WA Schools to Teach Gender Identity Curriculum to Kindergarteners

Oh yeah...almost forgot:

1. You will always be the biological sex you were born.
2. Your mental problem that makes you believe your body is wrong is likely treatable.
3. Those who support your dementia are actually doing you harm.
4. You are not seeking equality and fairness...you are looking for special treatment and acceptance. Stop lying.
5. You have a high probability of suicide without treatment.
6. No one who supports your mental problems will help you solve them.
7. You need help...not acceptance.
8. And yes...you sound as nutty as the guy on the street corner that believes he is Christ.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

While we're offering unsolicited and unnecessary commentary;

1. Your genitals are nobody else's damned business ... not the State's (except perhaps, for the most generic medical record-keeping purposes) and not other citizens'.

2. Gender identities, whether cis-, trans* or any other variation, are not mental problems, nor mental illnesses, and further, it is a fundamental human right to define one's own identity as one wishes as well as to live one's identity as best one can.

3. Those who wish to define anything they don't agree with as dementia [sic] or mental illness, or perversion, or any other pejorative are the ones with the problem, not you. You have a right to be who you are as long as you're harming no one.

4. It is a fundamental point of American and English common law, as well as explicit in the American Constitution, that every citizen is treated equally and fairly before the laws of the land. Period. No one get's to define "special" rights because they want to treat you as a second-class citizen.

5. Suicide rates and probabilities are important, but like any statistic, can be manipulated for fit any argument. (For example, men are 3.5 times more likely to commit suicide; are all men therefore mentally ill?) Suicide among trans* individuals usually results from societal ignorance, familial abandonment, and a lack of comprehensive and continuous physical and psychological support both before and after transition.

6. No one who defines you as mentally ill in the face of medical and psychological science to the contrary as well as legal precedent is worth your concern. They are intellectual and cultural relics whose obsessive authoritarian natures simply do not allow them to "live and let live."

7. No one has the right to deny acceptance to you, whether cultural or personal. You have a fundamental human right to be who you are and to live out your own identity as you wish as long as you are doing no harm. Your life and identity are NONE OF ANYONE ELSE'S BUSINESS.

8. Children and demagogues consistently call other people names based on their own ignorance and immaturity.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Oh yeah...almost forgot:

1. You will always be the biological sex you were born.

So what? Unless you carry a laboratory in your pocket, how would you know what someone's "biological" sex is?

2. Your mental problem that makes you believe your body is wrong is likely treatable.

Absolutely! That "mental problem" is gender dysphoria, it's a real thing and the treatment well defined and successful.

3. Those who support your dementia are actually doing you harm.

If my parents were still alive, I think they'd like to have a word with you. I doubt it would be pleasant. It took them a while but they were very supportive and protective. Had they not been, I would have abandoned them and probably be dead. How would you treat a transgender child? I probably don't want to know because more than likely, you would be the one doing harm.

4. You are not seeking equality and fairness...you are looking for special treatment and acceptance. Stop lying.

I have acceptance, don't need any special treatment and am not lacking any equality and fairness. Granted, I may be an exception but stop with your stereotypes and assuming just because someone is trans that everyone is the same. What would this "special treatment" be in your opinion?

5. You have a high probability of suicide without treatment.

Duh!

6. No one who supports your mental problems will help you solve them.

Except doctors and psychologists and psychiatrists and endocrinologists and surgeons and family and friends.

7. You need help...not acceptance.

Again, duh on the help. Tolerance, civility and human dignity would be sufficient.

8. And yes...you sound as nutty as the guy on the street corner that believes he is Christ.

Looked in a mirror lately.

You know, I thought you were a nice guy for a while but you've turned into a real jerk spewing a lot of really not nice things every chance you get. Quit lumping all trans people into your narrow little categories and maybe open your narrow little mind and I don't know, maybe read something from the medical or research communities for a change instead or right-wing conservative drivel. Lighten up, Francis.

Oh, great, so now our male children will be taught it's ok to be female, and vise versa. This was all part of Obama's master plan to screw this country over, one piece at a time.

originally posted by: RobertBedford
Oh, great, so now our male children will be taught it's ok to be female, and vise versa. This was all part of Obama's master plan to screw this country over, one piece at a time.

NO, your children will feel its OK to be who they were born to be.

