Some serious theological problems with the Christian religion

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

That's the unique thing about truth though, it's exclusive.

exclusive is the wrong word. exclusive lends a commodity dimension to it. "exclusively available through us! exclusively high quality! exclusively for this price! exclusively for a limited time only!"

water is not exclusive. air is not exclusive. dirt is not exclusive. truth should not be exclusive. truth is not a marketable product or a resource to be approved or regulated. everyone, everywhere, anytime, no matter what. thats what truth should be.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Exclusive in the sense that there aren't two conflicting things simultaneously true. Example, something cannot be true for you and false for me. Relativism is a fallacy, truth is exclusive.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

I'll stick with what I know is true. I saw my own leg grow out an inch and my back problems never returned.

Wow, what a coincidence. The preacher who led me in prayer had this happen to him as well

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

Exclusive in the sense that there aren't two conflicting things simultaneously true. Example, something cannot be true for you and false for me. Relativism is a fallacy, truth is exclusive.

so what if something is true for stephen hawking but false for you? or it is true for the united states house committee on science but it is false for you?

When said "truth" comes from an unseen deity that demands veneration, burnt offerings, blood ritual, bias treatment towards women, submission to all governing authorities, the murder of homosexuals and disobedient children and has his "truth" written and compiled by various inconsistent authors, editors and translators (even though he possess more than enough power to manifest such a book on his own), then maybe... just maybe, the validity of said "truth" should come under intense scrutiny and criticism. But hey, I'm just a person who thinks murdering two consenting, same-sexed adults is wrong, so what would I know about morality. Right?

When figuring out what is required for people to believe and submit their own souls, it's becomes very easy to see how manipulation can be so abundant on such a large scale throughout the planet. Ya know, unless you insist it's the work of demons.

a reply to: TzarChasm

There is no such thing as relative objective truth. Believing there is such a thing is called the "relativist fallacy".

originally posted by: Nochzwei

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

I'll stick with what I know is true. I saw my own leg grow out an inch and my back problems never returned.

Wow, what a coincidence. The preacher who led me in prayer had this happen to him as well

One leg shorter than another is a pretty common cause of chronic back pain. Not a big coincidence at all.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: TzarChasm

There is no such thing as relative objective truth. Believing there is such a thing is called the "relativist fallacy".

when several people look at a mystery and have several different answers ("God" "Allah" "Cause and effect" "we can never really know" "Krishna" "Santa Claus" "aliens" [eeeeeey macarena!]) derived from cultural and domestic influences, i call that "relativism". because we all live on the same planet and will defend to our last breath a dozen assorted solutions to the same pointless question. here is an absolute truth for you: what we think does not matter in the slightest. we will all die, the earth will eventually be consumed by the sun, this galaxy will pull itself apart or merge with another one and the universe will go on not caring.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Belief by a number of people doesn't = truth. Neither is one religion true for one group and not true for another. There is no such thing as relative objective truth.

a reply to: TzarChasm

how bleak

" this galaxy will pull itself apart or merge with another one and the universe will go on not caring."

but you can care
you reach down deep within you
to your special place
like a warm fuzzy feeling in your tummy
and some other places too

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TarzanBeta

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TarzanBeta

originally posted by: GoShredAK
a reply to: CB328

In my ongoing quest to analyze religion and it's effect on society I have had a realization lately about Christianity- namely that Christians themselves can't even agree on the vital tenets of the religion. Why should people be willing to devote their lives to a belief system that isn't even clearly defined? If you don't believe me, then read on.

I have had a really difficult time with this throughout my life. I grew up as a standard christian. Went to church, read my bible, prayed often.

No that I am older and have been exposed to the vast world of conspiracies I have pretty much given up on religion for the most part, but it does not feel right. I believe in Jesus and I believe he has worked in my life so I am very reluctant to give that faith up.

So these days I keep it simple, just obey the ten commandments and trust that itll all work out.

