Freemasonry and The Coming Storm

originally posted by: kibric
what's your favourite rite ?
that you've researched
cryptic ?
York ?
Adonhiramite ?
Strict Observance ?

I've barely scratched the surface. I love Craft (ofc) but really enjoy Royal Arch.

what Mason do you admire the most ?

I don't have a favourite. But there's many I respect, namely, those that are currently on this thread of the Masonic order.

Do you agree with
A General History of Freemasonry by Emmanuel Rebold ?

Never read it.

Do you get bored during meetings ?

Sure, sometimes. When I am just sitting in one of chairs going through the motions in our weekly Lodge of Instruction evenings. But, I'm sure many of the senior members who have done this for years felt the same and still do, but we do it for the benefit of myself and the newer members.

Do other members make fantastic claims about Magik ?

Honestly, no, not once. Most of the members in my lodge are atheists. I know that sounds weird, but religion isn't that huge over here in the UK.

Have you witnesses supernatural events during meetings ?

Only that time seems to slow down during a 3rd whenever I need to pee *really* bad...

When I turn up in My dressing gown
why am I told to go home ?

Because you're wearing underpants underneath. Lodge meetings are strictly nude from the waist down.

originally posted by: Elementalist
Brother, I didnt ask anything because masonry doesnt and wont provide the answers I'm looking for.

You said:

What barely bothers me (to each his own), is how the "Mason" personalities on this site get dodgy, defensive, sarcastic and pretty much just steer away from legit questions whatever they maybe.

What 'legit questions' are not being answered?

It was a general statement.

So no examples of us doggy, defensive, sarcastic Masons not answering these legit questions?

a reply to: Elementalist

you would not provide the answers and knowledge im seeking for.

what knowledge are you seeking ?

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
...you can joke so carelessly about Lucifer or Baphomet...

People who believe there is a Lucifer or a Baphomet are the real joke.

a reply to: noonebutme

Thanks for the sincere answers

Because you're wearing underpants underneath.

or so you suspect...

a reply to: eisegesis

The goal is to cleanse the body using the secrets of alchemy in order to prepare it for Reintegration. Purifying the human vessel brings it closer to it's primitive state (before all the corn syrup and fluoride), so that it can effectively approach God.

no not the secrets of alchemy

you don't need Magick to purify the body and mind
watch a documentary " Among white clouds "

he did practise sex magick though...

a reply to: Elementalist
Well, I can't speak for my Brothers on this site, but I merely pointed out the irregularity of the Rites of Memphis & Mizraim. Others have also pointed out the issues surrounding fake/rogue "Lodges" like Propaganda Due. It gets a little old so sometimes sarcasm is necessary.

What's so spiritual and moral about dressing up, acting pretending things like children?

You'd have to go through the ritual to answer that.

How about going on the internet being sarcastic, playing dumb and being dodgy?

Thank you for this uncalled for opinion.

a reply to: The GUT
There is esotericism in Freemasonry, but this doesn't make Freemasonry not a fraternal organization. A fraternity can be esoteric.

No matter what a non-Mason may state or believe, P2 Lodge lost their charter in the 70s and, since that time, was no longer a part of Freemasonry or to be considered Masonic.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie
There is no record that definitively shows Jefferson as a Mason and most don't include him on the list of US Presidents or Founding Fathers who were Freemasons.

a reply to: loveguy
Then there'd be no point in joining a fraternity if you they just gave away the ritual. Plus, the initiatic journey taken in joining a fraternity is part of the experience and, something freely given is often not appreciated and is just as easily tossed aside. Also, it takes money to operate and maintain a Lodge.

a reply to: TobyFlenderson
It was the closest thing there is and I didn't feel like writing an entire article myself.

a reply to: SuicideKing33
It's post like this why we get defensive and act sarcastically. I wouldn't say we know everything, but between us we know quite a bit.

a reply to: kibric
My favorite would be the Order of the Temple (Knights Templar) in the York Rite, the Red Cross of Constantine, and the Societas Rosicruciana in Civitatibus Foederatis.

I admire a few Masons, but you wouldn't know them.

I prefer the history books of Voorhis and Denslow.

As for you, I'm guessing you just don't have the legs for the dressing gown.

a reply to: Elementalist
So you say we won't answer your questions, but you won't ask any questions? Hmmmm...

a reply to: eisegesis
I wrote an article called Intro to Martinism. You might enjoy it.

a reply to: KSigMason

As for you, I'm guessing you just don't have the legs for the dressing gown

you'd be surprised...

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
...you can joke so carelessly about Lucifer or Baphomet...

People who believe there is a Lucifer or a Baphomet are the real joke.

So, is Pike considered an authority around here or only turned on and off like a switch when needed? He only seems relevant and authoritative to Freemasonry, when Masons themselves use him as a reference.

