There are 33rd degree Masons here...

These guys are evil.

33rd degree Masons are few and far between and its these who are in on the NWO agenda.

Be wary of them spreading false information.

I'm just curious why you think this. What leads you to believe 33 degree masons are evil?

Then why are you quoting one (Goethe)? Is he spreading false information too?

Gimme a break.

Originally posted by kinglizard
I'm just curious why you think this. What leads you to believe 33 degree masons are evil?

Cause thats the general idea amoung conspiracy theorists.

Originally posted by d3v

Cause thats the general idea amoung conspiracy theorists.

Well, it was the general idea among 16th century Europeans that the sun revolved around the earth, but that theory didn't pan out either.

Freudling, if you're reading this, this is what I was getting into in our discussion of Plato's "Republic" concerning the masses and knowledge. They tend to "go with the flow" (Nietzsche's "herd mentality") without truly seeking knowledge, which proves to be a problem in a democracy since, because they are the largest class, outnumber the thinkers and are able to impose legislation.

heheee, I agree about your "going with the flow herd mentlaity" but TBH, I am not included.

Its just all conspiracies always mention free masons.. perticulary the 33rd degree ones so therfore there must be something to it.

Also many presidents have been freemasons so saying I have a herd mentality is wrong.

I could indeed be wrong but you gotta admit that I do have a valid and rightfull suspision.

Originally posted by d3v
heheee, I agree about your "going with the flow herd mentlaity" but TBH, I am not included.
Its just all conspiracies always mention free masons.. perticulary the 33rd degree ones so therfore there must be something to it.
I could indeed be wrong but you gotta admit that I do have a valid and rightfull suspision.

Interesting. You state you aren't going with the flow in your first line and then totally contradict it with the statement that because there are so many theories regarding Freemasonry, you choose to believe skullduggery. That's going with the flow!!!

ML has already pointed to Plato, but I'd like to bring the literature more up to date. Hitler has a really interesting piece in Mein Kampf regarding how to create a "go with the flow" situation.

"All propaganda must be popular and its intellectual level must be adjusted to the most limited intelligence among those it is addressed to. Consequently, the greater the mass it is intended to reach, the lower its purely intellectual level will have to be."

Although you see a lot of different anti theories regarding Freemasonry, they basically all rely on the paragraph above.
What Hitler was basically saying is that if you want to cast aspersions on a certain group, keep the message short, sweet and above all easily understandable for the dumb.
Basically, you've fallen into that trap.

[edit on 2-2-2005 by Leveller]

Originally posted by d3v
Its just all conspiracies always mention free masons.. perticulary the 33rd degree ones so therfore there must be something to it.

Ok, forgive me for using a reductio ad absurdum again, but according to the same line of logic, I could argue from the viewpoint of a 16th century cleric, saying "It's just that all science texts mention that the sun revolves around the earth, so therefore there must be something to it."

But, in the end, we know that there was nothing to it at all, regardless of how many science texts claimed it. The argument that something is true just because some people believe it really isn't an argument at all.

Also many presidents have been freemasons so saying I have a herd mentality is wrong.

16 Presidents of the United States have been Masons, but I don't see how that is relevant to the Nietzsche comment I made, i.e., he defined the "herd mentality" as that mentality which assumes something is truth or error based upon what others tell him, instead of finding and verifying it for himself. Your argument is that you believe we're evil because, and only because, that is the conspiracy theorist's line of thinking. Therefore, it would have been difficult for me to have reached a different conclusion.

I could indeed be wrong but you gotta admit that I do have a valid and rightfull suspision.

There's nothing wrong in being suspicious in and of itself, but if such suspicion leads me to adamantly anounce to the world that people I don't know are "evil", I would be forced to consider if I am acting in an ethical manner.

Originally posted by d3v
Cause thats the general idea amoung conspiracy theorists.

Well jezus, thanks every so much for informing everyone here what the general idea amoung conspiracy theorists is.

And you know that there are 33rd degree masons on this board because???

Also many presidents have been freemasons so saying I have a herd mentality is wrong.

I could indeed be wrong but you gotta admit that I do have a valid and rightfull suspision.

Since your position is invalid and wrong, how do you figure?

Also, you most certainly are going with the herd mentality. The herd in unthinking, only regurgitating what its been told. You are a herdsman, just in a conspiracy herd. You couldn't support your statement out side of 'its the general idea'.

By definition that makes you a member of the herd.

I dident contradict myself.

I meant that I agreed with his "herd mentality"... thats all.

I am proably the most un-influenced by the majority mindset that anyone you'll ever meet, actually.

Okay 16 presidents.

Now presidents are in on the global conspiracy and they were masons, this to me says that masons, or atleast some are also in on the global conspiracy too.