I feel like regardless of what religion you are the ten commandments are a valuable guide on how we ought to live our lives. I don't think you can go wrong that way.

Someone else that's honest.

The beauty of one's heart that can never reject Jesus in the face of so much temptation is amazing.

It's impossible to be perfect in this world, but I think perfection is found in those who hold on to Jesus never denying no matter how hard it gets and no matter how hard we fail.

That's good stuff right there.

If you were a Jew over 2000 years ago the 10 commandments would have served you well, not so much anymore

I dont think you learned anything of any value at sunday school, sadly, I think they taught you rubbish
Its a poor reflection on the church of today

Jesus is more interested in people living out of love than ritual

Jesus is most interested in people living out their conscience so that they are in a better position to love. No judging those who found the way of their liberty, that's counter productive, brother.

Jesus asked christians to love God and love each other, its the law

Mark 12:30-31English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbour as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”

Also we dont judge those outside the church, those in the church we can and must
Matthew 18:15
"If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over.

Problem with living out of conscience is conscience can be corrupted from the beginning, always perverted, live out of love
1 Corinthians 13:4-8
4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

I agree with all of that and believe the same. I was talking about the liberty of a Christian. If the mind of one is more satisfied with the 10 Commandments, there is nothing wrong with that. That is Christian liberty. Read the Word through Paul.

a reply to: TzarChasm

"worthy" implies something is being earned, something is being tested for merit and found satisfactory. it turns veneration into a competition

I could have used the word veneration. I'm not used to the word "veneration" as apposed to "adoration".

i think its time a few (or more) other notable demigods were given their due. as long as we are in the business of giving dues, that is.

There are people giving them dues; Sociologists, Anthropologists, Archeologists, Comparative Religionists, Archivists, Preservationists, Artists, and a whole lot more. If the question boils down to relevance, then I think those who live their lives without reference to the gods will continue to do so. Those who mostly live their lives without reference to the gods will continue to appreciate (via museum visit, movie, literature, forums) the gods occasionally. Those people whose careers, hobbies, and special interests revolve around the gods and the history of the gods will continue to do what they do.

Nice TC

I love it
We religious believe in relativism but you
You believe you have the absolute truth

Sounds like you are as religious as anyone else, by faith you have your absolute truth

a reply to: kibric

I hope you were serious. I gave you a star. If it's sarcasm, then oh well, what's done is done.

a reply to: pthena

veneration, infatuation, adoration, addiction, obsession, worship. veneration is right in the middle, equidistant between worship and vilification, which are essentially two sides of the same coin. one appreciates with the intent to exalt, the other appreciates with the intent to eradicate. the trick at that point is to observe both wings of the pendulum, with the understanding that the further your pursue worship, the more you invite vilification. there can be no hero without a villain after all, and it makes for a far more engaging narrative if there is a little of both in all of us. engaging, hell, its more realistic. imperfect leaders are the bread and butter of any soul-polishing adventure. the troops learn as much from their commanders reaction to failure as they do from victory. a leader who is "flawless" is a leader who cant teach his people anything because he himself (or herself) is unable to learn and grow.

these are the pixels that comprise the image of wisdom vs compassion. a bleeding heart sycophant vs a rough and tumble soldier of fortune who is forced to shoulder the mantle of the public and win a fight they never asked for. a true underdogs tale. this is a major problem with theology because deliberately suiciding is interpreted as a both failure and victory, our failure to save a guru and his victory in not needing to be saved. this tries to bundle several classic literary devices into one neat package that loops back around to reinforcing the age old piece of rhetoric "i am the way". its lazy and uninspired. you know how gandalf calls the eagles whenever he got written into a tight corner? when in doubt, call the eagles. when in doubt, deploy the sonic screwdriver. when in doubt, invoke the holy spirit. very convenient. and thats the kicker right there: life is NEVER convenient. and i get the feeling that if a messiah actually did come into the picture, the universe would do everything in its power to make sure his job was never too easy. right down to making sure he couldnt just anhero himself back into lvl 999 super deluxe white dragon mage status. d&d players everywhere would either rejoice or ragequit if they found out they could have just beat the game by dying under the right circumstance.

anyway, thats enough expounding on the lazy literary logistics of judaism.

