Truth Found in the King James Bible

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

El Elyon
Yahweh Elohim
Yahweh Sabaoth
Elohim
El Eloah
El Roi
Eli, Eli, lama sabachtani?

El Echad
El Emet
El Tsaddik
El Olam
El Yeshurun
El Gibbor
El De'ot
El Haggadol
El Hashamayim
El Yeshurun
El Kanno

Hebrew4Christians.com (link will not work)

a reply to: CabablancaHizb

I see what you're saying. I'm not exactly the nurturing type I suppose and can lack some sensitivity sometimes in how I respond. I'm working on it though, ok??

But let's be real. Does it seem to you like this man is living a life of mental stability??? Sitting in his car recording himself rant about Conspiracy Theories dressed up in a costume like some super hero complete with a nickname based on Divine Retribution.

That is not the actions of a healthy mind. Those are the actions of someone on the edge of a mental breakdown. He's building a false reality in his head and projecting it on the world with him as a righteous bringer of justice to the wicked upon the earth.

Maybe you're right about me being a bit harsh in my initial response, but I don't find anything Positive about that mans situation. I do in fact have concern for him though and those around him. That is a man living a life of great fear and anger and loneliness which is sad and dangerous.

a reply to: mOjOm

It's all good. You can't judge people by what they do online. There are some people who get e bullied by fanatics who are far worse than the people they bully but have the attitude of a superior because of what opinion they have.

Insults will make the most humble person crack eventually so then whose to blame?

originally posted by: CabablancaHizb

Deuteronomy 32

Sons of God=correct
Sons of Israel=incorrect

Deuteronomy 32:8 is a section of a song where Moses is praising God for all He has done for Israel. The particular verse is where Moses is praising God for supplying sufficient land among all the nations, so that Israel will always have sufficient room, even in the future when population increases.

The translation of "Sons of God" is out of context with the rest of the song and, indeed, the whole Bible, which is fairly staunchly monotheistic. There are not 70 demigods, descendants of El, in a pantheon of Gods. It is an obvious mistranslation in the Septuagint (itself a translation from Hebrew to Greek) to apply that meaning to the verse. The dictionary meaning of Israel is "God prevails" and culturally, many saw Israel as "the Sons of God" in comparison with other nations. The word "ben" also refers to all genders, so a correct translation would be "children of God". Translated as such, this epithet is used repeatedly throughout the Bible for the nation of Israel.

"Children of Israel" (the current KJV interpretation) makes more sense in context but "children of God", the Septuagint translation, is also acceptable.

a reply to: chr0naut

I have nothing to say all the oldest texts say Sons of God and only the Jewish Masoretic says Israel.

End of debate.

Add:. I could explain to you the complexities of the ancient Hebrew religion that went from Sons of God (Sons of El) to Angels of God to the ridiculous sons of Israel.

But you would descend into fundamental shock at the truth about the ancient Israelites/Canaanites first religion and start arguing against my well researched knowledge with emotional motivation to preserve your not knowing.

That is just annoying for someone like me because I have already discovered what you don't even want to.

a reply to: chr0naut

Israel means "wrestles with God."

Not what you said. It was given to Jacob after wrestling with God and prevailing. You have wrestled with men and with God, and prevailed.

But the literal translation is "wrestles with God.". I think I learned that when I was 12 and the definition you gave is a mockery.

originally posted by: CabablancaHizb
a reply to: chr0naut

Israel means "wrestles with God."

Not what you said. It was given to Jacob after wrestling with God and prevailing. You have wrestled with men and with God, and prevailed.

But the literal translation is "wrestles with God.". I think I learned that when I was 12 and the definition you gave is a mockery.

"A Hebrew and English Lexicon" by Brown, Driver & Briggs.

I also learned that particular definition when I was young, but I continued learning.

a reply to: chr0naut

I am not arguing about a word I know the definition of. You can quote anything you want like I said that definition you gave is fake, probably deliberately which is not at all uncommon in Judaism.

Your so off on so many things I can't begin to imagine that a conversation with you is of any benefit to me.

God bless.

a reply to: chr0naut

Your sly little " but I kept learning" comment is juvenile behavior I want no part of.

I didn't stop learning because I settled on the correct definition at a young age. I have Bibles with footnotes that say the correct definition and you only unveil that you are frustrated and trying to inflict negativity.

Did I stop learning or say you did?

You really needed to tell me that you didn't stop learning but I think you did.

a reply to: chr0naut

i hate to say this but in thinking about Genesis 32:22-32, wrestles with God make more sense.
i mean why would God/angle/ or a man call Jacob a son of God after wrestling with him all night.
even if it means God prevails, it was Jacob whose named was changed and he prevailed.

Why does any person have disdain towards the BibleJesus? God is love! If a person has an issue with love, someone needs to buy them a candy bar.

What fuels you? Are you motivated to love others....why? Food 4 thought.

