Lies Should be a Crime

a reply to: reldra

How about reading the words I wrote? I'm not talking about "little white lies", I'm talking about misleading lies, lies meant to take something from you and benefit the liar, lies meant to convince you to believe the lie and perpetuate it ignorantly and lies that do damage or allow continued damage. There are obviously millions of examples so I'm trying not to use one (and I like to use examples).

Again...especially in government. You elect someone you trust to do what they promised they will do. If they lie and break that "contract", they should be removed if they knowingly lied to "steal" your vote. When you hire a person, you are trusting them to perform an action. If they prove distrustful...they are no longer someone you can trust and therefore, aren't someone you would hire in the first place.

Yes...an example. But hopefully benign enough to make the point without opening specific lie classifications.

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
I offer this in response. When you are in court, when questioned by the FBI, sometimes when questioned by police, etc...if you lie, you will be punished. Maybe even jailed. I simply believe that if lying to authority figures is illegal...it should be illegal in general. And again...I'm not talking about what we call "white lies" that can do no harm or not cause others to react in a way harmful to themselves or others...I'm talking about lies cause damage or benefit the liar.

But from the responses...I'm one of the few who believe this. Interesting and educational to me.

Little white lies would benefit you too.

The common example:

Wife says "does this dress make me look fat?"

Husband says, "No, of course not."

The dress, even if the woman is thin, may cause her to look heavy...say it is an odd design. The husband makes her feel better and avoids making her feel bad or angry toward him.

Well...here we go. Yeah, the man in your example may be considered nice to provide this "little white lie". He was simply trying to not hurt the woman's feelings. But at the same time, he is convincing her to go to the club (or whereever) wearing something and causing her to look in a way she obviously doesn't want to look. Maybe for a job interview where it may matter (not that it should...but it happens).

If I'm going to a meeting and put on a "LIBERALS SUCK" t-shirt and ask my wife if this looks appropriate...she would be doing me a disservice to not point out the obvious problem and the aftermath.

The obvious difference being a lie that can cause damage, versus one that can not "what a pretty baby". But people aren't smart enough to gauge the long-term potential damage or the real reason for asking. If you simply don't lie and maybe say "I think your blue dress would look better"...we solve the problem...and we don't lie.

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
a reply to: Jefferton

Prove it! Show me where I have known the truth...but said otherwise. I challenge you!!

You must lie on occasion. Even little white lies. I sometimes stretch the truth in order to not argue or to not make someone feel bad.

I don't and won't intentionally say something I know is not true. I use the words "as far as I know", "I believe...", "in my opinion...", etc. Have I maybe missed a few? Possible but not that I'm aware of and if I were made to be aware...I would admit and apologize. Everything to me...and I mean everything, is a chess game or move. I contemplate, consider and think before acting. And yes...I learned this many, many years ago before I adopted this during a time that lying caused me far more harm than good. Lesson learned.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I understand what you are saying, especially when it comes to our elected representatives. I have also heard that "they" lie all the time. Do you have a log of these lies where "they" have gained out of it, and i am talking about confirmed provable lies, somewhere in this format:-

Lie =
Truth =
Advantage of Lie =
Disadvantage of truth =

Only then could i begin to digest if the Lie or Truth was beneficial at the time or would it have been best to say nothing at all.

OP, I so agree with you.

I spent over a decade closely associated with an habitual liar (and my employer could lie very brazenly if it suited her too. Contradict her and she'd shout you down).

I spent years on edge with the suspicion that I was being lied to - and lied to for no good reason, either.

When the awful truth, whatever it was, eventually came out I'd deal with the problem and only complain about the lying. Even the liar admitted that I was a reasonable person and that it would be easier to make me aware of things before they got too bad. And yet still the lies continued.

The liars I've known haven't been to honest in other ways either. If you find yourself associating with a liar I'd advise keeping a close eye on your money. Don't leave it unattended.

Besides it being so draining when you're suspicious of a person all the time, there's the guilt to consider. That's the guilt you feel for not believing someone. Surely, one time or another they have to be telling the truth. How awful will you feel if you falsely accuse them?

If only liars could be made to understand the damage they do to those around them. Is causing all that mental anguish to other people really worth it because they can't take a (probably well-deserved) telling off?

I agree OP, the thing about lying today and i don't completely agree with, is, when it comes from the Gov etc, were expected to hear lies and think nothing off it, except, we know were all being deceived.

In general, we are all in some way lying to others/ourselves all the time, as another poster mentioned, possibly 200+ times a day, now that seems a stretch but possible for others to do, very easily... Lies have a few purposes, 1, lie to help others with a hard situation (saying they didn't see anything etc), 2, lies to deceive others into or out of a given situation (into doing something they normally wouldn't do or out off something they want to do), 3, lies that can be a conscious/subconscious thought process and (have some idea of what they lied about or didn't know they lied about enabling them to believe thayr own lies)..Plus others i suppose.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I would agree with you at least in the realm of government and media. I would like to see some consequences for the news sights that lie about a candidate to further another's chances for starters. Didn't there used to be laws that kept the media from flat out making # up?

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Things re so bad that the only thing politicians can do is lie.

If they told the truth, they'd be ousted.

That being said, it's about time for some frank honesty. Our snowflake culture is just going to have to deal with it.

Have you not seen the world today?
There would be no one left to imprison after all was said and done. Absolutely no one.

I totally agree the extent of lying has gotten to extreme levels. I know some people who lie just for fun on top of the lying they do because for this or that "reason". Cheating is almost as bad.

I fully believe we have the media, religion, politicians and entertainment biz to thank for all of this.
Nothing will stop it now.

a reply to: reldra

Why are you using a dead womans photo as your avatar?

