Untaught History- Christians forced entire nations to convert at the point of a sword

originally posted by: TerriblePhoenix
a reply to: SoulSurfer

A Protestant owes his religion to Rome, if they are evil the Bible is not trustworthy because they controlled it for a VERY long time and assembled, edited it to its current fourth century form.

No Catholicism no Protestants, they wouldn't even exist and you would have no Bible, because without state sponsorship they were a myriad of sects all with different scripture and everything would be different if Christianity even survived.

So many religions did not survive because of Rome, you couldn't trust them then any more than now but less most likely.

yep -- jew here.

a reply to: TerriblePhoenix

Protestantism bypassed rome by going straight into translating from the original hebrews/greek. This undermined rome's authority. The fact is that Christianity existed before Catholicism was established. Emperor constantine took in real Christianity and mixed it with paganism. Which turned it into a babylonian cult in worship of idols.

Sorry I am dividing the lines here. Because the OP is wrong.

Here is the history behind the King James Bible. (the true word of God.)

a reply to: TerriblePhoenix

I call duality insanity for what it is and am not blind to the genocide that follows when the cancer is allowed to spread. Racism, Nationalism, Gender inequality are all manifestation of flawed dualistic ideas creating us vs them stories that can be used for justification of insane behavior.

A few examples:
Indian genocide by the Muslim.
Native American genocide by the Christians.
Enslavement and genocide by the Muslim and Christians in Africa.
Islam Jihad vs Christian Crusade killing each other.
Nazi killing Jews during the 2nd world war.
Wahabbi/Sunni/ISIS/US vs Shia/Russia/Syria in current middle east.

Plenty of religions have been able to limit duality in their teachings. Why are the Abrahamic religions so logically dualistic (us vs them thinking) compared to Buddhism/Taoism/Shinto/Sikhism/Hinduism/Jainism/Confucianism?

There are souls that are Christians, Jews and Muslim that are moral in spite of the duality hiding in the books since they see beyond the books and scripture.

Do not mistake me for an atheist. I know some of the effects of the "hidden normal".

a reply to: CB328

Wrong no matter how you slice it...even by the goings on of today - very similar.

None of us were alive then, so there is no reparations to make, only to try and educate people and avoid this from ANY group doing this now or in the future....

originally posted by: Dan00
a reply to: mysterioustranger

Right?

Why does no one call the Spaniards on the floor for that #?

It's like, "Why did you do this to us, White-People?", and I'm like, "I dunno, ask a Spaniard".

So weird.

You have a point. I sometimes think the Spanish zeal for Catholicism is based in their deadly interaction of over 800 years with Moors doing the same to them. Not that Rome didn't advocate it, because it did, but the fight of the Catholic in Spain was much more nasty than one endured by other Catholic areas.

I think part of it was that when the "new world" was found, Spain along with Rome decided it would be easier to plan long term goals in the America's that would be to slip down into North Africa and fight all the way down to Mecca. I think the idea was to expand in safety and then return to taking back ancient Roman territories. It backfired in some sense with the fall of the Byzantines but it is no accident that France, Italy, and Spain were allowed most of the colonies in that area as the Ottoman empire was failing.

Speaking of, one wonders what the world would be now had the Dutch and English been more interested in converting their colonies to Protestant religions.

a reply to: teddyvetter

Anyone can look this up!!!! its catholic theology which they have not renounced, but just simply they have not pushed this teaching as it would go against their ecumenical movement they started with vatican II. This movement was to lay aside the sword publicly and subvert the protestant teachings from the inside and slowly destroy/bring Protestantism back into the catholic church. The inquisition however NEVER ended.... if you dig into the wars of modern times, you will ALWAYS find the catholic church involved....

Seven Cultural Mountains: The Dominionists


Has nothing AT ALL to do with the Catholic church - even renounces them (like you do) - but still the same "I'm right and you're wrong" bullsHYTE.

Every school history class talks about the mass death christians caused in the crusades and new world

Yes, but do they tell people that they did the same thing in their own countries??? I never heard that before, with the exception of the cathars and others in the spanish inquisition, but apparently they were killing people almost since the beginning, and not just in foreign lands.

Hello,
so, I'm from Germany, I went to school in the early 1980s till 1990 and yes - it was a subject in History.
We learned about Britannia, Charlemagne Christianised the Germanic world … Later it was the conquest of the new world; South America ... It was no secret, we learned about all this in school.

originally posted by: CB328
It's really strange that we never hear about this in history,

originally posted by: CB328

Every school history class talks about the mass death christians caused in the crusades and new world

Yes, but do they tell people that they did the same thing in their own countries??? I never heard that before, with the exception of the cathars and others in the spanish inquisition, but apparently they were killing people almost since the beginning, and not just in foreign lands.