Personally, I have lived a fairly selfish life. I "found" Christ many years ago, but didn't know Him like I do now. 1 John 4... Paints a pretty clear picture of God. People get caught in religion, when love is above religion's pay grade. Do you love? Why? Don't answer unless you fell inclined....I'm just sharing my thoughts. 1 John chapter 4, 1 Corinthians chapter 13 will sum it up. God is love.

originally posted by: CabablancaHizb
a reply to: chr0naut

I am not arguing about a word I know the definition of. You can quote anything you want like I said that definition you gave is fake, probably deliberately which is not at all uncommon in Judaism.

Your so off on so many things I can't begin to imagine that a conversation with you is of any benefit to me.

God bless.

Here's a Google search as well.

I will continue to refute what you say while ever you say things that are incorrect and provably so. Eventually the dripping water wears away the thickest rock.

May God grant you understanding.

a reply to: chr0naut

every one of the links on the first page pretty much says, wrestles with God.
none say Sons of God. there are a couple that say could mean God prevails, but seem to lean towards wrestles with God.

a reply to: chr0naut

The truth is irrefutable to all but the uneducated.

Your opinion is nothing to me. And factually incorrect.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: chr0naut

every one of the links on the first page pretty much says, wrestles with God.
none say Sons of God. there are a couple that say could mean God prevails, but seem to lean towards wrestles with God.

Thank you for making that known. I didn't check the link because I am already certain but I appreciate you speaking the truth.

I don't know where "God prevails" ever came from but I suspect it is a Jewish fabrication.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: chr0naut

i hate to say this but in thinking about Genesis 32:22-32, wrestles with God make more sense.
i mean why would God/angle/ or a man call Jacob a son of God after wrestling with him all night.
even if it means God prevails, it was Jacob whose named was changed and he prevailed.

The account had Jacob and God wrestling (Heb: 'abaq' meaning to wrestle, to grapple or to cover in dust) for some time with neither showed the upper hand, then God, with the touch of a finger, dislocates Jacob's hip and said, in effect, that He was going to call Jacob "God wins" (God prevails). The confusion is probably that people, unaware of the actual translation, though the name had to do with the wrestling, not the outcome.

But the compound word had meaning before it was used as a name.

Most likely, the word derives either from 'sarar' (to rule, be strong or to judge over) or from 'sareta' (you contend), compounded with the description of God - 'El'.

"The Jewish Study Bible" of Oxford University Press says "The scientific etymology of 'Israel' is uncertain, a good guess being '[The God] El rules.'"

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: chr0naut

i hate to say this but in thinking about Genesis 32:22-32, wrestles with God make more sense.
i mean why would God/angle/ or a man call Jacob a son of God after wrestling with him all night.
even if it means God prevails, it was Jacob whose named was changed and he prevailed.

Yes, that is one of the definitions of the name "Israel".

But the word existed before it was used as a name.

That is a total assumption you can't back up.

Many believe the word derives from 'sarar' (to rule, be strong or to judge over) and 'El', a word meaning God.

Outside of the Genesis 32 story, the word had the meanings of: "God rules", "God judges", "God prevails" or "God triumphs".

In the context of the Genesis story the meaning is generally agreed to be: "Triumphant with God" or "who prevails with God".

"The Jewish Study Bible" of Oxford University Press says "The scientific etymology of Israel is uncertain, a good guess being '[The God] El rules.'"

Yeah it means wrestles with God. It is FIRST mentioned after Jacob wrestles with God.

It retains that meaning as a nation and certainly "wrestles" with God to this day. A perfect reason to alter the definition.

But the Biblical definition is what I said.

originally posted by: CabablancaHizb

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: chr0naut

i hate to say this but in thinking about Genesis 32:22-32, wrestles with God make more sense.
i mean why would God/angle/ or a man call Jacob a son of God after wrestling with him all night.
even if it means God prevails, it was Jacob whose named was changed and he prevailed.

Yes, that is one of the definitions of the name "Israel".

But the word existed before it was used as a name.

That is a total assumption you can't back up.

Many believe the word derives from 'sarar' (to rule, be strong or to judge over) and 'El', a word meaning God.

Outside of the Genesis 32 story, the word had the meanings of: "God rules", "God judges", "God prevails" or "God triumphs".

In the context of the Genesis story the meaning is generally agreed to be: "Triumphant with God" or "who prevails with God".

"The Jewish Study Bible" of Oxford University Press says "The scientific etymology of Israel is uncertain, a good guess being '[The God] El rules.'"

Yeah it means wrestles with God. It is FIRST mentioned after Jacob wrestles with God.

It retains that meaning as a nation and certainly "wrestles" with God to this day. A perfect reason to alter the definition.

But the Biblical definition is what I said.

Please re-read my previous post. I was editing it to clarify things.

Thank you.

a reply to: chr0naut

It is not something I am worried about.

As long as you learned something I'm happy.