Why Liberals Aren’t as Tolerant as They Think

a reply to: dfnj2015

Have you lost your ever-loving mind?

Are you tolerant of pedophiles?

How about ISIS?

Gonna give them a hug?

Jesus Christ!

I'm intolerant about things I don't like.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: dfnj2015

Have you lost your ever-loving mind?

Are you tolerant of pedophiles?

How about ISIS?

Gonna give them a hug?

Jesus Christ!

I'm intolerant about things I don't like.

And there are natural laws of man/womankind that we all nearly universally agree on. Pedophilia is bad. Terrorists are bad. Really, we all nearly agree on these things.

People who believe abortion is murder? I won't call them bad even though I am pro-choice.
People who believe that immigration laws should be enforced? I won't call them bad even though I am not very concerned about illegal immigrants.

I can see valid points that are contrary to mine, if i let go of my view long enough to consider those views.

I think you should be tolerant to people who have reasonable ideas, DBC, because I think it's beneficial to you and everyone else. But, I wouldn't want your thoughts/speech made illegal just because i have an opinion you might not have.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

Who said anything about making thoughts illegal?

There's a difference between listening to a different opinion and being forced by society to listen to idiots spew stupidity.

Being tolerant, being FORCED to be tolerant is just as bad as censoring speech, in my opinion.

I should be just as free to say something is ####ing stupid.

a reply to: kaylaluv

So there was only one black university that opened? So if black students wanted a university education they had to go to that one, or did more than one open? If more than one opened, they were presented with a choice.

I am not arguing that they had access to the full range of choices, but if you read my post, then you can see that already. What I am saying is that people saw a need and filled it by opening universities that would do what others would not and because of that not only did black students have the chance at a university level education but they also had a choice of universities that would do it.

That is what the essence of choice is about.

If we flash forward, if you are looking at the public school system, then you have no choice - you attend the school you are assigned by your address. If it sucks, then you get a crappy education.

In that sense, there is less choice than what blacks looking for college had even in those days, especially if you cannot afford to move easily.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: MotherMayEye

Who said anything about making thoughts illegal?

There's a difference between listening to a different opinion and being forced by society to listen to idiots spew stupidity.

Being tolerant, being FORCED to be tolerant is just as bad as censoring speech, in my opinion.

I should be just as free to say something is ####ing stupid.

And that's why I said that. I know you are a champion of free speech. It wasn't anything you said in this thread.

I don't think you should be forced to say or think anything. That was my point, although I am not sure I made it clearly.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Being tolerant, being FORCED to be tolerant is just as bad as censoring speech, in my opinion.

I have no problem being tolerant, but that doesn't equate to me wanting to hang out with certain people or liking them. We cannot force people to like people nor should we.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

My whole point (and with all due respect to the OP) is that liberals shouldn't HAVE to be tolerant.

Conservatives shouldn't HAVE to be tolerant.

If someone posts something on ATS that I disagree with, I sure as hell won't "tolerate" it.

I'll call them out.

No one is "tolerant". It's a false narrative.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: ketsuko

Why do we need to be tolerant?

Am I necessarily saying we need to?

Or am I saying that we need to recognize and respect that we aren't necessarily as tolerant as we like to pretend?

To be plain, as far as I am concerned, tolerance to me only means that I need to recognize that they can go live their lives so long as I am not compelled to disorder my life to accommodate them in their whims. They want to have a marriage? Then my opinion on what that relationship actually is shouldn't matter so long as I let them carry on and their preferences don't impact how I prefer to live.

Somewhere in there, we should all recognize that, these things aside, snow needs to shoveled in winter. Cars still need to pushed on the ice. We all want to think our neighbors will keep an eye on our place when we leave for a few days or smile and say hi when we meet working on the lawn.

In my opinion tolerance is being practiced to some degree otherwise there would be alot more dead bodies lying around 😏.

Being open minded is not the answer either because people have the right to think as they do as long as you aren't causing serious damage to others with your thoughts that may be opposed to theirs.

People need to learn to agree to disagree without feeling fear of retaliation or punishment.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: kaylaluv


I am not arguing that they had access to the full range of choices

And that is the key point behind the black students' disagreement with DeVos. The whites had access to the full range of choices - the blacks did not.

a reply to: DBCowboy

No one should have to be tolerant. But there are some benefits to tolerating the ideas others have even if you don't like them.

It's ok to talk about those benefits, too.

I used to hate conservatives...I used to be a rabid liberal. Ever since I let go of my former party, I have found conservatives to be more pleasant to talk to than liberals. I feel like I have gained a lot from listening to them with an open mind.

I can't help but want to tell people what a liberation it is to NOT belong to an intolerant political party. Doesn't mean I think people should be forced to be like me though.

a reply to: ketsuko

No one is as tolerant as they like to pretend.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: dfnj2015

Oh, ok. 'Meta arguments' don't count as examples of intolerant behavior because you say so.

Whatever. That's just ridiculous.

