NEVER-EVER Talk To The Police

a reply to: SaturnFX

you've obviously haven't been accused from a cop for doing something illegal or had to be in court.

the cop can basically take the stand and tell lies and repeat what you said and it's a respectable law officers word over a common citizen. the cop usually always wins unless you pay for a good lawyer.

a reply to: seasonal

As at least one other person noted, this is good advice if you are being questioned as a person of interest in a criminal activity, otherwise this doesn't pertain to everyday interactions with police officers (who, mind you, are human beings, most of whom like talking and interacting with people in a friendly way).

I think that your title of the thread is misleading, as it implies that you should never talk to the police--ever--and that's just nonsensical.

a reply to: savemebarry

I like the police. they stop me from being a hardened criminal. I learnt that long ago.

With a family with multiple police officers, they may have literally stopped me from being a criminal.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I, for one, understood perfectly what the title was saying. I guess there may be people like you who couldn't understand it, and thus it should be clarified. :shrugs:

a reply to: seasonal

This is standard advice in the UK, so I'm sure it makes sense in the US too. From the moment you have been arrested, reply 'no comment' to any question you are asked unless it's to establish personal details or trivia such as reply to an offer of a hot drink.

If the police have arrested you, they are not talking to you to get 'your side of the story'. They are out to nail you, and the fact that they are interviewing you means that they haven't currently got enough evidence to do so.

People are all-too-often under the impression that because the judicial system works on an adversarial defence-vs-prosecution basis, the police must work that way too. They do not!

A police investigation is inquisitorial, not judicial, and they are out to build a case against you, not disprove that case. And yes, they will misrepresent, distort, and exaggerate any hint you give them if it can be interpreted as any kind of admission.

The only time you should volunteer any non-trivial information is when it is to criticise their conduct, e.g., when they have said something demonstrably untrue or behaved badly toward you - this is when the scrutiny of everything you say can work in your favour. If you can complain about something now, without entering into a debate about it, the police can't later say you only thought of it later.

And since the police will try to stick any charge they can conjure up against you, their fibs are best nipped in the bud, because you can be sure they aren't doing it with no particular outcome in mind, even if you can't think what that outcome might be.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I just don't know about that.
Police officers like to be human when it suites them but quickly
go from friendly to "You don't want to mess with me i'm a cop"

Their egos are so inflated and when I say "their" I mean
these new breed of militarized cops that see all of us as
potential enemy combatants.

Lots of people like to say they're just doing their jobs but their job involves
dealing with of the worst we have to offer.
They suffer from that corrections officer syndrome where they can't let go.
A cop is more willing to show aggression and physical authority because they
almost always get away with it -

thefreethoughtproject.com...

a reply to: JDmOKI

Violate which rights? Your right to remain silent is yours and yours alone--how can someone else violate that for you?

Your comment doesn't really make much sense. If you mean that most cops will try multiple ways to get you to talk, of course they will--they're trying to figure out the details and facts around an even that happened.

But, how, exactly, does a cop violate one's right to remain silent?

And just for s**ts and giggles, you do understand that anything said to law enforcement prior to have your Miranda Rights read to you is inadmissible in court, right? They can act on the statements to further investigate things, but they cannot use your actual statements as evidence against you.

It's always best to get an attorney and be done with it if you're being questioned on something that you did, but to pretend that LEOs violate the right to remain silent is ridiculous, not to mention damn near impossible for them to do.

a reply to: loveofneighbor

Thanks for the insightful discussion on the topic.

When a title says, "NEVER-EVER Talk To The Police"--and nothing more--that leaves a lot up to interpretation. Then, when the body of the OP reinforces the idea that you should never say anything "other than saying a passing hi," you should be able to understand why a little clarification should be made, at least in title.

I don't expect the OP to address it, though, but clear communication is a nice thing--this simple topic should not require clarification for any reader.

But, you know, shrugs and stuff.

Oh, and congratulations on understand what the title was saying. You win a gold star for the day!

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I think that your title of the thread is misleading, as it implies that you should never talk to the police--ever--and that's just nonsensical.

I see what you are saying, but there is only so much room for a thread title. Below is a little bit of my thread. I hope you can feel that, short of saying Hi, I think a brief but respectful interaction is in the best interest when you are dealing with a police "stop". Please look over the exerts (below) from the thread, I hope that clears it up.

I Grew up in a home where my dad was a police officer 17 years detective 10, and his dad was a police officer for 31 years. I (and my sisters and brother) have first hand experience with the interrogation skills that can be employed to find out who scratched the car. If you are talking to the police, other than saying a passing hi, there is a reason.

Live to fight another day, be a short but respectful and say NOTHING, get an attorney if it is serious.

a reply to: MagicCow

To a point, you're correct, but then again, you're talking to a military veteran who has many veteran (and active-duty military) friend, and some of whom have gone into law enforcement after leaving the military. I also was a paralegal for both the prosecution and defense side of the courts-martial system, so I fully understand the worst that our military (and, by extension, "militarized" people) is capable of.

Yes, there are bad cops out there--hell, my ex-neighbor used to get beaten by her sheriff ex-husband, so I get that--but the dramatic majority who are in the process of doing their jobs (but aren't in the middle of a call or apprehending or questioning someone) are more than happy to talk to me when I've ever interacted with them. They don't look at me with a skeptical eye, they don't question me about the bulge on my hip from concealed carrying a weapon--nothing like that.

