Alien Sky: The Lightning Scarred Planet, Mars (Full Documentary)

a reply to: BakedCrusader
The balloon rises because the air pushing on the bottom of the balloon has a greater force than the downward force of the air on top of the balloon plus the balloon's own weight.

originally posted by: BakedCrusader
a reply to: D8Tee

Your point?

Just trying to help you sort this out buddy.

a reply to: D8Tee

Yeah well, I don't see how that link helps. Yes he measured a force. I never denied a force. He didn't prove a force that pulls all matter towards the center of the Earth, which is what I am arguing against.

a reply to: D8Tee

Sigh, and this force can only be transferred into upwards motion if the air particles at the bottom are actually moving up to push the balloon. What else is transfering this force?

You guys are talking about pressure yet somehow think that pressure energy is transferred in a non physical way?

a reply to: BakedCrusader

why do some things, like a helium or hot air balloon, go up, if gravity is pulling down on all matter?

Because gravity is not the only motive influence acting on them.

But I see that you have found what you were hoping for -- someone whose own ideas about gravity are sound but who lacks the technical knowledge, or perhaps merely the argumentative experience, to refute your conclusions. Your triumph is of rather limited scope, I fear. While you congratulate yourself, others are laughing at the -- shall we say -- density of your statements.

Now, once again, what do you mean by force?

a reply to: BakedCrusader

And since I showed that gravity cannot contain the atmosphere, there has to be a barrier if space is a vacuum.

Can you show proof of this barrier?

Oh dear, this got quite messy, didn't it?

Vacuum doesn't suck. Sucking is an action that requires energy, i.e. some work being done. A vacuum cleaner sucks stuff due to the atmospheric pressure pushing the air into the vacated interior. A vacuum cleaner wouldn't work in vacuum. You need a pressure difference, and that pressure is provided by the atmosphere.

A helium balloon rises because the air around it "flows" down and to the bottom of it, thus pushing the balloon up. Again, due to pressure difference.

Hopefully, that clears these points up. I'm going to work now, but will be happy to elaborate more when I get back.

a reply to: Astyanax

tell me where the initial single point for the big bang theory originates, who created the sacred geometry patterns that all life follows and i won't question you.

You see hallucinogens are considered drugs to people who don't realize that perception has a huge influence on the way we see the universe. I like to see these plants, as tools used to gain an wider understanding of reality. Its like looking at a star and saying thats just a flashing light in the sky, then taking out a telescope and realizing it's actually a planet.

But you must know the answer to my questions because you seem so sure of your "higher education". Silly me for questioning these things right?

originally posted by: booyakasha
a reply to: Astyanax

tell me where the initial single point for the big bang theory originates...

Everywhere. Lay off the shrooms.

originally posted by: BakedCrusader
a reply to: MasterAtArms

Hold a ping pong ball underwater and let it go. Is the water underneath the ball moving upwards? its exactly the same principle. The only movement of the air is to fill in the gap where the hot air balloon *was*. Another way to think of this - the pressure gradient isn't the air imparting a motive force on the object itself in a direct way. It is trying to crush it because it is lower pressure, so in the act of crushing the gas has to go somewhere, hence the movement.

My point is that obviously the air or water itself is not going up. So what is phyically pushing against the balloon? With what force is it doing the "crushing" then?

You do realize that pressure is created because partcles are pushing against particles?

Imagine one of those long balloons clowns make animals from. Fill it with water (for ease of demonstration). Now, since you also agree that air density increases the closer you get to the surface, grab the bottom of the balloon and squeeze. The water expands upwards. Now, while holding the bottom of the balloon still, grab the next handful of balloon and squeeze just a little less (because you are simulating slightly lower pressure a bit higher up). The water still goes UP

The water is going up because you are pushing it up with your fingers, and the water itself pushes the rest of the water up.

So what represents your fingers in the case of a helium balloon that is being pushed up?

JUST FKN Tell that to the Moon or Mars lower gravity no protective magnetic field so next to no ATMOSPHERE then look at Jupiter, Saturn or the other GAS giant planets huge BALLS of gas, very strong gravity and magnetic fields.

The Atmosphere is in layers of density.

Lets look at this in a simple way for simple people.

If i take a block of METAL and place it on water what happens IT SINKS

If you then take that same block of metal and work on it to change it's shape to this .



It floats same mass of metal same force of gravity different result.

Your ballon example is a similar principle the mass of the gas and balloon skin at that volume is less than the mass of the air it displaces so it floats to point were everything balances out but if the balloon skin is to weak at that point it will pop.

The helium balloon displaces an amount of air (just like the empty bottle displaces an amount of water). As long as the helium plus the balloon is lighter than the air it displaces, the balloon will float in the air. It turns out that helium is a lot lighter than air.

Now YOU seem the typical flat earth/religious FANATIC that thinks the bible is a scince book coupled with the fact you probably NEVER listened in class at school and OBVIOUSLY walk around with your EYES wide shut that you never see what happens in the world around you. Conspiracy sites are over populated with people like that.

