The Constitution lets the electoral college choose the winner. They should choose Clinton.

a reply to: spiritualzombie

No, just the majority of the state that Trump won for the Republican party making them in charge of the entire government are the ones that think is good for the job.


I guess popularity didn't gave the Democrats any majority seats in congress.

Long live the Republic.

a reply to: RickinVa

Uhm - no.

Congress certifies the election. If one candidate gets the 270 electoral votes as required, Congress cant overturn it. The US House can only get involved if no candidates receive 270 electoral votes from the EC on the 19th. Even then Congress will vote to name the next president however they can only choose from the top 3 candidates who received the most electoral votes. In this case Clinton and Trump would be there only choices..

If a candidate receives 270+ electoral votes on the 19th Congress has no authority to get involved. They must certify the election. They cannot change the result of the electoral college. If Congress does what you are suggesting it would be a text book definition of a coup d'état.

Education have failed in America

What is the Electoral College?,

The Electoral College consists of 538 electors. A majority of 270 electoral votes is required to elect the President. Your state’s entitled allotment of electors equals the number of members in its Congressional delegation: one for each member in the House of Representatives plus two for your Senators. Read more about the allocation of electoral votes.

www.archives.gov...

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: RickinVa

Uhm - no.

Congress certifies the election. If one candidate gets the 270 electoral votes as required, Congress cant overturn it. The US House can only get involved if no candidates receive 270 electoral votes from the EC on the 19th. Even then Congress will vote to name the next president however they can only choose from the top 3 candidates who received the most electoral votes. In this case Clinton and Trump would be there only choices..

If a candidate receives 270+ electoral votes on the 19th Congress has no authority to get involved. They must certify the election. They cannot change the result of the electoral college. If Congress does what you are suggesting it would be a text book definition of a coup d'état.

It's a moot point... not enough EC votes will flip that will make a difference.

I would love to see 10 - 15 idiots flip their votes so that issue can be addressed before the 2020 elections.

Not only can Hillary lose the election... she can do something positive and get the EC rules revamped.

The Congress is scheduled to meet in joint session in the House of Representatives on January 6, 2017 to conduct the official tally of electoral votes. The Vice President, as President of the Senate, is the presiding officer. Two tellers are appointed to open, present and record the votes of the States in alphabetical order. The President of the Senate announces the results of the vote and declares which persons, if any, have been elected President and Vice President of the United States. The results are entered into the official journals of the House and Senate. The President of the Senate then calls for objections to be made. If any objections are registered, they must be submitted in writing and be signed by at least one member of the House and Senate. The House and Senate would withdraw to their respective chambers to consider the merits of any objections according the procedure set out under 3 U.S.C. section 15.

Looks to me that objections can be made regardless of the 270 count or not.

a reply to: RickinVa

In order to push the vote to the House enough electoral votes would need to be dropped to bring Trump down to 269. Even then its not enough to swing the election to Clinton. She would need 68 electoral votes to flip from Trump to her to reach 270.

So if it goes to the House (if neither get 270) do you think the Republicans, who control both houses, are going to give it to Clinton?

When the EC votes and Trump hits the magic number Congress has to certify the election and cannot interfere. So in that regard the election is over and Trump will be our next President.

for those keeping count -
He will be our 45th President by term.
He will be our 44th President by persons holding the office.

ETA -
Members can make objections however they cannot take electoral votes away.
3 USC 15 - Counting electoral votes in Congress

