part about Maria Gatland being the councilor for Croydon.

My apologies, I did miss that.

a reply to: uncommitted

Oh good it's about damn time you stopped arguing with us.

originally posted by: RisenMessiah
a reply to: uncommitted

Oh good it's about damn time you stopped arguing with us.

Riiight, slow day? I didn't realise I was addressing a collective. If you mean my responses to TrueBrit, I've agreed with and starred many of his posts, and we've conversed on subjects previously. There are two areas we obviously disagree on and I'm not shy on saying why, and he is not shy on stating his own thoughts. That's called mature debate as far as I'm aware.

Didn't actually realise you said anything I agreed or didn't agree with.

a reply to: uncommitted

Being uncommitted to you I really dont give a flying # what you think, but thank you all the same, kindly.

originally posted by: uncommitted
a reply to: TrueBrit

Theft? Stolen goods? I think not.

With the best of respect to you, what you think is immaterial. Can you please stop suggesting that just because you want something it should come to pass. Classified data being taken when the person taking it had signed statements to say they would not perform such an act, therefore it's theft. The stolen data is therefore stolen goods.

You can argue whatever you like, you are just stating your opinion.

And so are you just stating your opinion.

In the US today, they classify everything including toilet paper.

Assage, Manning, Snowden and many others behind the scenes expose the crimes of government. That makes them patriots.

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: uncommitted
a reply to: TrueBrit

Theft? Stolen goods? I think not.

With the best of respect to you, what you think is immaterial. Can you please stop suggesting that just because you want something it should come to pass. Classified data being taken when the person taking it had signed statements to say they would not perform such an act, therefore it's theft. The stolen data is therefore stolen goods.

You can argue whatever you like, you are just stating your opinion.

And so are you just stating your opinion.

In the US today, they classify everything including toilet paper.

Assage, Manning, Snowden and many others behind the scenes expose the crimes of government. That makes them patriots.

Of course I'm only stating my opinion, as you are stating yours, but at least I know how to spell Assange, and as he is an Australian, he can't be an American patriot. There's a desk at the back of the class with your name on it, I hope it's comfortable.

originally posted by: RisenMessiah
a reply to: uncommitted

Being uncommitted to you I really dont give a flying # what you think, but thank you all the same, kindly.

My response wasn't really to you, but thanks all the same.

a reply to: uncommitted

Well it depends upon how you look at it.
A breach of the law is, by definition a crime or a misdemeanour, however when the state that is making the law is behaving in a way that breaches its own laws and principals, which breaches the UN Human Rights convention, and is also directly harming its own citizens (as we saw with Iran Contragate when the CIA etc were caught out selling drugs within the US to generate a supply of black cash to spend on arming the Mujahadeen (who later morphed into Taliban, al Quaeda, and then ISIS) then we have a serious problem.
There are many situations in which the US has acted as a rogue state, and acting to oppose its laws at least enough to bring this fact to light shows the sort of courage and moral flexibility that make for a true hero.

The danger is, that as soon as you get locked into an its the law and we mustn't break it mentality you become vulnerable. Governments are always vulnerable to capture by special interest groups ( like "the 1%") and once a government is captured the "I MUST obey the law at all costs" mentality becomes a ticket to slavery.

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: uncommitted
a reply to: TrueBrit

Theft? Stolen goods? I think not.

With the best of respect to you, what you think is immaterial. Can you please stop suggesting that just because you want something it should come to pass. Classified data being taken when the person taking it had signed statements to say they would not perform such an act, therefore it's theft. The stolen data is therefore stolen goods.

You can argue whatever you like, you are just stating your opinion.

He is a true HUMAN patriot, and that transcends National boundaries.
From my perspective he is one of the smartest and bravest people of the post War period- he should be nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize.

And so are you just stating your opinion.

In the US today, they classify everything including toilet paper.

Assage, Manning, Snowden and many others behind the scenes expose the crimes of government. That makes them patriots.

Of course I'm only stating my opinion, as you are stating yours, but at least I know how to spell Assange, and as he is an Australian, he can't be an American patriot. There's a desk at the back of the class with your name on it, I hope it's comfortable.

a reply to: Barliman

So basically you seem to be suggesting two wrongs make a right? That's your opinion really isn't it? There's also then the further question - let's use Manning as an example. Manning stole classified data. Manning knew he had broken the law by doing so and admitted the fact when in court. Manning then handed data - unexpurgated - to a 3rd party either not comprehending or not caring that said data could include information which in the hands of someone who wished to do so (remember even if you think Assange is a saint, wikileaks isn't a one man band and I doubt anyone on here can vouch for all of its human resources) could cause lives to be compromised. That to me in itself is totally damning and looked at without prejudice is hard to condone.

Wikileaks then presumably carried out some level of redaction (based on what knowledge of what was and wasn't of extreme sensitivity?) and then released to the world with of course zero in the way of any context to what was presented. To me, yes, I can see where it is a criminal act. I'm not here to persuade anyone to agree with me, but at the same time I'm not here to defend my opinion.