No one can teach someone to be a gender they are not.

a reply to: xuenchen

Nothing new here....the school my children attend started that crap 2 years ago

Is there any other sources to this information? if this is true i would find it very disgusting as i have children who will be of that school age this coming year

originally posted by: Miko2345
Is there any other sources to this information? if this is true i would find it very disgusting as i have children who will be of that school age this coming year

There are 1000s of transgender kids in primary school.

Should we shove them in the closet? Or teach their peers to accept them?

a reply to: Annee

There are 1000s of transgender kids in primary school.

Not to be confrontational but when you say thousands, is that per district, per State, or across the entire US?

Just curious. How many on average per school?

I apologize because I have nothing to add to this debate, but I would like a clearer picture of the actual numbers per school that would cause this amount of conflict.

Thanks in advance to anyone that can provide this information. I doubt I will be commenting again.

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
a reply to: Annee

There are 1000s of transgender kids in primary school.

Not to be confrontational but when you say thousands, is that per district, per State, or across the entire US?

That's actually a low estimate of US public schools.

Of course its difficult to get an actual number because they are just starting to come forward. You can imagine this is very tough on both parent and child.

Freija can answer any questions about Gender Dysphoria/transgender children. Much better then I can.

Freija will be happy to help anyone who is sincere about the welfare of Gender Dysphoria children.

Expert: More Kids Coming Forward Specialty clinics in the U.S., Canada, and Europe say they’re seeing large increases in the numbers of children like Sam who are seeking help for gender dysphoria. That’s a feeling of extreme distress that happens when a person doesn’t identify with the body they’re born into. Gender dysphoria sometimes leads people to take steps to change their sex, or become transgender.

At gender management clinic in San Diego, the number of new patients increased by 200% between 2012 and 2013, rising from eight patients to 26. www.webmd.com...

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
Not to be confrontational but when you say thousands, is that per district, per State, or across the entire US?

Just curious. How many on average per school?

I apologize because I have nothing to add to this debate, but I would like a clearer picture of the actual numbers per school that would cause this amount of conflict.

Thanks in advance to anyone that can provide this information. I doubt I will be commenting again.

Asking a legitimate question or having a genuine curiosity is not confrontational unless you intend for it to be or are disrespectful. I try to answer what I can or point folks to other sources where they can find answers on their own.

Estimating numbers and averages? Hmm? That is very difficult because typically, trans kids don't have a big red "T" tattooed on their foreheads or wish to do anything other than fit in quietly with their peers and get on with life. Many times, parents of a child that has transitioned will move to a new school district where no one except perhaps administrators and teachers knows of a child's transgender status. Some are living completely invisibly.

Much depends on the age a child transitions too and if you are unfamiliar with transgender children, "transition" means a social transition, not a medical transition. Prior to puberty, transitioning involves little more than a change of name, hair style, clothing and pronouns. Commonly, you'll find groups of kids that transition very young like 4 to 6 and another group that transitions around puberty and early adolescence or in high school.

Of course, many transgender kids are "out" as the social stigma of being trans is becoming lessened through awareness and a lot of the ability to be out depends on geographical location. For example, you may have five or six transgender kids at any given school in L.A. or Seattle but in other parts of the country, fewer than that but I think all schools have at least a few kids that are gender expansive or gender non-conforming. Teaching or talking about gender diversity is important for all kids so that those that don't quite fit the mold, be they transgender or gender diverse, is so that these kids are not bullied or ostracized for being a little different.

But you know, it only takes one transgender kid at a school for parents and caregivers to throw a fit and turn this into a whole big deal of conflict and accusation. Generally, it is not the kids or other students making a fuss about this as the younger generation just doesn't care so much.

To explicitly answer your question about how many transgender kids there are no one really knows just as no one accurately knows how many trans adults there are. I can say that by the numbers involved with organizations and support groups across the country, there are multiple thousands of transgender students across the country at this point and the numbers are growing due to greater social acceptance and identification of transgender identities at an earlier age.

If you would like to know about more about transgender youth, feel free to ask as I have some experience in that area. Here a few links that may help you better understand these things and why they are so important to the lives of these kids. Thank you for your question and interest in this matter.

Mental Health of Transgender Children Who Are Supported in Their Identities
For transgender kids, support is key to emotional well-being
Gender Non-Conforming & Transgender Children
What Alarmist Articles About Transgender Children Get Wrong
Transgender Kids Show Consistent Gender Identity Across Measures
Difficult Conversations
The End of the Desistance Myth

Other valuable information can be found and downloaded in PDF format:

Schools in Transition: A Guide for Supporting Transgender Students in K-12 Schools

And

Transgender Students and Bathrooms: Frequently Asked Questions

originally posted by: NthOther
Why are we screwing up an entire generation of children to appease 0.01% of the population?