When all objections so made to any vote or paper from a State shall have been received and read, the Senate shall thereupon withdraw, and such objections shall be submitted to the Senate for its decision; and the Speaker of the House of Representatives shall, in like manner, submit such objections to the House of Representatives for its decision; and no electoral vote or votes from any State which shall have been regularly given by electors whose appointment has been lawfully certified to according to section 6 of this title from which but one return has been received shall be rejected, but the two Houses concurrently may reject the vote or votes when they agree that such vote or votes have not been so regularly given by electors whose appointment has been so certified. If more than one return or paper purporting to be a return from a State shall have been received by the President of the Senate, those votes, and those only, shall be counted which shall have been regularly given by the electors who are shown by the determination mentioned in section 5 of this title to have been appointed, if the determination in said section provided for shall have been made, or by such successors or substitutes, in case of a vacancy in the board of electors so ascertained, as have been appointed to fill such vacancy in the mode provided by the laws of the State; but in case there shall arise the question which of two or more of such State authorities determining what electors have been appointed, as mentioned in section 5 of this title, is the lawful tribunal of such State, the votes regularly given of those electors, and those only, of such State shall be counted whose title as electors the two Houses, acting separately, shall concurrently decide is supported by the decision of such State so authorized by its law; and in such case of more than one return or paper purporting to be a return from a State, if there shall have been no such determination of the question in the State aforesaid, then those votes, and those only, shall be counted which the two Houses shall concurrently decide were cast by lawful electors appointed in accordance with the laws of the State, unless the two Houses, acting separately, shall concurrently decide such votes not to be the lawful votes of the legally appointed electors of such State. But if the two Houses shall disagree in respect of the counting of such votes, then, and in that case, the votes of the electors whose appointment shall have been certified by the executive of the State, under the seal thereof, shall be counted. When the two Houses have voted, they shall immediately again meet, and the presiding officer shall then announce the decision of the questions submitted. No votes or papers from any other State shall be acted upon until the objections previously made to the votes or papers from any State shall have been finally disposed of.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 644, 62 Stat. 675.)

the objections are based on the legitimacy of the electors themselves. If the electors were legally placed in their position and the electors followed the law set forth by their state the objection goes no where and the electoral vote stands.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: RickinVa

In order to push the vote to the House enough electoral votes would need to be dropped to bring Trump down to 269. Even then its not enough to swing the election to Clinton. She would need 68 electoral votes to flip from Trump to her to reach 270.

So if it goes to the House (if neither get 270) do you think the Republicans, who control both houses, are going to give it to Clinton?

When the EC votes and Trump hits the magic number Congress has to certify the election and cannot interfere. So in that regard the election is over and Trump will be our next President.

for those keeping count -
He will be our 45th President by term.
He will be our 44th President by persons holding the office.

You're saying what I have been saying.....Trump wins no matter what at this point. It's not even in the realm of possibilities that Clinton would be elected.

People don't even stop to think that if the Clinton campaign thought there was even a tiny weeny smidgen of hope..they would be busy selecting cabinet positions and what not.

I do not see any such activity from the Clinton campaign... they know it is over and has been over since Nov 8.

a reply to: RickinVa

My response and argument was based on your comment saying the Congress could change the results of the electoral college. I was saying if a candidate reaches 270 in the EC Congress cant make changes.

a reply to: spiritualzombie

Again with the popular vote... The national popular vote is much voting for the prettiest girl in school...totally without merit or any importance of any sort.

State popular vote, on the other hand, is of great importance, and Trump won there by enough to take the necessary electoral votes to become our next President. I could, and do, wish it were otherwise, after all, I didn't vote for the man. But it is what it is, and no amount of bitching and moaning about it is going to change it.

The simple solution is this: Run a better candidate next time. I wonder how many Dems are saying to themselves "We should have run Sanders, instead." He would have won--which would have been unfortunate, too, but I digress--probably by a landslide.

The Democratic party needs to take a long hard look in the mirror, and maybe take a bit of a swerve back towards the middle. Shake loose some of the fringe left that seem to have taken root like a tick--and given what I've seen of the inner workings of the party, I'd say that tick is carrying Rocky Mountain spotted fever.

The Democrats, and the independents, failed to give anything resembling an acceptable alternative to Trump. Lacking that alternative, voters--the majority of them by state--chose Trump. You don't like it, I don't like it, lots of people don't like it, to which I say "So?". He's going to be President. Get over it. Sooner, rather than later.