So, while I see the angle from where you're approaching this topic, I have to argue that my own experiences with LEOs (and military members) are that the vast majority of them are good people with good intentions. The problem lies in the fact that we only hear about the worst of the worst, and the everyday good guys fly under the radar, skewing public perception of the types of people that make up these individuals.

It absolutely takes an alpha-male type person to be a LEO, but that doesn't mean that all alpha males are terrible people and do terrible things.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: SaturnFX

you've obviously haven't been accused from a cop for doing something illegal or had to be in court.

I will take your reality over mine.

(you know I was mocking him, right?)

a reply to: seasonal

I promise that I read the thread. You don't have to alter anything, but when I saw the title of your thread when scanning the New Topics, my initial thought was, "Great, another cop-bashing thread that will treat them like big bad scary monsters."

While I don't think that was your intention, the lack of clarification that I noted still lends itself to that concern. But it doesn't really matter in the end, I guess.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: seasonal

As at least one other person noted, this is good advice if you are being questioned as a person of interest in a criminal activity, otherwise this doesn't pertain to everyday interactions with police officers (who, mind you, are human beings, most of whom like talking and interacting with people in a friendly way).

I think that your title of the thread is misleading, as it implies that you should never talk to the police--ever--and that's just nonsensical.

The problem with your premise is that if you are a person of interest the cop isn't going to tell you that. They will almost always start out with friendly, seemingly innocuous questions to establish some rapport before zeroing in on the kill.

And the average person cannot discern the difference between that type of conversation and a truly information gathering one so therefore the premise of the OP is dead-on.

And I come from an entire family of cops & fireman on both sides. And to a person the cops all say the exact same thing as the OP. Be respectful but do *not* talk with them without a lawyer or one of your police family members present. Period. Finito.

a reply to: MagicCow

militarized cops

This is very close to using military force against civilians. I fully expect there to be big issues (law suits) as the local police forces turn into the Marines.

a reply to: Riffrafter

You can take whichever stance you want--I agree that, if you're being questioned about most things other than a random interaction on the street with an officer, most people should choose to say nothing, and that's specifically because of the reason that you mention: The average person doesn't quite understand the difference between benign and investigative questioning.

Maybe I approach this topic differently because I understand the legal system, I've been a paralegal, and I currently work with federal agents and AUSAs on a daily basis, so my comfort level with LEOs and lawyers is well above the average person. But I just can't accept the premise that you must treat all LEOs with massive skepticism because they're most likely just out to get you--that's not reality.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I agree with you. It is situation dependent at times.

For instance, if you happen to be at a location of some event - robbery, accident, shooting, etc. In that case, as a witness - I would try and be helpful if I could as I also respect the men in blue very much and know they have a tough job.

I'm sure people can think of other instances too...

But if a police officer just randomly approaches you on the street - or worse - comes knocking at your door, the default position of not talking takes effect.

I would never have gotten my bike back without the police.

Gotten, lol.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

As I grew up, I remember sitting between my dad and grand dad(both police officers) in the old Dodge truck and we would drive through a not bad but not good neighborhood. They would point out people who were smoking controlled substances and say out loud "wonder what he is going to steal", or he shouldn't be there.

My point is they do this all day long for years on end. They know what they are doing and an average person is a basically 160 pound man taking on Mile Tyson, not a chance. And while you are just "talking" to a police officer, he is looking for a person who matches your description that just beat someone senseless. And you have no idea.

originally posted by: NerdGoddess

originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
If you are under criminal investigation then yes, this is good advice. But if I am being pulled over for a tail light, I am not going to act like an ass over it.

This is my feeling as well. If you want to interrogate me, you'll have to contact my attorney. If I'm just getting a traffic violation, well, Good afternoon, sorry about that sir, take care.

-Alee

Yep. Most important thing is to lawyer up, first and foremost. Anything you say that can be used against you in any way, will be used against you in any way. Every time.

To everyone else: It seems there's a lot of people who still have that olden days view of police as someone there to serve and protect you. These days the courts have ruled that police aren't required to serve or protect you at all. In a lot of encounters, they are agents of the state, nothing more. When an officer puts the badge before their understanding or humanity, they should be prepared for people to react to them that way. As an agent of a corrupt state.

Yah, just let them do their job. They pulled you over for blah blah, you are too lazy to walk around and see your taillights out.

Then blah blah they heard every hundred things people have to say to them when all they want to do is give you a fix it and be on your way. When they ask for more information than they need they are testing you. Just joke back...

Got anything illegal in the car?

No, I left my rocket launcher at home tonight (smile).

Mind if we 'look around'?

You could say no and still be on your way, or say yes and wait an hour for the dog team to arrive who may hit on your car inadvertently giving them cause to rifle your stuff and maybe even plant some evidence (for being non cooperative).

When you are pulled over, sit quietly and wait with both hands on the wheel in plain sight. When they ask to see anything tell them where you are going to reach first. Its in my wallet in my back pocket or in the glove compartment. Wait till they tell you to do something and then do it. If you want to set a tone just comply, they are as bored as you and want to give you back your life as soon as you cooperate with all the 'dumb' questions.

And if they are cretins nothing you are going to do or say is going to save you anyway. So walk around your car once or twice, look for lights out, bald or lo tires, etc.