Actually I don't think I was taught the Crusades in school. And, I work for the Anglican Church and none of that stuff ain't ever talked about not even when they're talking about the Christians currently being persecuted there. I learnt about the Spanish Inquisition first from Mel Brooks, then from Monty Python and finally I got some books.

What I learnt in school history lessons can be summarised as Tudors and Stuarts, a bit about the Romans, First World War, Imperial India and the Storming of the Golden Temple. There was a little dressing in between, but that is about it really. It's surprising how little gets covered, but you'd have to be a little uncurious to not know that "seek and ye shall find". It is all reasonably accessible, should you be curious enough.

John 1
In the beginning was the Word. And the Word was with God, and the Word was God, and the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us. God has no mother. What did the Word say?

Matthew 12
Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

and in Deuteronomy 4:16
so that you do not become corrupt and make for yourselves an idol, an image of any shape, whether formed like a man or a woman,

Both of my Grandmothers were born Roman Catholics. One was exposed to the Word of God in her 20s and accepted Christ as her personal Savior. The other accepted Christ on her death bed.

My Armenian family lived at mount Ararat in Harput Turkey. They were not religious at all. They did however listen to a Prophecy that was read to them in a tent meeting. It was written by a Pentecostal 11 year old Russian child that could not read or write, and followed the instructions, coming to America and heading to the west coast.

All that stayed behind, (even some Christians, that jeered when they left) were slaughtered to the tune of 1.5 million. We were spared. They accepted Christ as their Savior after they arrived in America. As Armenians, we are Old testament people and are living in bible times right now.

God speaks to his people to this day. Those who have accepted Christ as their personal Savior

originally posted by: CB328
So, I've heard a little about this in recent years but never in much detail. After seeing it mentioned in a video today I started Googling it and sure enough, there is a fair amount of information about how the Christians in Roman and later times forced many tribes and nations to convert to Christianity and killed a lot of people who resisted in the process.

It's really strange that we never hear about this in history, and of course you won't hear it in church that's for sure. The more I compare Christian (and Jewish) and Pagan beliefs the more I think that the pagan ones are better. At least they're based on real things and address real issues of people surviving in the world instead of imaginary beings and whose imaginary beings are better than who's.

I guess one needs to look at humans in general. We are not very nice to say the least, but when you look at religious vs non-religious horrendous events in our history you will see that we could label events evil on both sides. Human nature is the diver in all these events, but there is a slight difference. With most religions there is a initial foundation of good morals for their time. I say for their time, because good morals 500 years ago were different than to day, hell even 50 years ago there are differences. What we have seen throughout history is that religion drifts off the moral compass, but then once again gets back on course to just have those peaky humans drift it off once again. with rinse and repeat.

When we look at history for the worst human events we find that the non-religious events really went off the moral compass with nothing to fall back on for correction. WWII, Pol Pot, China's industrial age, Stalin, Genghis Khan etc were all extremely non-religious events that dwarfed anything religion has done. The Roman's in general were a conquering nation long before Christianity came about, so I would not say Christianity changed them in a bad way. Also I'm not sure your point in all this since Christianity was only the main religion in the last 100 years of that empire and at the time they had already lost large areas to the Huns. So who were these tribes and nations they forced to Christianity or killed. I'm sure the Huns were a rather nasty group too.

a reply to: CB328

Any religion that has engaged in killing, whether past of present, is NOT something I believe has any connection to a loving or peaceful God. What better way to covertly control ones mind? Most founders or leaders of these religions are living the life of luxury while their poor well intentioned followers continue to give of themselves and whatever little they have hoping it's a path to the pearly gates of heaven.

I've met many faithful church going people in my day. I know first hand the hypocrisy of religion since I grew up attending a Catholic private school and was an alter boy for 5 years. Heck, I served mass 5 days out of the week! Through the years I saw how priests lived better than many of the people in their congregation. I watched how many faithful church goers went through the motions and acted like zombies reciting and reading the rosary like daily rituals. I started to realize how much religion controlled the minds of these people! Many of them were much bigger sinners than those who were not daily church goers! The priests and nuns were mean and they thought nothing of disciplining kids physically. Even the bible has many questionable passages and many that have been eliminated because it didn't conform to religious ideology.