Rather than denigrating those who voted for him, how about instead, y'all dig your collective heads out of your collective asses and work to mitigate the damage you're all so terrified he's going to inflict upon the country, world, and the Universe (given the stridency of some of the rhetoric...)?

But it's much easier to make stupid you tube videos accusing him of all sorts of things, or post on line about how evil he is, or the mental state of his child... That would fall under the aegis of "Politics of Destruction", would they not? I thought the Dems, and their fellows, didn't do that? After all, that's what that evil bastard Trump does, and you all would never, not in a million years, play his game, would you?

But, hey, what ever gets you through your day. More and more evidence that there really is not a great deal of difference between the parties where is really counts, in the soul.

originally posted by: seagull

The Democrats, and the independents, failed to give anything resembling an acceptable alternative to Trump. Lacking that alternative, voters--the majority of them by state--chose Trump. You don't like it, I don't like it, lots of people don't like it, to which I say "So?". He's going to be President. Get over it. Sooner, rather than later.

actually they did - Bernie Sanders. Had the Democratic primary not been rigged for Clinton I believe Sanders would have been the nominee and I believe he would of had enough support to beat Trump.

I find it disturbing they are willingly able to ignore that fraud in their own party and then try to argue the popular vote count when it has nothing to do with electing the President.

a reply to: Xcathdra

I'm not sure I would have found Sanders an acceptable alternative to she who shall never be named, again. But, yes, they had an opportunity to run him. Chicanery derailed that, and karma took care of the rest.

As I said above, the Democrats, at all levels, need to take a long hard look in the mirror. An honest one.

I am a democrat--registered and everything. I've taken part in local, and state conventions as a delegate. But in the nine Presidential elections I've voted in, I've voted for the Democratic candidate only once--Bill Clinton the first time. ...and I've found over the years, that I've been shunted to the fringe of the party while another fringe has seemingly taken over. I am, as odd as it may sound, a conservative Democrat--think Sam Nunn, Henry Jackson and you'll be close enough for going on with.

Considering who the Democrat's top two choices were, I can safely say that those Democrats like myself have been totally marginalized and rendered helpless. Is it any wonder that we've begun voting elsewhere? We didn't leave the party, the party left us. No ones fault but our own, we allowed the fringe voices from the far left to do it to us. It's one of the reasons I'd hoped the libertarian party would do better...but they insisted upon running Johnson, again. Thus, they didn't even garner four percent, much less the necessary five to qualify for matching funds. I was hoping that this would be a wake up call for the Democrats--but given what I've heard/read so far, I expect nothing more than a further swerve to the left by the megalomaniacs in charge of the party. They've lost the White House, and Congress, and will, in all likelihood, lose the left wing majority in the Supreme Court. The majority of state governors are GOP, as are the State houses, as well.



(((((APPLAUSE!!!)))))



Well done, Democrats... Well done!! If these results don't tell you something is desperately wrong within the party, then you guys and gals are orders of magnitude more stupid than even I gave you credit for.

Again, well done.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: RickinVa

My response and argument was based on your comment saying the Congress could change the results of the electoral college. I was saying if a candidate reaches 270 in the EC Congress cant make changes.

But it can be objected too... and the objections must be addressed by Congress.

I would assume that some Democrats will "symbolically" object to this election, even though they know are out numbered and have no hope.

Hypothetically, IF enough EC votes were flipped to give Clinton 270.... the republicans would rightfully object on Jan 6. How those objections would play out is beyond my knowledge.

Edit: I have expanded my knowledge:

history.house.gov...

