I don't understand Trump haters.

a reply to: ImmortalLegend527

thank the gods that majority understands why and that’s what matters in this world

So , if I take what you are saying correctly, dont think for yourself just go with the crowd ?
I really , really hope that is not what you meant...or was it?

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Aristotelian1

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: Aristotelian1

No offense, but if you're seriously trying to learn why some of us hate Trump, you should probably skim the dozens and dozens of other threads about it. But to summarize just a few things for myself:

He & his spokeswoman burned all bridges w/me (I'm a proud Muslim) with their comments ans stances on Muslims. I also don't like his comments about Mexican people and I think his "wall" is stupid and unrealistic. I don't like the way his companies constantly screw over small businesses and contractors, either. And I fully expect him to try to force the US govt into bankruptcy. I alsodon't like the way he verbally bashes women in public, such as fat shaming Rosie O'Donnell, his menstrual bleeding comments about Megan Kelly, etc. I don't mind calling a female out based on idiotic ideas or stances, but he goes way too far by making it personal & crude. (I'm a little old fashioned in that regard.)

I also think he's absolutely petty and irrational, with him constantly taking every perceived slight personally and then responding w/"twitter beefs". I mean, seriously. Putting someone that petty and vindictive in control of the IRS, FBI, CIA, and our nuclear arsenal would be disastrous. Plus I think his campaign is both an unorganized mess and a racket (and I mean "racket" in the literal sense, not metaphorically). If he can't even keep his own campaign staff in order or organized, then how can he possibly handle being the literal chief executive of the entire federal Executive Branch?

I also think a lot of his policies are nonexistent. As in, he gives incredibly vague answers to incredibly complex questions. Things like "We'll use the best plans. They're magnificent ideas, really they are. We'll be terrific and finally make us great again. trust me, I know what I'm talking about. I'm really rich." WTF does that even mean? I need stats, reports, and details. That vague crap won't cut it.

Imagine you're an officer in a charity and you're supposed to implement your boss' plan for distributing food throughout the region. But your boss' entire "plan" only consists of "We'll get the best foods. Foods that taste great. Fantastically great. And I'll tell you what; those recipients will love that food so much and all of our hard work will be worth it. No no, I'm serious. It'll be sooo worth it." WTF does that even mean? How can you implement actual plans with people's lives on the line when that's all you have to go by?

I have a lot of other reasons, but I don't feel like repeating myself lol. Just remember, he's running as a Repub. No matter what people may say, his administration will be full of Repubs and they will interpret the law the way other conservatives do. That means his admin's budget will have all of the Repub priorities and none of the left wing/progressives' priorities in it. Not to mention, he'd be appointing other conservatives to the Supreme Court and other appointed positions. Why on Earth would I support that when Repubs have been fighting against my preferred policies for decades?

I appreciate the response. Let me begin by asking you two questions.
1.Do you self identify as a Democrat?
2. Will you be voting for Hillary Clinton?

Thanks.
1. I'm a far left Independent that's much closer to the Green Party's policies than the Democratic Party.
2. Only if the race is close in my state, If not, I'll vote for Jill Stein.

Okay cool. So what,specifically, did Trump say about Muslims and Mexicans that you disliked so much? And what candidate has been more specific with their plans? It does not bother me if a politicians says what they want to do and not how they are going to do it. They're essentially saying "If I get into office I'll work for four years on how to tackle this issue," and that's fine with me.

To put it simply - I'm not buying a word he's trying to sell.

All of these folks that are just soooo "sick and tired of the establishment," are now rooting for a man that has deep familial ties to the Clinton establishment - and it's really, really odd.

I get told daily "Well between Hillary and Trump, who would you vote for? They both suck but which one would suck less?," which is literally the SAME concept that was pandered to us with Obama and Romney.

The "lesser of two evils," is basically retarded when one could have voted for Ron Paul or now Gary Johnson.

You want to talk about a candidate that IS anti-establishment? His name is Gary Johnson and because he ACTUALLY IS anti-establishment the mainstream media outlets (that used to be frowned upon for biased agendas) hardly carry any weight to his name or give him any airtime.

This is the thing that gets me. You have all of these people who vehemently insist Donald is "anti-establishment," and he's going to "shake things up in D.C.," yet I haven't heard a SINGLE specific as to how he plans on doing ANY of this.

