“Crimea was always Russian!” France’s Marine Le Pen schools CNN

a reply to: LuXTeN

Love it when someone speaks truth to "the media", especially when they do it so calmly causing such reactions as we see in Amanpour. Thanks for sharing!

Amanpour has CIA written all over her face, just like Anderson Cooper.

soulwaxer

a reply to: JimSmith

-- Foreign Relations -- Ukraine Giving Crimea to Ukraine Was Illegal, Russians Rule : Commonwealth: Parliament's vote brings tensions between the two powers close to the boiling point.

articles.latimes.com...

a reply to: 23432

You're wrong.

a reply to: soulwaxer

Yes and look who's she's married to, and who's administration she was loyal to.

Personal life. Amanpour is married to American James Rubin, a former US Assistant Secretary of State and spokesman for the US State Department during the Clinton administration and an informal adviser to former US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and to President Obama. Their son, Darius John Rubin, was born in 2000.

People like to remain blind to the facts though and CNN has admitted they hire cia agent's which people seem to willingly forget, like Cooper as you mentioned.

a reply to: LuXTeN

They said that in 1992 because they wanted it back. Does not change the fact that it was part of Ukraine for 40 years. It was not "always" Russian.

Now, if the people of Crimea truly want to separate from Ukraine, so be it.

a reply to: JimSmith

Illegally. Against the peoples wishes, many people had no idea it even took place.

People are mainly Russian there.

Let the People decide what they want, not some rich greedy arse.

I believe Bidens Son has his paws in it too, oh yes the Oil Industry.

Why would he be sticking his nose into what should never have been his to begin with?

Edit: wasn't oil but Gas.

Vice President Joe Biden's son joins Ukraine gas company. A review of the best commentary on and around the world... Burisma, a private oil and gas company in Ukraine, announced this week that it has appointed Hunter Biden, the youngest son of US Vice President Joe Biden, to its board of directors.May 14, 2014

a reply to: LuXTeN

The government did it. They could decide at the time.

I agree with you about the people deciding now.

a reply to: JimSmith

Yes. But many people at that time believed it was done illegally and unjustifiably. The US has been inching closer and closer to Russia for a while now, practically on it's border with the millitary. Soros has forever wanted Russia, and Putin kicked him out because he's not blind and can see what they're trying to do.

Hopefully all the nonsense will stop now, and the criminals, brought to justice.

The only thing that should matter..... is the PEOPLE of Crimea voted.... and they decided for themselves they were Russian not Ukrainian.

Screw the men is suits...... I'm for the unwashed masses

originally posted by: DISRAELI

originally posted by: brutus61
So should it be returned to Turkey? Should America be returned to my ancestors"American Indians"?

Without making any judgements about what should happen, I was disputing the use of the word "always".
This thread is in "History", not "Politics", and the statement including that word is not historically accurate.

pedantic.

a reply to: LuXTeN

Actually that's wrong too, it was 223 years ago. More to the point, Crimea was still peopled with Crimean Tartars after that point. It was an autonomous republic after the Russian Revolution and then after WWII, Stalin deported all the Crimean Tartars. 10-15 years after that Khrushchev gave Crimea to Ukraine. That was in the 50's. Ukraine gained its independence in 1991 with the dissolution of the Soviet Union. Two years later, Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum along with the US, UK, France and China which guaranteed territorial integrity.

Frankly, Marine Le Pen has no point. "It's alwas been Russian" is false no matter how you look at it.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Thanks for the mini history lesson. I understand however, It's still not set in stone either way you go.

Le Pen imo was speaking also for the People themselves, the ones who Voted to be part of Russia, the ones who speak Russian. And when i see people like Bidens Son with their paws in the honey jar, they have no reason to be there other than greed and power.

That and these Western gov has beens now, don't exactly have a clean track record for being honest and forthright.

I just think the People are being undermined, and their Vote was stolen from them.

originally posted by: paraphi

The fact that Le Pen's Font national part party is dependent of foreign (Russian) bank loans to support her 2017 campaigns may be the real cause of her outspoken views. This Russian support is evidenced fact.

So is the referendum that resulted in the Crimea CHOOSING to join Russia, rather than follow the direction Ukraine wanted to go. Nobody with any sense or logic would call that annexation.