This couldn't be dubious social engineering at work, could it?

Naaaaah. I'm sure they really have the best interests of the kids in mind. I'm sure they really want them to be able to form healthy, meaningful relationships with other people in their lives.

I ABSOLUTELY agree, the thing that I see awkward is that everybody from kindergartners to whatever age, and even younger than kindergartners understand what 'normal' is and by that I mean man/female relationships. Most of them either have a mom and dad, and know there is some sorta difference, and those that live with only one parent, or none at all, know that a relationship or marriage consists of a guy and girl. I am not a social psychologist, but I can see with my own two eyes and I know what is normal, you are correct about such an absolutely utterly tiny minuscule percentage of the population and that is what bothers me. This is the same problem I have with same sex couples adopting kids, it is going to effect what they view as normal quite possibly, and quite possibly gear them towards an outcome that wasn't there normally. I am for same sex marriages, absolutely we are almost certainly born gay, or born any other way. I'm not sure about born killers though there is evidence for that too. So I'm almost contradicting myself, but please hear me out.

If a same sex couple adopts an infant, I would be extremely worried about that child's relationship with only that sex at home, which is where most infants develop many of their idea's and social skills, not all of them but a good portion. I think this is why they say "It takes a village to raise a child" . This isn't to say that the infant, or child won't receive proper social interaction and therefore social skills and ability through interaction via others that it is around, but a large portion of their life especially early on before school, will be with their parental guardian(s) and that bothers the hell out of me. Perhaps this is for nothing, but it bothers the living hell out of me that a child will only see same sex parents and I have a really REALLY bad feeling that the child will see all other couples as the different ones, and the same sex as what is normal. It has been proven that what is shown to a child early in their life is a major part of their programming, if you will allow me to use that term. Not as much as what we used to think, (look at Freud's work, holy cow how insane can you be and still be considered a father of psychoanalysis). I think I've made a decent case from my view, and that is without putting governmental agenda into it.

I can't think of a way around this, I just can't. Are you going to force same sex couples who do adopt to force them to adopt a child at an older age so they are already adjusted to what is normal for the most part?. Do you force same sex couples to appease others by having the infant child exposed to a regular male/female couple every so often for so long?. I just can't think of a way to normalize this and especially do it to where its remotely doable. At my heart and soul I am a Libertarian, and that is because I know things are GOING to happen. Same sex couples, married or not, are going to raise children. Their own or others, adopted legally or not, its going to happen. If anything, I want information and data, and perhaps later on we can study this and perhaps recognize a rise in choices for children raised via same sex couples, a choice to pursue a relationship similar to what they were exposed to, a same sex relationship. A significant rise of that would certainly mean a lot, for both the obvious and the not obvious. I think personally it would be absolutely fascinating for study and perhaps at least we would have credible data to show that children raised by same sex couples are influenced by it, and we need to develop something to help counter this. All of this would possibly be countered by saying that there was always that amount of people who wish to pursue same sex relationships but never did because it was not as acceptable as today, but that again could be countered by data. All of this boils down to at least one good thing, and that is talking and discussion. At least we are talking and getting this out there, obviously as Libertarian I am absolutely open to all kinds of relationships. I don't think anybody should be shamed because of something they were born with, weirdly many people think that the next thing that will be normalized is child pedophiles (Do not mix these subjects up, I am neither comparing nor putting child pedophiles anywhere near people who are LGBT or anything like that). I'm just stating that we like what we like, I like chubby girls personally, I also like blondes, and I was probably born that way liking chubby girls. What is to say that others wasn't born liking much much MUCH weirder things? as always data helps. I am merely giving an example that is a bit extreme, and quite possibly off-topic, this is only my second posting here and I'm not used to this forum yet but hopefully this was a good post and people will believe I've at least contributed to this topic

Washington state is a giant trailer park.
I've been there.

Just as trashy as can be across the board,
while they clumsily imitate trendy lib agendas in an effort to seem sophisticated.

Although I'm not a liberal tyrant who thinks everybody else has to live by my expectations, so I support their STATES RIGHTS to have their own rules in their own community. If they voted for that, so be it.

And if my community doesn't,
dont push it on me and instigate animosity and potential violence.
And then blame it on the "bigotry" of guns and Christians for having the outrageous gall to disagree with you.