Wars and cults have a basis in religious doctrine. That alone is enough for me to live my life the best I can without the crutch of religion. I don't need a minister, priest or preacher to tell me how to lead a loving and caring life for my family and fellow man. Sure I'm not perfect, but I believe we're on this earth to learn lessons from our mistakes. I know my faults and I recognize and try to overcome these faults on my own. It's why we are given free will. There are kind souls everywhere who don't follow a religious ideology. Religious leaders are made of flesh and blood and have faults just like the rest of us.

What I find ridiculous is when the elderly start attending church and start reading the bible. They want to make sure they're in good with God before they die. Really??? Are they trying to fool God and pretend they were always faithful in their religious beliefs?

I would think humanity looking back at the cruel history of religion, would realize what a con game religion truly is.

www.youtube.com...



SPAIN , did a Number ,

as did many others ... Like France England and it Crusades !

Witch !!
She's a witch!
www.youtube.com...

originally posted by: Xtrozero
When we look at history for the worst human events we find that the non-religious events really went off the moral compass with nothing to fall back on for correction.

That is a really good point actually, and a hard one to swallow I think for some of us. I don't suppose it is as simple as there being a lack of religion, so much as there being a rejection of it, leading to a throwing of the baby out with the bath water.

This article is a perfect example of why it is of the utmost importance to have incredible, positive, amazing, intelligent and educational parenting as you are growing up. An awesome Parent or Parents will inform you that not all that is taught in public or even private schools is accurate and valid. Of course Jesus never killed anyone if they didn't convert! Of course Jesus didn't and to this day does not force anyone to convert! Of course one of the greatest Pagan religions that began during the 3rd century A.D and exists even today are the ones that mask themselves as " Christians" and carry out all these demonic acts of torture, murder, slavery and deceit in the name of " Christ". The Catholic Religion is responsible for more death and heartache that the world has ever seen. Any Bible reader and true follower of Jesus Christ understands this. Jesus said of Himself, " I am The Way, The Truth and The Life. No man cometh unto the Father except through me". Neither the Vatican, Pope, Mary worship, prayers to Saints, Rosary's, Catechism, confession to priests, etc. Etc is found anywhere in the word of God. The murder, death and destruction that comes out of this pagan Religion is directed by the one and only individual that sits at the head of this deceptive organization:. The one and only, Pope. There are one billion Catholics in the world, it is said- or one billion individuals that are not reading the Word of God.

It was no secret, we learned about all this in school.

Maybe in Germany they teach it, but not in the US. Here they're teaching that the founding fathers were capitalists.

originally posted by: Anaana

That is a really good point actually, and a hard one to swallow I think for some of us. I don't suppose it is as simple as there being a lack of religion, so much as there being a rejection of it, leading to a throwing of the baby out with the bath water.

Religion is just apart of who we are as humans. Good or bad it is a fundamental aspect of our species. It is apart of what separates us from other animals, and though one might at first think it is our intelligence or Thumbs that makes us different, it really isn't. What truly makes us human is our ability to think in the abstract. We do it so much we spend 80% of our thoughts in the abstract world. You can't even make breakfast without first abstractly creating it. Look around, EVERYTHING was an abstract thought at one time before it became reality. This ability of ours allows us to create things in our own heads first before they are proven to be real. Faith is a result of abstract thinking, so the remove religion you would need to remove what makes us human too.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
Religion is just apart of who we are as humans. Good or bad it is a fundamental aspect of our species. The reason is it is apart of what separates us from other animals, and though one might suggest our intelligence or Thumbs, but that really isn't it. What truly makes us human is our ability to think in the abstract. We do it so much we spend 80% of our thoughts in the abstract world. You can't even make breakfast without first abstractly creating it. Look around, EVERYTHING was an abstract thought at one time before it became reality. This ability of ours allows us to create things in our own heads first before they are proven to be real. Faith is a result of abstract thinking, so the remove religion you would need to remove what makes us human too.

I am not sure I would phrase it like that but I do understand what you mean, whether I agree with it to the full extent you take it...I am much less sure about. Everything, or everything as I perceive it?

originally posted by: SoulSurfer
Protestantism bypassed rome by going straight into translating from the original hebrews/greek.....

Here is the history behind the King James Bible. (the true word of God.)

The true word of God? Really? And they translated from the original Hebrew/Greek? Care to reference your statement?

The King James Bible was based on previous English translations and Greek versions from 12th century, 12th century, that's not original at all. ( LINK )

What's funny is that the original 1611 King James Bible included the Apocrypha books because of the influence the Roman Catholic church held over England in 1611. They were then removed in the 4th edition in 1769, to make it less Catholic.

So I guess the original King James was not the 'true word of God' but the edited version was?

LOL