The AI Threat Isn’t Skynet. It’s the End of the Middle Class

a reply to: soficrow

The 4th industrialisation is a special kind of terminator.

Indeed, all the evidence so far is that the benefits of the coming change will be concentrated among a relatively small elite, thus exacerbating the current trend towards greater levels of inequality.

This was a point stressed by the Swiss bank UBS in a report launched in Davos. It notes that there will be a “polarisation of the labour force as low-skill jobs continue to be automated and this trend increasingly spreads to middle class jobs.”

Fourth Industrial Revolution brings promise and peril for humanity

a reply to: intrptr

Dig. It just occurred to me it was exactly ten years ago I was preparing to release it (made it in 8 strenuous days).

That main "LOADING" visual stuff (that glues the segments together) was right from DARPA "IXo" office in their site. About 6 months after I released that I went and noticed they changed the name from Information eXploitation Office, to something else (the other 5 "Offices" were still the same.

originally posted by: underwerks
Capitalism will be the end of conservatism.

Kind of ironic.

Uh huh.

[hehehe]

originally posted by: underwerks
Capitalism will be the end of conservatism.

Kind of ironic.

True.

It will also be the end of most of the human race. Since the ultra rich elites that stand to benefit the most from this will no longer have need for the livestock.

a reply to: soficrow

MIT you say...

They have been arguing for a "minimum income" for a while. The thinking is people will take the money and better their station in life.

Both that economic idea and the AI idea of replacing middle class workers seems a bit short sighted. Kind of like how the Communists never saw the rise of the middle class; who can really predict how a society will change?

That is looking at things as they are now and all things being equal coming to that conclusion. Nothing is staying equal!! It looks like chaos with real doom and gloom results!

The pressure on the middle class is from taxation not AI. That is what I fear.

Dah-da-Dunn!!!

We will all be pawns, there will be ninety percent poppers and five percent elite. There will be no opportunity for anyone to get ahead. Even the few good jobs will be taken by those who suck up to the top elite, if they question anything, they can be replaced by any of the millions of unemployed.

This will be Like old Rome, a two class system with automation in the hands of a few.

a reply to: soficrow

Some of mankind's best achievements have came when you get other classes doing the work.

Ship's that carried aspiring people to America were built by commoners, a baker is useless without farmers... It's worth mentioning that mechanics freed up immense time and resources in the form of the windmill attached to a grinding stone.

Humans can be pretty smart when all our time isn't dedicated to the various methods of survival we've developed.

We'd still be building the rockets to get to the moon if it was not for machinery.

Machines may take our jobs but they'll never replace us.

Every leap has "classes" complaining that they'll be left behind, look at the clothing industry and we still have hand made designer clothes, they have a good demand.

Ultimately I look forward to the new mechanical revolution, at the same time though we need to safeguard our knowledge of how man did these things.

We don't want workhouses again either.

a reply to: soficrow

When work is not necessary Are the out of work humans necessary?

Even the value of money loses meaning not too far into the future.

Basically the economy will completely fall apart as we move forward. But if we plan it right we wont need money ever again.
thats using robots and AI to "do all the work"

of course back to the first statement.. At the very least those in power will be slowing birth rates as best they can.

And then what motivates us to get out of bed in the morning?


future looks nutty no matter how I try to make it work.

a reply to: Ohanka

The more I hear about this Oren Etzioni character the less I like him.

Yes. And this bit: “A universal basic income doesn’t give people dignity or protect them from boredom and vice,” Etzioni says.

True. A UBI gives people enough money to buy food, water and shelter, which in turn allows them to retain their dignity. What "protects" people from boredom and vice? Certainly not the government, starvation, dehydration and homelessness. Beyond that, who knows?

a reply to: soficrow

if corporations were receptive to doing it another way we would already be doing it that way, corporations only care about profits and the only place to get those profits from are the consumers.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Ohanka

Human element in the food service industry I think will survive in the long run.

I think I'll open a restaurant soon.

That's true. Eventually fast food restaurants will be fully automated, then they'll only need people to deliver the food to be cooked, then once fully automated semis become normal they won't need anyone.

I imagine there will always be a market for high level good food, especially as more places becomes automated. But then again you're going to pay extra for that too.

Food, music, art. That's about it.

originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: underwerks
Capitalism will be the end of conservatism.

Kind of ironic.

True.

It will also be the end of most of the human race. Since the ultra rich elites that stand to benefit the most from this will no longer have need for the livestock.

The rich will become the food before that happens.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: soficrow

Hi Soficrow!

“I am less concerned with Terminator scenarios - if current trends continue, people are going to rise up well before the machines do,” said MIT economist Andrew McAfee on the first day at Asilomar.

My counter is this.

Since machines are programmed to fulfill the tasks programmed into them by the overlords, they will make them more lethal and more numerous. Imagine swarms of micro drones unleashed on "riots" and or revolts, each a micro attack drone armed with a mall smart brain that seeks out and attaches to people in the crowd, detonating a small warhead, lethal injection, gas cloud, electric shock.

