World War Zero brought down mystery civilisation of ‘sea people’

a reply to: Marduk

not even asking for credit and youre looking to discredit... our dating system as been in error many times... take the recent mammoth tusk pulled out of a florida sink hole that pushes humanity living in the SE US 1000s of years before previous dating.

Humans are falliable and some data is fabricated or slanted towards the researchers bias or trying to make connections where tere are none... of course being aware of such youre saying the same by trowing out arbitrary dates...

As said why not take the time and image search that oneself instead of wasting time trying to discredit where no one is asking for any due... see for yourself, im not asking for blind rote belief either... only a pompus ass expects such silly things.

a reply to: Byrd
I did not mean to imply that, if it so seemed. Of course the ox-carts with women and children suggest mass migration.

It is an invasion nonetheless, no? The Goths brought carts with their families too, still considered to have invaded Roman territory.

a reply to: SargonThrall

See that dude getting the spear to the throat thats one of the sea peoples not really a mohawk but a grass crown of sorts like still used in ceremonies in the island chains.

originally posted by: BigBrotherDarkness
a reply to: Marduk

not even asking for credit and youre looking to discredit... our dating system as been in error many times... take the recent mammoth tusk pulled out of a florida sink hole that pushes humanity living in the SE US 1000s of years before previous dating.

Try 1500 years, its a fact, I'm not surprised you aren't aware of it

Humans are falliable and some data is fabricated or slanted towards the researchers bias or trying to make connections where tere are none... of course being aware of such youre saying the same by trowing out arbitrary dates...

As said why not take the time and image search that oneself instead of wasting time trying to discredit where no one is asking for any due... see for yourself, im not asking for blind rote belief either... only a pompus ass expects such silly things.

No one in this thread is asking, because they all know its nonsense and can't be bothered with yet another fringer who needs science to be wrong so that he can put forward an idea so crazy it should be in a strait jacket

You are more than 500 years out in your Gilbert island claim and more than 1600 years on your claims for Hawaii, the natives you are talking about did not have transworld shipping and a navy, what are you smoking ?


We get quite a few mad claims each week here, your baloney is not even unusual, of course you don't want to do any more work on it yourself, because deep down, you also know its crap

The Phaistos disc has already been decoded, so you've wasted your time, it was done by a couple of linguists from an Oxford university, it contains a prayer to the Minoan Mother Goddess, doesn't say anything at all about people from the pacific. So again, you got it wrong, deal with it.


And finally, we have the genetics of the sea peoples, which was indistinguishable from the civilisations around the Mediterranean.

So you pretty much got this wrong on every level.

a reply to: Marduk

life is almost as tenacious as you are about this... Im not looking to argue it is what it is. Feel free to leave it as no ones asking you to buy it. Thanks for the insults as it seems to match your character... so being true to yourself even if negative I suppose is still the same thing... if it makes you happy?

originally posted by: BigBrotherDarkness
a reply to: Marduk

life is almost as tenacious as you are about this... Im not looking to argue it is what it is. Feel free to leave it as no ones asking you to buy it. Thanks for the insults as it seems to match your character... so being true to yourself even if negative I suppose is still the same thing... if it makes you happy?

Calling you a fringer isn't an insult, its what you are. You are claiming that a group of people based in the Mediterranean, who sailed in the Mediterranean and who were genetically identical to Mediterranean residents were from the other side of the world. You need science to be wrong on tens of thousands of counts, science only needs you to be wrong once and I've already shown you where you are wrong. which you have completely ignored. Normal fringe procedure, ignore science, ignore facts and then attempt to create a really weak gap of the gods logical fallacy, in the hope that no one will notice, its almost as if you weren't even aware of these facts when you came up with this, shock horror, how unusual for a fringer
Now rather than address the facts, you are attacking my character.
laughable and tragic


btw, this is a Peleset warrior, a member of a Mediterranean culture which formed part of the sea peoples

what you thought was his Mohawk/grass crown is actually a helmet, Mohawks/crowns don't usually need a strap to keep them atop the head

a reply to: Marduk

you know I can appreciate tat you came at it from a different angle... but since your intent is more to discredit youve lost objectivity in your view as theres a bias of intent to achieve an outcome. Since Im not in that boat demanding something fact and still looking objectively, let me offer you yet another perspective since youve become subject to your own inent for whatever purpose.

Aside from the dating angle, these people and groups were nomading around by boat pirating and pillaging and exploring and made it all the way up into the whole nile delta until someone finally put a stop to it.