By the late 1800s, Freemasonry had grown so large that it had become inefficient and difficult to manage. Its many divisions, rites, and sects lacked a sense of unity and direction. Thus, in an effort to centralize the authority of Universal Freemasonry a new ultra-secret governing body was established on 20 September 1870 (Miller, Occult Theocracy, p.207-208). This represented the first major restructuring of Illuminized Freemasonry. At the center of this creation was Albert Pike, who stated:

"The blind Force of the people is a Force that must be economized, and also managed . . . It must be regulated by Intellect (Intellect here is a reference to the Illuminati or the highest adepts of Freemasonry), . . . When all these Forces are combined, and guided by the Intellect, and regulated by the RULE of Right, and Justice... the great revolution prepared for by the ages will begin to march. It is because Force is ill regulated that revolutions prove failures." (Morals and Dogma, p.1-2).

Care to guess what that Order was?

a reply to: eisegesis

is it just me
do you have a gripe with Masons ?

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

People who believe there is a Lucifer or a Baphomet are the real joke.

another full Pike quote

"the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed"

makes clear Lucifer is bad ?

a reply to: eisegesis
Brothers Arturo de Hoyos and S. Brent Morris (both 33° *gasp*) state, in Is It True What They Say About Freemasonry, "Just because Albert Pike was a brilliant ritualist, an able administrator, and a well-respected Mason doesn't mean all of his opinions are right."

Most anti-Masons and non-Masons hold a misguided belief at what constitutes authority in Freemasonry. Since the 18th century, many Masons have published works concerning Freemasonry, writing on various theories and subjects within Freemasonry. Anti-Masons would have others believe that everything a Mason writes is inherently accepted by all of Freemasonry. The problem here is that not everything written by a Mason has been factual, but as Freemasonry is a society dedicated to knowledge and free thought, Grand Lodges have not interfered with what an individual Mason writes. A Grand Lodge is the only entity within Freemasonry that has authority to speak on the symbols, rituals, history, and so on. Without receiving an endorsement from a Grand Lodge, a Masonic author is merely giving his opinion, he does not speak for all Freemasonry. Freemasonry is much more than just the writings of a single Masonic author.

And Pike is really only remembered in the Southern Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite in the US. Augustus, for example, is in the Northern Masonic Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite where Pike really didn't have any impact. Also, there's no such thing as "Universal Freemasonry."

Read these please:

• Notes on Occult Theocracy: freemasonry.bcy.ca...
  
• Nesta Webster: freemasonry.bcy.ca...
  

originally posted by: KSigMason

No matter what a non-Mason may state or believe, P2 Lodge lost their charter in the 70s and, since that time, was no longer a part of Freemasonry or to be considered Masonic.

That happens a lot when somebody gets busted. They become the scapegoats. Guilty scapegoats to be sure. Hard to say of course and admittedly.

How does your statement negate what I said which was:

No matter what a Freemason may state or believe about the P2 Lodge and Gelli, we have in their journey of power and magic an empirical example of an impressive and powerful conspiracy born of secrecy and Masonic initiation.

Common sense and history demonstrate that power, secrecy, and blood oaths are breeding grounds for such. It would also be above your pay grade so to speak. It wouldn't make all Masons guilty, but it could conceivably make you a naive pawn.

originally posted by: eisegesis
So, is Pike considered an authority around here or only turned on and off like a switch when needed? He only seems relevant and authoritative to Freemasonry, when Masons themselves use him as a reference.

Not sure what Pike has to do with belief in Lucifer or Baphomet.

Pike is relevant if you are interested in the Scottish Rite of the Southern Jurisdiction. Outside of that his main works are somewhat irrelevant.

a reply to: The GUT

What your talking is corruption
it happens with nearly everything

people might become members to further their own agendas
but their behaviour can never really represent the whole

you could say we are equally pawns
believing anti masonic sentiment
which is easy to access
pushed by people selling books
and others with their own agendas

If Masons are so powerful
why is it easy to find so many denouncing them ?

as an experiment type into google masons are good
then for a contrast type into google masons are bad

what reading is more appealing ?

a reply to: KSigMason

It seems that you and other Masons greatly downplay his significance. I wouldn't use any single person as a point of reference, but you have to admit, the ancient history and information that can be accessed by non-Masons is beyond compelling and forthright. All this must not be that significant? If not to Freemasonry, then surely significant to other adepts or even non-Masons for the role they play.

Pike would end up doing more than any other figure of the 19th century to prepare the way for this "great" revolution of which he spoke. He was "a great student of the Cabala and the Occult" (Miller, Occult Theocracy, 208). His literary achievements in this area were numerous, including Ariel; The Sephar H. Debarim; Book of the Word; Legenda Magistralia; Ritual of the New and Reformed Palladium (4 grades out of 5), The Ritual of Elect Magus, and The Book of Apadno" (Ibid., p.220).