Objections

Objections Since 1887, 3 U.S.C. 15 sets the method for objections to electoral votes. During the Joint Session, Members of Congress may object to individual electoral votes or to state returns as a whole. An objection must be declared in writing and signed by at least one Representative and one Senator. In the case of an objection, the Joint Session recesses and each chamber considers the objection separately in a session which cannot last more than two hours with each Member speaking for no more than five minutes. After each house votes on whether or not to accept the objection, the Joint Session reconvenes and both chambers disclose their decisions. If they agree to the objection, the votes in question are not counted. If either chamber does not agree with the objection, the votes are counted.

So it would appear that if enough votes got flipped, any objections were made and upheld, then those electoral votes would be tossed...if it dropped Trump below 270... then Congress would decide the President, which would be Trump.

a reply to: RickinVa

The objections though are based on the elector themselves. If an elector is valid there is nothing that can be done about it and their vote cant be changed by Congress. Its in the code i linked.

a reply to: Xcathdra

During the Joint Session, Members of Congress may object to individual electoral votes or to state returns as a whole.

history.house.gov...

It has happened twice before but did not get support of both houses which is needed to nullify an individual electoral vote or a states electoral votes.

So Congress could technically toss out contested individual electoral votes that are flipped against the popular vote of that state... or all of that states electoral votes.


Congress has the power to nullify Electoral Votes,, they have had it a long long long time... it just never gets used.

a reply to: spiritualzombie


Read the last couple of lines again.
The adults didnt have to "like" Trump.
I work with plenty of people who I cant stand to actually be around, but I have to work with them and we are after all on the same team. I dont have to "like" them. Thats what adults do, we suck it up and keep going.
We dont sit on our hands a cry like toddlers. Those of us who could not stand Obama sucked it up for the last 8 years and we had people in congress who resisted his radical socialist agenda and prevented as much of it as possible. So he ruled by executive action, and now that we have another election and have a different President in place we are expecting those executive actions to be removed and return this country back to its capitalist, and constitutional roots.

Regarding the Majority of the country.
Who's going to be President in January?

a reply to: RickinVa

Good luck getting enough members in both houses to agree to reject electoral votes after a limited 2 hour debate.

a reply to: RickinVa

Historically congress will not do such a thing, the same way that they would not touch constitutional issues and let the supreme court interpret the constitution as it stands.

In other words, is not going to happen

originally posted by: RazorV66

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
a reply to: keenmachine

Hillary didn't excite enough people but she wasn't bad... and she certainly isn't the Nazi Trump is. And I don't really care if you feel understood. Like a petulant little child who voted the bad guy, no matter how bad he got, just to prove you were willing to throw it all away. Nothing to respect there. It's pretty dumb actually. To basically say, I don't care about what's right or wrong or good or evil, I'll vote for the racist, xenophobic hate monger who promises all manner of pain -- just to throw that fit.

You can't make that move and expect to be called smart. You can't regurgitate fake news headlines and expect to be respected.

You guys are willing to trash the country because you thought it was so bad-- and now that we have commander in douche, ready to deport and racially profile and the White Supremacists are happy... you look at those who are hurting at what was lost-- how low Trump's supporters were willing to go.... and it's really sad, really pathetic and dumb.

And the childish threats-- if you keep calling us stupid we'll Keep doing it! What a little spoiled sh#t.

I can tick off at least 5 things in your post that is regurgitating fake news headlines -
1. Trump is a Nazi
2. Trump is a racist
3. Trump is xenophobic
4. Trump is a hate monger
5. Trump likes White Supremacists to be happy

Each post you type in this whopper of a thread you made, gets goofier by the minute and it shows how low Hillary supporters are willing to go.
You are really fu*king grasping at straws, hoping and praying that your Queen will somehow reach the White House, which by the way, she did nothing in 30 years to merit getting there. She doesn't merit cleaning the toilets in the WH.
It's really sad, really pathetic and really, really dumb.
Who is willing to trash the country? The Libtard Dems, that's who....you should feel really lucky that she got the votes that she did and get on with your lives under President Trump....he will help all Americans, even mentally ill Liberals.

you hit the nail on the head and yet someone a page or two ago referred to his or her posts as logic. these threads will get us no where. The hillary supporters will always consider themselves the intelligent, informed, enlightened logical thinkers and trump supporters followers of fake news as well as many of the colorful names that have been used in this thread. On top of that they will never see their hypocritical behavior calling me a spoiled sh#t. The sheer desperation reeks and gets worse by the day.

