Mateen could not have pulled it off.

Anyone who doubts whether it's possible for the authorities to cook up a shooting only needs to google the name "Rubén Salazar KMEX". Hunter S Thompson does an excellent piece on the incident.

originally posted by: EternalShadow


Plausible. However, I'll wait for the reports. How many shots were fired in total?

I haven't seen that information yet.

I just think it's 100% plausible, given the information that I've seen, that a single scumbag could have done this with no outside help.

a reply to: herrw

I agree. The only logical explanation is that the various reports of other players, shooters and door closers, are valid.

originally posted by: GrandCourtJester
Anyone who doubts whether it's possible for the authorities to cook up a shooting only needs to google the name "Rubén Salazar KMEX". Hunter S Thompson does an excellent piece on the incident.

I don't think anyone doubts the possibility that authorities could "cook up a shooting," however I don't see what a tear gas canister to the head of a single man has to do with a mass homicide at a night club.

a reply to: Mianeye

SWAT never went inside the building, Mateen came to them through a hole in the walls the SWAT made, there were no SWAT VS Mateen fire fight inside.

yea there was, he engaged one swat team inside while they were trying get people out before he holed up in the restroom.
haven't heard if any hostages were hit during that exchange.

CNN I think it was had pictures of the outside where they busted down the wall and there's a lot of bullet marks around the hole. I really believe the police killed quite a few trying to escape. I saved the picture but don't have a way to load it

a reply to: kelbtalfenek In the case of Ruben Salazar, the police cooked up and "official story", later proved wrong, to cover what may have been an execution.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

you are right about the SWATS being inside.

As far as i got it together there have been several LEOs inside the club:

1. the off duty cop who worked as security at the club
2. 3-4 officers who came as a backup, as per their action the shooter hid near the batroom area (adonis lounge).

From there he called the cops, media to tell them about other shooters,snipers and bombs to buy time.

Then the Cops started to dig holes into the bathroom area to evacuate.

There are already reports out from the police themselves, that 'friendly fire' killed several patrons.

originally posted by: Bobaganoosh
a reply to: BoxFulder

I'm having a hard time with all of this as well. I really don't believe the MSM timeline. I know they don't have all of the answers.

I remain skeptical.

My skepticism has nothing to do with gays or Islam...

Only the narrative and timeline and "lone wolf" conclusion.

It would take a team to kill this many people.

Incorrect. One man can easily kill that many in a packed club.
In Army marksmanship we had to hit around 30 pop up targets in less than like ten minutes or so and that was at long distance on single fire. Imagine doing it in a packed club on fully automatic. It only takes a few seconds to put in a fresh pre loaded mag. Tired of this fallacy that it had to be multiple people shooting.

Ask any right winger they will tell you Obama did it under orders from Hillary. Just ask em

originally posted by: GrandCourtJester
a reply to: kelbtalfenek In the case of Ruben Salazar, the police cooked up and "official story", later proved wrong, to cover what may have been an execution.

I realize that, I read a few of the articles on the case. That was 40 years ago, and I don't see how it has any sort of merit in this particular case. Yes there was a coverup. There have been dozens, if not hundreds of coverups since then. At this point in the Pulse nightclub mass homicide there hasn't been enough information processed to say it's any sort of a coverup.

My entire line of thinking isn't that Mateen is necessarily the only shooter, but that he certainly could have done what is stated by the authorities he did. It is entirely plausible that a lone whacko scumbag with a semi-auto could have massacred innocent people. It's not unheard of and certainly not implausible, if you care to read my previous posts in this thread.

a reply to: kelbtalfenek

And the fact that at least ONE emergency exit was latched closed (one of the survivors reported he had to fight through the terrified and shocked people to unlatch it to open the door to save them all). Makes me wonder how many other emergency exits were also latched or otherwise blocked? This is common, as I have seen it myself many times over the years. Even reporting it to the management (to their rolling eyes) that this was a violation of the fire codes if discovered.

Due to a previous experience in a fire emergency situation in a club in my 20's, ever since I have been keenly aware of emergency exits wherever I go. Fortunately for me, I achieved that awareness and survived. However, that situational awareness is usually "poo-poo'd" by many as being silly or paranoid. Until, that is, they desperately need to know and freak out in panic when they realize they do not. Personally, I would rather know and not need it than wait until I did and end up dead.

Let's hope that those that survived this tragedy learn to maintain that situational awareness going forward.

a reply to: Krakatoa


100% with you Krakatoa. When I was a really green Marine, fresh out of boot, a Captain gave myself and some others a quick impromptu safety lesson: Green, Yellow, Red. Green is when you're at home, with the door locked. Yellow is when you're outside your home. Red is when you're anywhere that anything seems out of place, not right, your senses are tingling, or you're in a crowd.

The gist of that lesson is: always be aware of your surroundings, where the exits are, who is close to the exits, and have a plan in case of anything happening. So I'm with you, I always pay attention to where I am, who I'm with, who is around us and more.