Pike was placed in power in 1859 when, he was elected to the position of Sovereign Grand Commander of the Southern Supreme Council. In the 1860s, Giuseppe Mazzini, the Italian revolutionary leader and the worldwide director of Illuminized Freemasonry from 1834 to 1872, established relations with Pike making him the head of the Illuminati's activities in the United States.

Finally, on 20 September 1870 the constitution creating the new super-rite was signed into effect by Pike and Mazzini (Miller, Occult Theocracy, p.215). The two founders divided their powers according to the following plan. To Pike (Scotch Rite) was given dogmatic authority and the title of Sovereign Pontiff of Universal Freemasonry, while Mazzini (Memphis Misraim Rite) held the executive authority with the title of Sovereign Chief of Political Action.

Pike named the Order the New and Reformed Palladian Rite. Historians describes it as neo-Gnosticism, teaching that the divinity is dual and that Lucifer is the equal of Adonay (Ibid., 216-217). It is in fact Lucifer who is worshiped within this Rite of Freemasonry. The Holy See of the Dogma for the whole Masonic world was set up at Charleston, the sacred city of the Palladium.

Pike, the Sovereign Pontiff of Lucifer, was the president of the Supreme Dogmatic Directory, composed of 10 brothers of the highest grades who formed his Supreme Grand College of Emeritus Masons. The Sovereign Executive Directory of High Masonry was established at Rome under Mazzini himself.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Not sure what Pike has to do with belief in Lucifer...

Still?

In a letter to Albert Pike, dated 22 January 1870 (leading up to the founding of the new Rite) Mazzini wrote: "We must allow all the federations to continue just as they are, with their systems, their central authorities and their divers modes of correspondence between high grades of the same rite, organized as they are at present, but we must create a supreme rite, which will remain unknown, to which we will call those Masons of high degree whom we shall select. With regard to their brothers in Masonry, these men must be pledged to the strictest secrecy. Through this supreme rite, we will govern all Freemasonry which will become the one international centre, the more powerful because its direction will be unknown." (Ibid., p.208-209).

The main centers of operation for the Supreme or Palladian Rite were located in Charleston, Rome, and Berlin. In addition to these headquarters, Pike and Mazzini established four Grand Central Directories for the purpose of gathering information vital to political and propaganda efforts. These were, The Grand Central Directories for North America at Washington, for South America at Montevideo, for Europe at Naples, and for Asia and Oceania at Calcutta. Later on, a Sub-Directory for Africa was rounded at Port Louis on the Island of Mauritius. Palladism is necessarily a luciferian Rite. Its religion is Neo-Gnostism (Bogomilism), teaching that the divinity is dual and that Satanail (Lucifer) is equal of Yehova (Adonay), with the God of Light and Goodness struggling for humanity against the God of Darkness and Evil.

originally posted by: eisegesis

It seems that you and other Masons, greatly downplay his significance.

And it seems you and other conspiracy theorists like to quote a guy's opinion (Pike) as interpreted by another guy (some dude writing a conspiracy book) and then go, 'Oh, look!!! Illuminati!!!'.

a reply to: eisegesis

"the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed"

makes clear Lucifer is bad..

a reply to: The GUT
They are not scapegoats. What they did merited their charter being taken by the Grand Orient of Italy.

It negates it because P2 post-1970s was no longer Masonic.

THere are no such thing as blood oaths in Freemasonry.

Above my pay grade? What is my pay grade?

a reply to: eisegesis
I'd say that non-Masons and anti-Mason exaggerate his significance.

So many focus on him too much, it's target fixation. So many think he's the end all example of what Freemasonry is without looking at Freemasons like William Preston, John Theophilus Desaguliers, Thomas Smith-Webb, and Jeremy Ladd-Cross.

In regards to Morals & Dogma, Pike states this in the Preface: "Everyone is entirely free to reject and dissent from whatsoever herein may seem to him to be untrue or unsound."

Again, look at this link on Occult Theocracy: Notes on Occult Theocracy

You need to realize that the Palladium Rite doesn't exist. Palladium Masonry is the invention of a Frenchman named Marie Joseph Gabriel Antoine Jogand-Pagès, but better known by the pen name of Léo Taxil. In 1885 and 1886, Taxil published works which attributed Palladium Masonry to Albert Pike, although this is just one of the many fabrications he concocted and duped the world with.

There's no such thing as "Illuminized Freemasonry" or "Sovereign Pontiff of Universal Freemasonry". You should also read these:

Albert Pike the and Three World Wars Conspiracy

Pike and Mazzini

The 1782 Congress of Wilhelmsbad