Man Violently Dragged Off Plane After United Airlines Overbooks Flight

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
a reply to: Edumakated

Youre right it could have and should have been avoided. United was in violation of their own CoC contract with the victim. For involuntary denied bording which they screwed up legaly too. You cant involuntarily deny bording and refusal of transport for the reasons they stated once the passanger has borded and taken his seat. You cant call police or security for that reason alone. They broke their own rules. A legally binding contract and managed to violate a persons civil rights and got a guy assaulted by incompetent security operating under fraudulent information that they were provided by united.

A good place for united to start at where they went wrong would be their own legally binding contract they have with the victim i mean passenger. Rule 25, Part A Section 4a - $1350 for delays over 2 hours. They broke their own rules and contract by offering 400 and then only 800. United is dirty in this instance and screwed up. They need to pay for all damages punitively including emotional damages.

The issue is that there is a time and place to argue that... in this case, it would have been after he got off the plane. Look, from the beginning of the thread, I have said United was in the wrong in how this was handled. However, the bottom line is that had the good Doctor just got up as requested, he wouldn't have been forcibly removed.

they asked for 'volunteers' and there were two volunteers. none of the other customers volunteered. it is not the fault of the doctor.
hopefully he's got a couple hungry lawyer buddies so ua flights can go up in cost again...to pay for lawyers.

a reply to: yuppa

Tha man was back on 2 hours later with a bloody face and was traumitized saying i have to get home repeatedly.

Let's hope he wasn't seriously injured to the head to the point where the next day he is unable to perform his duties as a doctor. For instance, if he has a minor concussion (if he was traumatized and repeated saying the same thing), his ability as a doctor could be impeded, and that puts his patients at risk, as well.

All over this BS.

originally posted by: yuppa

Its the same thing casinos do. they rough you up if you win too much.

thats a great way to put it.

vito and tony probably put this dudes head in a vice.....

i did like the way you put that though

originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: subfab

You gonna address the time and money issue? Takes both to fight # out in court. A doc can afford a lawyer but I wouldn't be able to lawyer up and I damn well shouldn't have to.

there was no need for lawyer or court or fees if the passenger listened to instruction by law enforcement.
it could have ended with the passenger contacting the airline customer service instead of dragged out of the plane.

the need for legal representation began the second the passenger fought back against a law enforcement officer.
don't fight, no need for cash for lawyer, no need for court, no need to visit the hospital.

originally posted by: yuppa
Tha man was back on 2 hours later with a bloody face and was traumitized saying i have to get home repeatedly. SO to try and mitigate their losses UA let him back on the flight. SO the man didnt spend any time in jail.
Its the same thing casinos do. they rough you up if you win too much.

He doesn't have to spend time in jail. Police are trained to always be in control of a situation, which means using force until the person complies. They used force to get him off the plane. Police training isn't the problem here, it's having accepted the request in the first place. The police should have told UA to f off when the request was made. Once they were there though, and telling the man to get off the plane, that's not the time for the customer to start arguing his case.

Also, no casinos do not rough you up for winning too much. They never have, winners are great for business. Usually if you start winning, rather than threatening you they'll try to get you to play more. Comp trips, free drinks, and luxurious hotel suites. They give you this stuff when you win because it means you'll play more and given enough time they'll take it all back.

The only time casinos ever roughed people up was when the mob owned them and people were caught cheating.

a reply to: SirHardHarry

Good point concussions arent minor. He needs to get a MRI fast to make sure that in two weeks he doesnt die from a stroke due to blood vessel damage in the brain. Sounds like im being a bit ridiculous but it happens to otherwise normal people everyday. A bump on the head that seems fine might be the cause of what kills you two weeks later.

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: subfab

You gonna address the time and money issue? Takes both to fight # out in court. A doc can afford a lawyer but I wouldn't be able to lawyer up and I damn well shouldn't have to.

there was no need for lawyer or court or fees if the passenger listened to instruction by law enforcement.
it could have ended with the passenger contacting the airline customer service instead of dragged out of the plane.

the need for legal representation began the second the passenger fought back against a law enforcement officer.
don't fight, no need for cash for lawyer, no need for court, no need to visit the hospital.

Unless he was suspected of a crime the police illegally detained him. He didnt do anything until he was assaulted first.
Just because its a cop does not put them above the law.

originally posted by: loveguy

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
a reply to: Edumakated

Youre right it could have and should have been avoided. United was in violation of their own CoC contract with the victim. For involuntary denied bording which they screwed up legaly too. You cant involuntarily deny bording and refusal of transport for the reasons they stated once the passanger has borded and taken his seat. You cant call police or security for that reason alone. They broke their own rules. A legally binding contract and managed to violate a persons civil rights and got a guy assaulted by incompetent security operating under fraudulent information that they were provided by united.