You still haven't given me an example of liberal intolerance that isn't someone criticizing people of your ilk as being racist. If that is the only intolerance, then it seems to me you are making the argument liberals must be tolerant of your intolerance.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
Exploiting feelings of racial injustice to make a political point is exploitation of racial minorities. Whether you approve of that line of debate or not.

You were very intolerant in several of your comments on this thread. You walked on the backs of gay muslims to try to score a cheap political point.

How am I being intolerant just asking you what it means to be intolerant liberal? I am genuinely trying to understand the source of liberal intolerance.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
You can't even say you have black friends...just people you've met and share a community with. Yet, you dare to judge others as racist. At least I live in a black neighborhood and can speak to 16 years of personal relationships. And I have other friends/people, who are important in my life, that happen to be black. And I spend my dollars at local minority owned and operated businesses...and I have done so for 16 years.

This is a pissing contest argument. I am so not interested in any pissing contest. You have no idea who I am.

I will give example of racism in my life. I owned business and I had a black guy working for me named Alvin. He was senior store manager. One day I was in the back working on inventory and there's a big shouting argument coming from the front of the store. I went out to see what it was about. The customer was trying to return something that was clearly used product. We have rules according to our company policy around used products. So Alvin was doing exactly what he was supposed to do. But this guy was just not satisfied and was raising his voice. I told the guy there's nothing we can do for him it was used product. He storms out of the store. I feel bad so I followed him out to try to smooth it out. And then he says, "You need to put a chain on your ape." Alvin played professional football. Even though he was in his mid 60s he was really big and fit. I was thinking at the time that this was completely uncalled for and this customer is some kind of racist. Alvin is a super nice person but he's no nonsense. Alvin is one the nicest people I've ever met in my life. I was thinking what this guy was angry about had nothing to do with our business.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
No, right wingers and conservatives are no more deserving of your criticisms than YOU ARE. Criticize yourself.

Just asking the question doesn't make me intolerant. I'm not being critical. I'm trying to understand right winger outrage.

Again, the only think liberals are really intolerant of is intolerance. Please give me an example that doesn't involve liberals criticizing right wingers and conservatives for not taking issues of intolerance brought up by people of color seriously. Because being intolerant of other people's intolerance is NOT intolerance.

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: kaylaluv


I am not arguing that they had access to the full range of choices

And that is the key point behind the black students' disagreement with DeVos. The whites had access to the full range of choices - the blacks did not.

But DeVos' point was simply that there was a need the system addressed and blacks had choice as a result. It was the students who chose to view everything through a racial lens especially when today, thanks to the government, many black children have even less choice in schooling then their ancestors.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: ketsuko

No one is as tolerant as they like to pretend.

And the very, very long article goes in depth into that very point from all sides.

Many of the people here don't like it because of the title it was given by the publication.

a reply to: dfnj2015

My ilk?

So...independents who are very liberal? We're intolerant, too? Because that's how I identify and vote.

Right there is an example of you being a prejudiced, closed-minded liberal. Right. There.

You also wrote:

"You have no idea who I am."

And you have no idea who all kinds of people are when you accuse them of wanting to use the n-word.

*scoff*

I told you nothing good would come from your kind of closed-minded debate.

a reply to: ketsuko

I like how you try and stay fairly balanced within your thread.

Although, if that was your intention, being balanced that is, why you chose to write it under a one sided title like you did???

It really makes everything you wrote come off like you're faking it. Why not use a title that doesn't focus on one side versus the other when it seems that is what the rest of the message is???

a reply to: dfnj2015

The time a major sh!tstorm erupted because Barilla pasta said that the traditional family was the face of its brand.

SJWs went into a frenzy denouncing the company for "hate" and "intolerance."

Or there was the time that people went after Chip and Joanna Gaines for attending a church that did not agree with gay marriage. Understand that this couple does not do anything religious at all on their TV show, so to bring this out was a complete hit piece motivated by intolerance of views kept private by the two in question.

a reply to: mOjOm

I used the title of the linked article, nothing more. It used to be the policy that you needed to do that. I generally use titles when my posts are based off one piece like this one is.

You should read it if you haven't already. It's brutal to both sides.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: dfnj2015

Have you lost your ever-loving mind?

Are you tolerant of pedophiles?

How about ISIS?

Gonna give them a hug?

I believe Americans who are Muslims living in this country deserve the same rights that you have. Do you agree?

Pedophilia is against the law. Every liberal I know believes laws should be enforced equally for liberals and conservative right wingers. We are citizens first. We have laws against pedophilia for a reason. The more interesting question is in this discussion what on earth would cause you to say, "Are you tolerant of pedophiles?"

Well, like many liberals I know I am a pacifist. I think ISIS is made up war propaganda. ISIS is the name given to many different groups of Arabs. It's not a real organization.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
Jesus Christ!

I don't know why you think I'm intolerant to Jesus Christ. I agree with Jesus we should love our enemies and we are all sons and daughters of God. I think Beatitudes and the sermon on the mount is a great expression of how we should have empathy for each other. Empathy is the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.