The options are pretty much endless, the clouds of swarming micro drones don't require airstrikes, tanks, helicopter gun ships, mines or boots on ground to be anywhere near the area targeted. In the future sic fi of Terminator, the "machines " are portrayed as huge tracked vehicles grinding thru the rubble like bulldozers, "John taught us ways to dust them".

Thats not possible with clouds of little screaming attack drones descending from 20000 feet, each programmed to seek out and kill one individual person in a crowd.

Most certainly a "sky net" approach and completely undeveloped as yet.

Or are they?

Oh yeah. Developed already. I especially like the living insect drones that are remotely controlled and equipped with those teensy-tiny little micro-packs.

But no, it's not SkyNet. Yet. Just crowd control.



[/sarcasm]

a reply to: Reverbs

What got the aristocracy and smart cats like Leonardo da Vinci out of bed?

Did the Pharaoh's get depressed due to success?

No they had all this free time to do crazy things like build temples, play with idea like the helicopter.

I'm optimistic.

originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: underwerks
Capitalism will be the end of conservatism.

Kind of ironic.

True.

It will also be the end of most of the human race. Since the ultra rich elites that stand to benefit the most from this will no longer have need for the livestock.

The rich will become the food before that happens.

Eww, I don't want to eat no 85 year old billionaire.

a reply to: soficrow

I'm not sure what news org produced the segment, but it was a 8-10 min piece on the coming revolution in job-killing robots...same actors involved in the research and development: MIT.

Here is a June, 2013 article from Technology Review remarking a lot of the same things about robotics: Job-killing Robots: At a Plant Near You Soon

The robotics department at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology is truly revolutionary - now they're mastering AI and telling us our jobs are going bye-bye.

It's coming folks and the solutions are few, if any. Do we want to live an economy where you can get Amazon Prime Now delivery within 2-4 hours? Do we want ever-increasingly, ubiquitous smart phones that can task our lives (e.g. actively do task for you that frees up/eliminates leisure/work time)??

What trade-offs are you willing to make? - is the key question here. How much do you need/want? How much can you go without?

Anyone willing to suggest a trade-off they would make in the face of ever-increasingly capable robotics and AI software??

I'd honestly give up my sovereign driving ability to driver-less cars if it meant less traffic. There's a trade-off off the top of my head...


ETA: Video of CBS News segment on the future of job-killing robots:

a reply to: soficrow

You would probably appreciate seeing this:

The Story of the Millennium: The AGI Manhattan Project:
Welcome to the Unpossible Future... The AGI Manhattan Project
CHAPTER 2 - Economic World War: Technocratic Plutocrat Elites vs. The People
CHAPTER 3 - The Global Meltdown of FEAR

My original 'legacy series' from mid-2010. Everything I worked towards during the decade. I had several other chapters up in the website I launches specifically for the project. But shortly after I got that far I had Youtube and my paid Photobucket accounts nuked with no route for redemption provided. Totally screwed the media in the bulk of the some 1,000 blog / forum etc posts I had made during those years (many of which had been reposted by others further and wider than I could ever really know).

originally posted by: BeefNoMeat
a reply to: soficrow

I'm not sure what news org produced the segment, but it was a 8-10 min piece on the coming revolution in job-killing robots...same actors involved in the research and development: MIT.

Here is June, 2013 article from Technology Review remarking a lot of the same things about robotics: Job-killing Robots At a Plant Near You Soon

The robotics department at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology is truly revolutionary - now they're mastering AI and telling us our jobs are going bye-bye.

It's coming folks and the solutions a few, if any. Do we want to live an economy where you can get Amazon Prime Now delivery within 2-4 hours? Do we want ever-increasingly, ubiquitous smart phones that can task our lives (e.g. actively do task for you that frees up/eliminates leisure/work time)??

What trade-offs are you willing to make? - is the key question here. How much do you need/want? How much can you go without?

Anyone willing to suggest a trade-off they would make in the face of ever-increasingly capable robotics and AI software??

I'd honestly give up my sovereign driving ability to driver-less cars if it meant less traffic. There's a trade-off off the top of my head...

I'd give up the "luxury" of having to take the overflowing, foul-smelling, easily breakable bin bag out to the curb quite happily, does that count?

originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: Ohanka

originally posted by: underwerks
Capitalism will be the end of conservatism.

Kind of ironic.

True.

It will also be the end of most of the human race. Since the ultra rich elites that stand to benefit the most from this will no longer have need for the livestock.

The rich will become the food before that happens.

Eww, I don't want to eat no 85 year old billionaire.

It's all about the marinade.

a reply to: soficrow

In 1994 I found a book titled "The End of Work" by Jeremy Rifkin. Stopped me dead in my tracks. It highlighted this very trend. In the past 20 years it is amazing to me that no major political leaders have addressed this astonishing issue. It is one of the reasons I came to know that both sides of the isle were lying sobs. Seems both sides are vying to be the boss of the poor remains of American society.