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
3 seperate refferendums dispute the claim that " crimea was always russian "

She elaborated quite clearly to point out the Crimea people are Russian. Is that not true?

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
Let's ignore the semantics argument and get in to what Le Pen actually said. She refers to a coup that occurred in Ukraine. What coup would that be? Is it the one where the democratically elected voted to impeach Yanukovych? Last time I checked that wasn't a coup. Hell, Yanukovych's own party voted to impeach him. Even Russia acknowledged the legitimacy of that move and the subsequent elections.

That impeachment was complete after he was chased out of the country by a violent coupe

Then there's the case of the referendum. The OP keeps claiming that this was a democratic vote. Ignoring the fact that Russian soldiers were illegally patrolling the streets at the time and that there were no actual independent monitors present. Then there's the fact that following the referendum Russia's own Human Rights Council published numbers drastically different than what was reported. They found that only 30%-50% of the population voted and that only 50%-60% of these voters were actually in favor of the referendum. So in the end, at most, only 25% of the population actually cared enough to vote for annexation by Russia.

Do you have footage of those troops? If you can find it you will see that the people of Crimea were not even phased by hooded Russian soldiers walking around. I watched it myself but by all means, prove the soldiers were their with footage which will prove my point by default.

The soldiers were always there because they were allowed to be by c9ntract as Russia leased the ports from Ukraine.

And while I said I wasn't going to focus on semantics it should be pointed out that Crimea has only been Russian for less than 100 years. While Russia may have owned it for longer the population was primarily Tatar until Stalin's horrific plan to Russify the peninsula.

Let's be honest, Le Pen is just spouting Russian propaganda. National Front has been on the receiving end of Russian funds for a long time. It's primarily thanks to that money that Le Pen was able to distance the party from her Nazi sympathizing father.

What she is NOT doing is repeating western imperialist propaganda. She spoke the truth. The only ones that don't agree are the ones that foam from the mouth when they hear the name Putin. 80% approval rating and they still paint him as violent dictator that hurts his people.

Screw all of you guys. Genoa(red) has a claim for Crimea and Italy deserves its righteous land back!


According to video games I play(europa Universalis) Russia has a core claim on Crimea(used to own it for a while), along with crimean culture/peoples being russian. They have a pretty good claim. As does Ukraine, obviously.

It's a pretty good claim, Almost as good as Ireland's core claim on Northern Ireland.
If ireland was stronger than the UK they would likely take northern ireland back.

In situations like this in the game, most countries would not feel that Russia is being aggressive, the offending country would not incur a high aggressive expansion penalty.
Is it right or wrong? That's up for opinion. Or we could defer to might makes right in toss ups.

I would say this claim is about equal to the German claim for Alsace-Lorraine, if not a little higher.

originally posted by: everyone
pedantic.

I can only repeat what I said in a previous post;

In a discussion of history, getting as close to the truth as possible is good for its own sake.
In one of my old vacation jobs, one of my customers was a humourist who would look at the change I gave him and observe "Well, it's right- but only just." The difference between the right change and the wrong change was only half a penny, so that could have been called "hair-splitting".

I don't go for the modern sloppy illiteracy of calling everything you like "the best ever" and anything you don't like "the worst ever".
Getting things right is one way of "denying ignorance".

a reply to: LuXTeN

The People Voted Democratically!

Their voice was stiffled by the assholes who run the MSM and other asses with the Monetary funding to push 'their' note THEIR agendas upon anothers Sovereign and Demoratic turf. Not Cool!

I agree with you 100% on this.

But..since this is the History forum..

This:

Le Pen: Crimea was Russian. It has always been Russian

is not historically accurate.

This guy

ascended the throne after a long struggle against the khans of the Golden Horde for the independence of the Crimean Khanate

And later the Crimean Khanate was

formally annexed by the Russian Empire in 1783

originally posted by: Nikola014
Russia interferes in numerous democratic elections all across Europe?

Absolutely. Marine Le Pen is endorsing Russia's imperialistic position because she owes him money. She also needs to kow tow to him because Putin has another horse in the race, although the Establishment is putting up resistence.

Why do some people want to censor news agencies simply for reporting the truth?