A good place for united to start at where they went wrong would be their own legally binding contract they have with the victim i mean passenger. Rule 25, Part A Section 4a - $1350 for delays over 2 hours. They broke their own rules and contract by offering 400 and then only 800. United is dirty in this instance and screwed up. They need to pay for all damages punitively including emotional damages.

The issue is that there is a time and place to argue that... in this case, it would have been after he got off the plane. Look, from the beginning of the thread, I have said United was in the wrong in how this was handled. However, the bottom line is that had the good Doctor just got up as requested, he wouldn't have been forcibly removed.

they asked for 'volunteers' and there were two volunteers. none of the other customers volunteered. it is not the fault of the doctor.
hopefully he's got a couple hungry lawyer buddies so ua flights can go up in cost again...to pay for lawyers.

Right. And as I have stated, United should have kept upping the compensation until someone else volunteered even if the got up to $10k or whatever. Everyone has a price. Someone would have volunteered when compensation got high enough. The issue is that United didn't want to or give the gate employees authorization to go higher.

However, they chose not to do that and randomly boot off a passenger. The doctor was chosen. He refused to get off hence the goons sent in to remove him.

United was wrong, but at the end of the day when they tell you to get off the plane, you get off the plane. PERIOD. You can argue your case later. In the heat of the moment, security and whoever else isn't going to take the time to argue the intricacies of the situation. It is not an argument you are going to win, so no point in escalating it.

The cops probably had no idea why this guy was being asked to be removed. They just know they were told to get him off the plane and he wasn't cooperating. I'm sure they didn't know about all that happened up until that point.

a reply to: Aazadan

im sure mechanics are still operating.
i wouldnt put it put it past a casino tuning someone up in 2017

originally posted by: Edumakated

The cops probably had no idea why this guy was being asked to be removed. They just know they were told to get him off the plane and he wasn't cooperating. I'm sure they didn't know about all that happened up until that point.

yea they went in totally in the dark and were not told about the situation.

a reply to: Edumakated

The UA management should be held responsible for not being truthful to the Police on why.

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: TinySickTears
a reply to: subfab

You gonna address the time and money issue? Takes both to fight # out in court. A doc can afford a lawyer but I wouldn't be able to lawyer up and I damn well shouldn't have to.

there was no need for lawyer or court or fees if the passenger listened to instruction by law enforcement.
it could have ended with the passenger contacting the airline customer service instead of dragged out of the plane.

the need for legal representation began the second the passenger fought back against a law enforcement officer.
don't fight, no need for cash for lawyer, no need for court, no need to visit the hospital.

Unless he was suspected of a crime the police illegally detained him. He didnt do anything until he was assaulted first.
Just because its a cop does not put them above the law.

asking a passenger to exit a plane is not the same as detaining a prisoner or arresting a citizen.

originally posted by: TinySickTears
im sure mechanics are still operating.
i wouldnt put it put it past a casino tuning someone up in 2017

They're far too regulated for that to be possible these days.

Among other things, every square inch of those places is recorded by video from multiple angles, and stored off site for security purposes. The penalties for any of that footage going missing is higher than the penalties for beating someone up.

They would never be able to get away with it.

originally posted by: TinySickTears
yea they went in totally in the dark and were not told about the situation.

They were probably told there was an uncooperative passenger who they needed off the plane, and he was refusing to get off.

Vote with your dollar its the only language they speak.

a reply to: Edumakated

He legally didnt have to get up as requested the cop who pulled him off the plane is under investigation and suspended. The airoune camnot ask you to involentarily leave the plane for the reasons cited. If security or police demand illegally for you to do something you have every right to tell them to get bent. Yeah its wise to listen to tbe goon with the gun, tazer and billy club so you dont get ypur civil rights taken away and your face bludgeoned via assault. But legally he did nothing wrong.

On a side note. I actually enjoy your posts on many topics here on ats as i find them well thought out and backed by tangible life experience and agree with you about a time and place but when is enough enough. People have rights.

a reply to: Aazadan

Which would be distorting material facts to bully someone. Sounds like discovery for a lawsuit.

originally posted by: yuppa
a reply to: Edumakated

The UA management should be held responsible for not being truthful to the Police on why.

I agree. Chicago aviation department is pissed at both united and the security dufus right now. I hope they do hold them accountable

originally posted by: Lysergic
Vote with your dollar its the only language they speak.

yes... a thousand times yes

a reply to: BASSPLYR

That's what court is for, to make your case that your rights were violated. In the heat of the moment might be the most convenient time, but you're never going to win that battle. I definitely get how it feels wrong that you have to go along with the police doing something illegal to you, but there is a path in place to make everything right and that path doesn't involve being confrontational.