THAT coupled with so many conspiracy theorists saying that some levels of Masonary are involved in the global conspiracy is unexcusible and is not atall "going with the flow".

Masonic Light you are a 32nd degree mason.... what part of the NWO agenda will you take up once you reach 33rd?

Will u become head of a major bank and keep the financial supressment of the populace going or something?

I wanna know what role you will play in the evil NWo agenda once u reach 33rd degree.

Originally posted by d3v
Now presidents are in on the global conspiracy and they were masons, this to me says that masons, or atleast some are also in on the global conspiracy too.

THAT coupled with so many conspiracy theorists saying that some levels of Masonary are involved in the global conspiracy is unexcusible and is not atall "going with the flow".

To make an analogy of your second paragraph, once again, I could say "To deny that the sun revolves around the earth is inexcusable because so many theologians say it." This argument, which contains three different fallacies in a single sentence, can be discarded as invalid.

As for your first paragraph, most are aware of the Presidents who have been Masons: Washington, Jackson, Truman, etc. Now what kind of "global conspiracy" are you claiming that these men were involved in?

Originally posted by d3v


Okay 16 presidents.

THAT coupled with so many conspiracy theorists saying that some levels of Masonary are involved in the global conspiracy is unexcusible and is not atall "going with the flow".

That means that there were what? Twenty-seven presidents who weren't Freemasons? So for the vast majority of the time there were no Freemason's in the Whitehouse. Don't you think that a global conspiracy would require an unbroken chain of like-minded people? What's the point of having a Freemason in power, then replacing him with a non-Freemason? And what about recent years? The last US president to be a Freemason was Gerald Ford. That's 30 years ago!!!

What are these conspiracy theories that you keep speaking of? Which particular one do you have in mind? That Freemasons run the world? If this were the case, don't you think that we would say that we do? We've got nothing to hide. But unfortunately we don't run the world - non-Freemasons do. And they seem to be doing a pretty good job of screwing things up for themselves.

Originally posted by d3v
Masonic Light you are a 32nd degree mason.... what part of the NWO agenda will you take up once you reach 33rd?

Will u become head of a major bank and keep the financial supressment of the populace going or something?

I wanna know what role you will play in the evil NWo agenda once u reach 33rd degree.

d3v,

First, let me explain what the 33° actually is. This degree was created in 1801 by the 11 founders of the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite of Masonry for the sole purpose of recognizing the members of the Supreme Council, which governs the Scottish Rite fraternity. The degree is purely administrative, and was simply conferred as an honor upon those members who had been elected members of the Supreme Council. The original Supreme Council consisted of devoutly religious men, two of whom were Christian ministers, and one a rabbi. This is hardly a group I would call "evil".

A Brother named Albert Pike was elected to become the presiding officer of the Supreme Council in the early 1860's. He then changed the Supreme Council's By-Laws to allow the 33° to be conferred on any 32° Scottish Rite member as an honorary, no longer limiting it to voting members of the Supreme Council. Therefore, now, when a Brother receives the 33°, he becomes an Honorary Member of the Supreme Council. That's what the 33° is all about.

Your original post says that 33° Masons are rare, but in reality, those who possess the degree are quite easy to find. No one becomes a head of a bank by receiving the 33°. He simply becomes an Honorary Member of the Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite.

My Scottish Rite Temple currently has twenty-seven 33° members. One is a plumber, and another is a retired 11th grade Latin teacher. Still another is a minister in the Methodist Church.

delete double post

[edit on 2-2-2005 by Masonic Light]

Originally posted by Masonic Light


My Scottish Rite Temple currently has twenty-seven 33° members. One is a plumber

A plumber!!! Maybe MrNecros wasn't telling lies after all!!!

At the end of the day what it boils down to in my opinion, is that if people feel excluded from something, they always seem to decide that it's evil or bad.
It's like some sort of subconcious (though not always) childishness that if your not allowed to be part of the 'gang' and you don't know what they get up to there is some sort of desire to spread malicious rumours which propogate into rather fantastic 'facts'.
Admittedly I'm sure there are 'bad' freemasons, as there are bad people in any organisation or not all around the world.

I expect a lot of members not in RATS probably think RATS members are part of a secret cult bent on world domination - but it isn't true.

explain to me why 16 presidents were freemasons.

it means freemasonary has connections to the global cosnpiracy if 16 presidents were masons.

President = NWO agenda.

Masonic president = NWO agenda too and also means Free Masonary has connections to the NWO agenda.

Masonic Light you are a 32nd degree mason.... what part of the NWO agenda will you take up once you reach 33rd?

:

I usually like to write something, with some modicum of intelligence,
but I have to admit I'm stuck