And call me what you will - but I'm not one of the naive fan girls of the partisan-paradigm who will cheer behind "my guy," whilst shouting out that "but this time, it'll be different!," when it won't be.

OP - it may not bother you for a candidate to tell you what you want to hear, and imbibe in grandiloquent speeches that ultimately say nothing, but for me personally - these are traits of people that should NOT considered presidential material and that damn well includes Clinton (amongst a myriad of other concerns).

It's a matter of opinion and perspective. I don't believe this country or any of its citizens will benefit in ANY way under a Trump OR Hillary administration whatsoever. I believe that BOTH Donald and Hillary have spent MILLIONS attempting to convince the American people otherwise, but I'm not gullible and I don't buy a #ing word ANY "lamestream media," candidate says - and yes, this includes Trump.

To say that Trump is "anti-establishment," is the equivalent of saying that Clinton is "anti-establishment."

These people are career salesman and they know how to sell a pitch. I'm one of the very, very few people who (for the past three election cycles) have stood by as Democrats and Republicans alike vehemently insist that "their guy is the only chance," wishing they'd stop supporting authoritarian wannabes and voting and supporting for a candidate and government that does not give a # about you.

Again OP, it may not bother YOU when a candidate doesn't specific to the HOW and instead rampantly runs with the WHAT of what they're going to do - but I think that's pretty laughable to be honest.

If I'm hiring a plumber, I'd expect to know damn well ahead of time exactly HOW he/she plans to fix the issue before working on the issue.

That's pretty basic in my opinion.

Donald Trump is a vote for more of the same.
Hillary Clinton is a vote for more of the same.

I'll leave it to the brainwashed members of ATS who watch far too much CNN and FOX to be over to prove me wrong.

originally posted by: BrianFlanders
I understand Trump haters. I just don't understand what they're trying to accomplish.

Then you obviously don't understand them.

Simple really. I am VERY liberal when it comes to social issues, and moderate when it comes to fiscal issues. Trump is blatantly offensive and disgusting. he does not represent my social ideals and really has no fiscal policy at all.

By all means, vote for whoever you want. It's your right and I hope you exercise it by voting. I will do the same. Over the next few months I will check out the Green Party candidate. I know Johnson's platform and I'm out on that. SO either I'll vote for a third party, or I'll vote Clinton. I damn sure won't be voting for an openly disgusting moron named Trump.

originally posted by: gladtobehere
a reply to: Aristotelian1

He's a liar.

Hes been a lifelong Democrat and Hillary supporter. I dont believe hes flipped on all his beliefs coincidentally as he's running for the GOP nomination. As recently as the debates, he was praising planned parenthood and government run health care.


Hes an authoritarian.

People like Rand Paul are trying to de-militarize the police.
Theres no doubt in my mind that Trump will ramp up the Police State Industrial Complex.

He will fully support warrant-less searches and spying. Constitutionally protected rights and due process will be a thing of the past in favor of jack booted thuggery as evidenced by his lobbying the NRA in favor of the anti-2A watch list.

It is very unsettling to see someone who could potentially be the POTUS encouraging violence. It was disturbing to see him encourage violence against protesters, even offering to pay their legal bills.


He's easily duped.
He buys into the anti-Moslem propaganda everything from 9/11 to the "celebrating Moslems".


This idea that he wants to go after the families of "terrorists" would be a very dangerous precedent. Based on his rhetoric, Trump would probably go after the families of everyone from the Bundy's to OWS protesters.

I have very little doubt that his policy of guilt by association would eventually filter down to everyone charged with any crime.


While I agree that the media is a propaganda matrix, a person should deal with them in a professional manner. Its as though hes mentally deficient or like a 65yo spoiled child unable to express himself in a competent way.

When he used that reporter's disability to attack him, it was shameful and embarrassing.

So our "choices" are Hillary or someone whos supported and agreed with Hillary over the years but is slightly more authoritarian.


Johnson 2016.

Best post of the year, as far as I'm concerned.
There is no better description of our political climate this year.
And Trump totally supports 9/11 and the muslim bogeyman farce, and would ramp up the police state to the point where we have fond memories of the good ol' Patriot Act days. Trump is no alternative. He's more of the same. Obama looked like bigger change than Trump does, and we saw how well that turned out for Mr. Most Transparent Gov Ever.