I'm not lying.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
a reply to: Jefferton

Prove it! Show me where I have known the truth...but said otherwise. I challenge you!!

Ah, so it's not about lying or telling the truth; it's about proving that something was a lie. After all, you know if you've told lies before, even if no one else could prove it. But a lack of proof doesn't change the fact that you would have lied. Right?


Also, lying is simply telling an untruth. It's not about intentions. If you've always been taught a lie about something and everyone around you also thinks that lie is the truth, it doesn't change the fact that it's still a lie. For example, George Washington's "wooden" teeth weren't wood at all. They were made from numerous things including (but not limited to) hippopotamus ivory, human teeth, brass screws, and lead. Some were even taken from his slaves. But where I'm from, people always taught that they were wooden teeth, which is actually a lie.

So, have you ever in your life said that George Washington's dentures were wooden? If so, I've caught you in a lie.

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
I offer this in response. When you are in court, when questioned by the FBI, sometimes when questioned by police, etc...if you lie, you will be punished. Maybe even jailed. I simply believe that if lying to authority figures is illegal...it should be illegal in general. And again...I'm not talking about what we call "white lies" that can do no harm or not cause others to react in a way harmful to themselves or others...I'm talking about lies cause damage or benefit the liar.

But from the responses...I'm one of the few who believe this. Interesting and educational to me.

Little white lies would benefit you too.

The common example:

Wife says "does this dress make me look fat?"

Husband says, "No, of course not."

The dress, even if the woman is thin, may cause her to look heavy...say it is an odd design. The husband makes her feel better and avoids making her feel bad or angry toward him.

If the husband is smooth with his words, he can tell her the truth and still make her feel better.

Wife says "Does this dress make me look fat?"

Husband says, " It definitely gives you more of an hourglass figure. Come here for a second, heh heh..."

I guess it depends on the culture/sub-culture since some are desperate to look as skinny anorexic as possible. But others that appreciate natural curves and "thickness" would be able to turn it into a good thing.

Wow! A little bit of a reprieve. I guess there are some "truth lovers" here after all.

Now you do realize that (as I believe) the reason conspiracies exist is that someone lied about something about the topic and the people "feel" there is something not quite right. We then probably make the conspiracy much worse than the truth...but that lie caused the feeling or belief that creates the conspiracy. So...if lies went away, I guess ATS may follow?

Just being a smart-ass.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I suggest you go reread the first amendment.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Yeah, I am in death right now, I go home and fall face down on the floor until my muscles hurt, then I go to the bed and force myself to sleep while soaking my pillow wet with tears, every night.

It's ok she left me even though it was my fault and unintentional, but to deny everything, to deny we were friends, to deny every little fact of truth in front of my face, and to simply say I "I don't know what you're talking about" to every fact that I say. To say "nothing changed" although I can point out 5 things every day that are different because she once loved me, and now she hates me, and she won't even admit it, so she is hating me and cutting me off from her life without even telling me she is doing it! She is truly a liar she is truly a monster, in that she wills to cause me pain, but remember this is all my fault, so you see why Christ asked us to forgive? She is making sure that I feel grief because I ruined our relationship so she is using every demonic trick in the bag to make sure that I miss what I love!

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
"when we lie it's a crime when they lie it's politics"
Perfect example! We have taken something unacceptable and made it acceptable in order to allow others to do so. It remains wrong and a sign of bad character and defines a person as untrustworthy. If nothing else...any position where trust is required, they become obsolete and worthless.

*I don't lie*... Lying is a pointless exercise, because somewhere down the line

*truth will out* it is almost inevitable. I am blunt and have offended people

by telling the truth, but those same people have come to me when they 'want

the truth' because they trust me.


There is no need for 'the little white lie', you are not doing the person concerned

any favors by letting them believe that they are not looking the way they want to

look by lying to them, however there is no harm in letting them down lightly!


I have known many liars, and have witnessed the devastation they leave in their

wake. They invariably end up not being taken seriously and not trusted.


The true measure of a wo/man is what they would do if they knew they would

never be caught....Lord Kelvin.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

"So, have you ever in your life said that George Washington's dentures were wooden? If so, I've caught you in a lie."



Absolutely...when I was young that was the rumor that everyone took as truth. If or when I repeated it though, I thought it WAS the truth. That is not a lie. A lie is KNOWINGLY telling an untruth...often for personal benefit but not always.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
originally posted by: enlightenedservant

"So, have you ever in your life said that George Washington's dentures were wooden? If so, I've caught you in a lie."

Absolutely...when I was young that was the rumor that everyone took as truth. If or when I repeated it though, I thought it WAS the truth. That is not a lie. A lie is KNOWINGLY telling an untruth...often for personal benefit but not always.

Nope. If I say you're actually an 8 year old kid and I truly believe that to be true, it's still a lie. And if someone else believes me and repeats it, they're lying too. Not fact checking a rumor/stereotype/lie before repeating it is exactly what contributes to the disinformation in our world anyway. And if it causes harm to someone, it can be litigated as slander or libel, even if the one repeating the lies thought they were true.

Besides, there are plenty of different types of lies, including a "lie of omission" which involves not telling things.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
Besides, there are plenty of different types of lies, including a "lie of omission" which involves not telling things.

Lying by omission is a complex topic to explore.

Think of all the things you say to people in everyday interactions. We have to filter out some information as if we told everybody everything all the time we would become exhausted quickly and never get through tasks in an efficient manner.

Now, you could say "just include the critical points, enough for somebody to make an informed decision" but what I consider critical may not be what you consider critical.

a reply to: Dark Ghost

This is an interesting point. Another thing to take into consideration is how much right do people have to know details of your life?

Some things are highly personal and others have no right to the information no matter how entertaining they might find it.