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

says the guy who's avatar is painted by Alex Grey who's inspiration is D M TEE. " Everywhere", what was i thinking? Of course the single point came from everywhere. And Im the one who needs to lay off the shrooms?

originally posted by: BakedCrusader
a reply to: BakedCrusader

Imagine one of those long balloons clowns make animals from. Fill it with water (for ease of demonstration). Now, since you also agree that air density increases the closer you get to the surface, grab the bottom of the balloon and squeeze. The water expands upwards. Now, while holding the bottom of the balloon still, grab the next handful of balloon and squeeze just a little less (because you are simulating slightly lower pressure a bit higher up). The water still goes UP

And again, the only reason the water moves up is because the particles that make up my hands and fingers are pushing against the particles of the balloon who are pushing against the particles of the water. The particles that make up my fingers actually move towards the water.

In the case of the helium balloon, air particles are pushing all around it but the particles at the bottom have enough pressure behind them to push up the balloon. They can only be pushing by moving up themselves.

Not that I am saying that this is what happens in reality when things go up, but if the pressure gradient causes matter to go up, then this is the only way it can be.

So it's either this or it is not caused by the pressure gradient.

again! you argue how pressure works, then confirm how pressure works in the same statement!

Let me ask you something else. In your domed flat earth model, wherin you have yourself stated there is an absolute up and down (which exist without gravity, because you deny gravity) - what is the actual force that is pulling you "down" then ? Even in this fantastical world of yours, there is still a force that is pulling "stuff" towards this absolute down-ness. Forces don't care if that stuff is people, rocks, or gas

I lost my login data so I had to make a new account. I hope this is not a problem.


Imagine a huge vacuum chamber on the suface of the Earth. In the middle of this vacuum chamber is an air tight room with a valve in the roof. The valve is closed and the room is filled with air.

Then the air is sucked out of the vacuum chamber.

So now we have a room filled with "atmosphere" surrounded by a vacuum.

The hypothetical gravity is pulling down on this "atmosphere". Since the chamber is on the surface, there is no place above the Earth where gravity is stronger.


We now open the valve of the room. We all know what happens.


The air is "sucked" out into the vacuum.


Conclusion, gravity is not strong enough to keep the atmosphere from flowing into the vacuum of space. I don't see a way out of this.

a reply to: Astyanax

But I see that you have found what you were hoping for -- someone whose own ideas about gravity are sound but who lacks the technical knowledge, or perhaps merely the argumentative experience, to refute your conclusions. Your triumph is of rather limited scope, I fear. While you congratulate yourself, others are laughing at the -- shall we say -- density of your statements.

I was hoping to speak to you. I asked you a question. It's not my fault the guy interfered. So you agree that my arguments trump his? How are you going to refute them then?

Now, once again, what do you mean by force?

Oh it's going to be about semantics? What I mean whatever it is that is being described as having the power to accelerate all matter towards the center of the Earth with 9.81 m/s2.(in a vacuum)

a reply to: MasterAtArms

Let me ask you something else. In your domed flat earth model, wherin you have yourself stated there is an absolute up and down (which exist without gravity, because you deny gravity) - what is the actual force that is pulling you "down" then ? Even in this fantastical world of yours, there is still a force that is pulling "stuff" towards this absolute down-ness. Forces don't care if that stuff is people, rocks, or gas

I already told you, a law that says that denser matter goes down and less dense matter goes up. It is just as hypothetical as gravity only it actually fits our observations of reality.

a reply to: MasterAtArms

again! you argue how pressure works, then confirm how pressure works in the same statement!

The only way air pressure is pushing something up is because air particles are moving in that direction. The only way force is being transferred is because particles are pushing against particles.

Wind is due to a pressure gradient. Are you going to tell me that air particles pushing against the sail of a ship making it move into the direction of the low pressure, are not moving in said direction?

a reply to: wildespace

Vacuum doesn't suck.

No, a vacuum doesn't.......

I already pointed this out, it is a semantics thing. From our perspective it is being sucked. It doesn't change any point. Air moves into a vacuum, and gravity is demonstrably not strong enough to stop this.

a reply to: Triggernometry

The air isn't sucked in the air is under pressure so when the valve opens it escapes. Into the vacuum chamber.

Drop a bowling ball and feather in the vacuum that video has been shown they both drop at the same speed and are different densities.

USING equations based on GRAVITY we can calculate positions velocity etc. We can plot future positions for planets and satellites for future dates so what do you say about that

a reply to: wmd_2008

The air isn't sucked in the air is under pressure so when the valve opens it escapes. Into the vacuum chamber.

Wow, another one hiding behind semantics.

So why doesn't the pressurised atmosphere "escape" into the vacuum of space? I just showed you again that gravity is not strong enough to stop this.

originally posted by: Triggernometry
a reply to: wmd_2008

The air isn't sucked in the air is under pressure so when the valve opens it escapes. Into the vacuum chamber.

Wow, another one hiding behind semantics.

So why doesn't the pressurised atmosphere "escape" into the vacuum of space? I just showed you again that gravity is not strong enough to stop this.

You really are failing to comprehend how gravity, pressure and gasses work.

Gravity is weak. It is strong enough to make the atmosphere cling to the planet, but NOT strong enough to overcome any motion in that gas with enough energy to overcome the weak gravitational

It's not my fault the guy interfered

Oh, I am very, very sorry that i interfered. I failed to see the big sign that said "other posters not allowed". But dont worry! I shall continue to interfere

So tell me - with your mysitcal "not gravity" force that pulls everything down to this absolute "down-ness", why would this not also apply to atmosphere like it does everything else, necessitating a physical barrier?

So you agree that my arguments trump his?

HA HA! that isn't what he said, at all