Trump has flat-out denied climate change exists. Electing a president like that for a country that has such a big role in stopping it would be extremely dangerous. Not that Hillary would do anything about it (like Obama didn't) but still, even symbolically.

originally posted by: RomeByFire
To put it simply - I'm not buying a word he's trying to sell.

That's just fine but he's a politician (and a businessman). Of course you don't. You shouldn't. But if you're buying a word ANY of them are selling you're paying way too much for what you're getting. These people are scum. All of them.

I get told daily "Well between Hillary and Trump, who would you vote for? They both suck but which one would suck less?," which is literally the SAME concept that was pandered to us with Obama and Romney.

The "lesser of two evils," is basically retarded when one could have voted for Ron Paul or now Gary Johnson.

Ahhhh....but of course that's where you really have to watch. Because if you know what you should know, you know that the establishment owns the entire playing field when it comes to politics. And you don't hear about anyone (AT ALL) unless THEY want you to. Now, if you acknowledge that, then you must realize you would have never heard of Ron Paul or Gary Johnson unless these people ALLOWED them to be on the field.

Nevermind how. It seems pretty obvious by now that the people who run this game can and will corrupt anything or anyone. So even if some of these people started out with reasonably good intentions, they would have gotten to them eventually. One way or another.

I know I make it seem hopeless and if that's the impression that you get, that's good. Because that's the damn truth and they're gonna keep dicking us around until the majority has accepted it. They're going to play every dirty trick they have in their book. And it doesn't matter how stupid and cartoonish it might seem. If it works, it works. Right now, Trump is working. If the time comes when the only thing that seems to work for them at the time is to sell us a "libertarian" that's what they'll do.

And you will know that you have been fooled when you look at what they do. It always has to be said. Talk is cheap. I guess in politics it's expensive but it's still cheaper than action. They'll get people to vote for them and then they'll distract at least half the people with whatever works for a distraction and they'll do their dirty deeds in the shadows. The media will either not cover the important stuff at all or they'll downplay it and print it on the back page (so to speak).

Either way, most people (who care) will only know they got screwed when they wake up one day and find it there's suddenly a law that requires them to buy health insurance. That is seriously how I found out about it. I wasn't paying attention to politics when Obama was (s)elected. I thought we were home free because it wasn't a Republican. I was tired of worrying every day what kind of damage the Republicans were going to do today. I was politically exhausted and I stopped paying attention when Obama was elected.

I didn't hear anything that sounded overtly threatening to freedom in anything Obama said (compared to Bush) and I took a "wait and see" attitude. And then Obamacare hit me and I didn't know what hit me. I could have sworn he said he was against that mandate! He wouldn't get away with a lie like that, right? Wrong.

I forgot something. Talk is cheap. Politicians can lie. They're expected to lie. If they get elected, it doesn't matter how many lies they told. They'll get away with every one of them.

So I am not taking a new position. I know that. But I'm done with voting. It doesn't matter. None of it matters. It's bread and circuses, essentially. Doesn't matter what you think you're voting for. You'll get what they want you to get. They'll season it up to taste just like your favorite dish if they have to (if you're in the majority, they have to, of course) but you will still not have a real choice. And you might not even know it until way down the line somewhere you suddenly realize that underneath it all, this is exactly the same agenda the other guy was selling.

Donald Trump represents some semblance of honesty. He's hideous. He's disgusting. He's obscene. He's the perfect face for what we're really dealing with.

I don't understand voting for an incompetent candidate because of how he talks

he has no clue about global economies, politics or our federal government, and that's the job !!! He had no idea what brexit was only a month ago, didn't even know scotland voted to stay !

we are a personality obsessed culture, and if lincoln or washington were running this year they would have done as well as O'Malley

trumpism is dumbing down the planet. we are in full idiocracy mode

a reply to: ksiezyc

If you can understand this...I was brought up to never discuss politics or religion...or youll just get in deep with people. So...I try not to address personal specifics, while trying to be a good forum member and contributing ATS'r.

To answer your question directly...I probably will. Because the alternative is far worse. But Donald kinda scares me. Not negatively...just because he's flippant and arrogant in regards to relationships we have established with other countries.

But he has strength...and he can learn foreign policy when he's got the security clearance to learn what secret deals and agreements we've made under the tables that keep world peace.

I think then...America will finally have a real chance at change and growth...maybe war yes...but also strength and stability. I pray.

Thank you for asking......