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
Lol right... Popular Vote goes to him when you factor in 'fake news'. Try again.

"Fake news" Haha it's like you're a walking talking MSM zombie. Same fake news are the ones who were not surprised when Trump won, while you were

Clearly they are bothered by the loss.

Lol. It's pretty obvious that you are the one bothered (not to say TRIGGERED) by the loss, friend-o.

The fact that not even those 3M illegal voters helped your precious corrupt candidate win is beyond hilarious, and also the reason for your silly daily panic threads. Better accept it bud.

Or maybe you're just doing it for the attention. Can't tell by now, it's as if you're still waiting for a CTR paycheck. Cut it out m8 it just looks absurd.

originally posted by: keenmachine
you hit the nail on the head and yet someone a page or two ago referred to his or her posts as logic. these threads will get us no where. The hillary supporters will always consider themselves the intelligent, informed, enlightened logical thinkers.

Best approach would be to simply look back at their posts and laugh after they have been proven wrong. Polling threads are my favorite (if you really wanna enjoy a laugh, search for a thread called "trump has no real path to win").

As for the part where they declare they are the intelligent types.. These declarations are pretty much most the time made by people who are College burn-outs, Liberal Arts majors etc.
Hell they even refer to Trump as a loser even after he won the election. A billionaire POTUS, loser. And they are the intelligent ones.

originally posted by: keenmachine

originally posted by: RazorV66

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
a reply to: keenmachine

Hillary didn't excite enough people but she wasn't bad... and she certainly isn't the Nazi Trump is. And I don't really care if you feel understood. Like a petulant little child who voted the bad guy, no matter how bad he got, just to prove you were willing to throw it all away. Nothing to respect there. It's pretty dumb actually. To basically say, I don't care about what's right or wrong or good or evil, I'll vote for the racist, xenophobic hate monger who promises all manner of pain -- just to throw that fit.

You can't make that move and expect to be called smart. You can't regurgitate fake news headlines and expect to be respected.

You guys are willing to trash the country because you thought it was so bad-- and now that we have commander in douche, ready to deport and racially profile and the White Supremacists are happy... you look at those who are hurting at what was lost-- how low Trump's supporters were willing to go.... and it's really sad, really pathetic and dumb.

And the childish threats-- if you keep calling us stupid we'll Keep doing it! What a little spoiled sh#t.

I can tick off at least 5 things in your post that is regurgitating fake news headlines -
1. Trump is a Nazi
2. Trump is a racist
3. Trump is xenophobic
4. Trump is a hate monger
5. Trump likes White Supremacists to be happy

Each post you type in this whopper of a thread you made, gets goofier by the minute and it shows how low Hillary supporters are willing to go.
You are really fu*king grasping at straws, hoping and praying that your Queen will somehow reach the White House, which by the way, she did nothing in 30 years to merit getting there. She doesn't merit cleaning the toilets in the WH.
It's really sad, really pathetic and really, really dumb.
Who is willing to trash the country? The Libtard Dems, that's who....you should feel really lucky that she got the votes that she did and get on with your lives under President Trump....he will help all Americans, even mentally ill Liberals.

you hit the nail on the head and yet someone a page or two ago referred to his or her posts as logic. these threads will get us no where. The hillary supporters will always consider themselves the intelligent, informed, enlightened logical thinkers and trump supporters followers of fake news as well as many of the colorful names that have been used in this thread. On top of that they will never see their hypocritical behavior calling me a spoiled sh#t. The sheer desperation reeks and gets worse by the day.

In other words -
The village idiot comes to the right conclusion before the Nobel Laureate.