Russian radar data shows no missile attack on MH17 from rebel side, indicates Ukraine involvement

Newly discovered raw data picked up by a civilian radar station on the day of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 crash shows no signs of a missile being fired at the plane from territory controlled by rebels, the Russian military and radar producer said.

The existence of raw data was announced last week by Almaz-Antey, the producer of the Buk missile system. The system is believed by an international investigation to have caused the 2014 crash over Ukraine.

Source

As of this post the Joint Investigative Team is set to release their interim report on the MH17 incident tomorrow. As this is just an interim report, no blame will be placed on anyone. However, the report will pinpoint the location of the BUK that fired the fatal missile.

In anticipation of this report it looks like Russia is launching a counterattack. Last week it was announced that a subsidiary of Almaz-Antey, the same company that manufactures the BUK, just so happened to have discovered radar data that was previously claimed as lost. It seems kind of serendipitous that this data has been lost for over two years and just so happens to be accidentally discovered right before a report that most are predicting will implicate the Ukrainian rebels. Throughout this whole ordeal those defending Russia have claimed that any radar data released by the US is suspect because it took them so long to release it. Giving them plenty of time to fabricate anything they want. Will those same people call this radar data suspect?

Funnily enough this radar data debunks the radar data Russia released shortly after the incident. They claimed that their data showed an Su-25 5km from the fateful airliner. This new data only shows two other commercial airliners. With the closest one 30km away. So, who's lying? The Russian government? Almaz-Antey? Both?

It might be important to point out again that it was a civilian radar station (!) although russian, not russian military.
The title of the RT-article is a bit misleading, as always.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

it couldn't be the russians they are the new world saviors from the big bad NATO the West, and U.S.
they never meddle in other counties affairs /interest, kill innocent people or have suggested that the use of nukes might become necessary.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: Xcalibur254

it couldn't be the russians they are the new world saviors from the big bad NATO the West, and U.S.
they never meddle in other counties affairs /interest, kill innocent people or have suggested that the use of nukes might become necessary.

Sarcasm? Because we do that way more than Russia does.

a reply to: verschickter

It should also be mentioned though that today's announcement came from the Russian MOD. So regardless of where the data came from the Russian government is throwing their weight behind its veracity.

Well of course there won't be. It wasn't shot down by the freedom fighters, it was shot down by the Ukrainian Air Force. An S-125 SAM specifically. Only the Fascist Kiev Junta's Military operate this system, the Donbass Militia don't have them.

a reply to: verschickter

Is it common for civilian air-traffic control radars to pick up missiles? Air traffic radars are looking for things that want to be seen. Just a small point.

a reply to: paraphi
It was not an air-traffic control, it´s a research institute that uses this radar. I can´t find much about the "Utjos-T", except for the recent articles. The english section of the website Almaz-Antey has not been updated since 2013, the russian version is unusable for me.

originally posted by: verschickter
a reply to: paraphi
It was not an air-traffic control, it´s a research institute that uses this radar. I can´t find much about the "Utjos-T", except for the recent articles. The english section of the website Almaz-Antey has not been updated since 2013, the russian version is unusable for me.

AMA, I'll do my best to translate, but please be specific since I'm not a military specialist.

a reply to: verschickter

Oh right, a research radar. That makes it even less clear. However the article describes it as a "civilian radar station", which implies something like air-traffic control.

a reply to: JedemDasSeine
That´s why I love ATS, fellow citizen If you could search for the "utjos-T" on their russian site and get some (probably spare) informations together that would be nice. Maybe you could hit a searchmachine in russian and look if you find anything?

That would be awesome! Thank you / Vielen Dank / Bolshoe spasibo

a reply to: verschickter
Well maybe the best link here is the website of the Lianozo Electromechanical Plant (the direct producer of Utyos-T): Air-Route Radar Complex «Utes-T» and there you can find a PDF with detailed desciption. I hope this will help.

P.S. Just in case, Utyos/Utes are two variants of the transliterated Russian letter «ё», don't get misleaded, it's the same radar complex.

a reply to: JedemDasSeine
Ah that´s why I could not find anything:

P.S. Utyos/Utes are two variants of the transliterated Russian letter «ё», don't get misleaded, it's the same radar complex.

Very helpful, thank you! There are far more knowledgeable people on ATS then me, when it comes to radar systems, if they´re not showing up, I´ll write some PNs..

a reply to: JedemDasSeine

Based off that information and some very basic research I don't see how this radar system would detect a SAM. Like most civilian radar systems it looks like this operates using secondary radar. This means it's not really true radar but instead works using RF. In this case it operates in the L Band. This makes sense since this is the same range that ADS-B equipment operates in. This equipment transmits flight data to other aircraft and ground based facilities also equipped with ADS-B.

Considering the primarily civilian applications of ADS-B I can't imagine why a SAM would be fitted with the ADS-B out equipment. Especially one as old as Russia claims was used.

Like I said this is just based off basic research. My knowledge of radar is basically zero. If anything I said is incorrect I hope someone with a stronger background in the field will correct me.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

So, typical RT gibberish attempting to muddy the waters and deflect. What the "news" item should read is...

"Russian radar data shows no missile attack because it can't"

Yeah, that civilian radar station isn't capable of detecting a missile launch, or tracking a missile. This one is pure Russian/RT propaganda designed to muddy the waters.

a reply to: paraphi

"Russian radar data shows no missile attack because it can't"

Unlike the Americans because they wont .The US was too busy using social media and YT to make their case . sheesh .

a reply to: the2ofusr1

How can you continue to defend Russia in this case? Time and again they have released misleading or even outright false data. These releases also always seem to coincide with major developments in the case. It is quite clear that Russia is deliberately attempting to muddy the waters. Why would they do this? Because they not only know who the responsible party is but they are also protecting them. And now Almaz-Antey are also complicit in this obstruction of justice.

originally posted by: Ohanka
Well of course there won't be. It wasn't shot down by the freedom fighters, it was shot down by the Ukrainian Air Force. An S-125 SAM specifically. Only the Fascist Kiev Junta's Military operate this system, the Donbass Militia don't have them.

Bull freaking shiite. the rebels even made tweet when they shot it down until they realized what they actually did and removed the tweet from twitter.

a reply to: Ohanka

I think you're a bit behind in your propaganda. Russia claims the missile used was a 9M38. They claim this was proven by treats performed by Almaz-Antey. Of course considering Almaz-Antey are complicit in the blatant lie the Russian MOD told today it kind of makes all their other statements suspect.