Christianity is the teachings of Jesus or Christo. Anything else "prophetic" or not, is additions added by apostles and later on by others, anonymous writers and from their writings, its clear that it is under jewish environment. After they burn all the original books during the dark ages.

The rapture is a jewish, asiatic thing. Christianity books allong with most of the ancient books, re-written (always) by anonymous writers. Including all gospels, prophecies, etc, they dont recall any rapture. Also it is known that the church is recognizing the sybille prophecies and in order to fit the jewish belief, Jews crafted the bronze books 2000 years ago (they are faked and under Jewish environment, not recognised as originals). Nevertheless the church does recognize them. Because Sybille's prophesized most of the apocalypse events.

and they dont speak about any kind of rapture. The rapture is a jewish addition.

The rapture is very bind with the moon (islam says it, jewish belief says it, etc). The moon will depart in a point, imported also in christianity, they even say " gold belongs to God, not to humans " so its a god who loves the planets minerals. That tells me, he is not the creator, because he loves the gold and wants it so badly... If he was the creator, he could have a machine pumping out gold, is it? lol

The rapture is also bind with the separation of spirit from human soul and give us immortal bodies, because the creator gave us spirit, but now "this" god hates spirit. Its many things that do not fit each other and its not Christianity fault.. It is just 2 different gods, the one who indeed created and the one who wishes to destroy the creation.

Its the imports they added from jewish/babylona/asiatic god, into jesus teachings. The old testament has nothing to do with christians after all... Old testament speaks about the babylona god Kronos/Saturn/SAT/Sabaoth and Yahbeh.

In my opinion, there are 2 kind of christians. Those who believe in Holy Father and his Son marked as "Jesus" and those who are very dogmatic in nowdays, but they follow the jewish god which is Kronos and his Son, so we are somewhere between 2 different fathers and 2 different sons. Kronos rebelled once, that means he is not the creator, but someone against Fathers will, just like the rapture plans and the gold lol . He sounds like a pirate.

The new religion they promoting with NWO, they will include Jesus , but without the cross. The cross is the problem for them. They may give you a jesus with the moon symbol (Saturn's son), like in asia (the moon is the mongoloid symbol). The isosceles cross and the Sun, is the symbol of Holy Father and that is what they hate most. That is why they used Father's symbol for punishment in ancient years, they wanted to humiliate the symbol. Here is arch angel Michael central church my country, look at his cloths and shield, red cloaked and isosceles cross. www.panoramio.com... (all arch angels are red cloaked and with isosceles cross with the Sun).

So just follow the Sun not the darkness.

a reply to: TarzanBeta

Paul was very clear about ritual law, keeping the sabbath, keeping Kosher

Where do you stop and where do you start with what you choose to obey
Don't work Sunday's? No big issue, just why ignore the other Old Testament commandments.

Goshredak acknowledged the 10 commandments and latter suggested 6 through to 10 were extra special, hearing lies our problem
The laws that are easy, extra special, become more important

I love how a Christian church will condemn homosexuals But won't condemn lust. Simply because there are very few people struggling with homosexuality in the church.

Though I am not familiar with Christian Liberty, I will,go and learn

a reply to: Ploutonas

Jesus is Jewish.

a reply to: Raggedyman

I love how a Christian church will condemn homosexuals But won't condemn lust.

Since when?

a reply to: NOTurTypical

Jesus is jewish (as a name) but in greek and roman, he is not called as jesus, or yusivula..but as Christo, even if most of the christians in my country, call jesus with a different name, unknown to u and not relevant at all.