Now that of course does not mean the Gilbert Solomon Island group or any other was their origin, of course that is however the place where such artifacts were found to still exist... culture carries their tools with them, that doesnt mean origin... that simply means where some of these tools of the trade were tracked too in modern day through researching... bare in mind even the name Gilbert Solomon Islands are not even indegienous to those islands, they were carried and placed there.

If you care to see how becoming subject to an agenda and how objectivity can be lost or data fudged for a specific desired out come... then heres your fine example of it.

As said dating is moot, humans were very migratory and they carried their skills and tools with them in their migratory explorations... a behavior that we still do to this very day.

originally posted by: SargonThrall
a reply to: Byrd
I did not mean to imply that, if it so seemed. Of course the ox-carts with women and children suggest mass migration.

It is an invasion nonetheless, no? The Goths brought carts with their families too, still considered to have invaded Roman territory.

Those aren't ox-carts. Those are the chariots of the time (yes, really) Here's a nice link with pictures of them, including photos of models

The "invasion" may have been a migration of people fleeing conflict in their homes... but in that age they tended to move to neighboring countries and not hundreds of miles away.

a reply to: Byrd

Fleeing from conflict and cause conflict else where. Its a strange circle.

I suppose they probably thought it would be easy to take Egypt, after so many other kingdoms were falling along the way.

I don't understand though, if they were purely aiming to immigrate away from their lands why they did not just settle in the pre existing Mycenae palaces and villages, or the Hittite kingdoms? We know that they were attacked and raised. Why not just settle there instead of pushing further to Egypt?

Conquest, power, and control is a hell of a drug. Its what left Afghanistan illegally into Iraq and would have led into Iran if an election change didnt pull the brakes on that agenda.

Why was Xerxes taking heads of all the kings he could? Those on such thrones thought themselves divinity or gods and so did the people they into battle of conquest and conquer... it seems like it was like a huge game of Highlander... there can be only one nonsense.

As long as there is a lust for glory domination and control such conquests wont cease... societies temselves that make up such places have to collectively turn their backs on such people thirsting for such positions that dont unite the world in peace, that try to dictate their lives, that dont use diplomacy and friendship for common causes, nor respect te meeting ground in the middle to remove ignorance and oust those with superiority complexes that that very position of power to represent turns into a detiment to the entire world.

Some think this can be accomplished with globalization through the corporate structuring that just rife with greed and political corruption... at the very cost of peoples and families security and lives world wide, in this insane cycle... thinking if an Iphone is availble worldwide less people would rather have an assualt rifle... thats the main position of globalization and of course corporations marching into 3rd world countries with ones already liberated from tyranny to replace other corporations as our own moves off to the new places...

Of course there is resistence and different ideas about its implimentation, but concider the Toyota being the most American made car... forien corporations that have been helped through most favored nation trade status are poised to come in as the oterones go out to lift the 3rd world being liberated and moving towards education and well jobs and livihood... of course the people vested in all that either want extreme bloodbath in so called conservatism or diplomacy and peace and charity to do that in liberalism... while there is a hard hitting pander to moral bases for justification of the quick and dirty bloodbath holy war business... when both underlying all of that have the same agenda and all UN countries agreed to this with the UN playing refferee.

Of course the agenda wheter slow or fast is enviromentally unsustainable... this is why theres a push towards cleaner energy etc.

But the world idea of conquest hasnt gone anywhere just changed form and everyone wise to it or ignorant of it are all along for the ride.

a reply to: Byrd
Not to sound rude, but I hardly think Sumerian 4-wheeled chariots pulled by donkeys from an earlier epoch in a different location, equates to these 2-wheeled carts full of items and children, pulled by cattle. Cattle were only really used in chariots when horses/donkeys weren't available.

Considering that the Philistines utilized horses, it wouldn't make sense for them to use less effective cattle in warfare.

The link I added specifically refers to them as ox-carts, and that's what they seem to be. They could be repurposed chariots, but they're certainly not chariots proper, weapons of war. Hard anyways when they're filled with children.

originally posted by: BigBrotherDarkness
a reply to: Marduk

EDITED OUT NONSENSE
you know I can appreciate tat you came at it from a different angle... but since your intent is more to discredit youve lost objectivity in your view as theres a bias of intent to achieve an outcome. Since Im not in that boat demanding something .

The sea peoples were genetically identical to the rest of the people of the mediteranean, this is an established fact
Your dates are out by thousands of years, this is an established fact
You have not produced a single shred of supporting evidence, except for misidentifying a helmet because of your bias
You are going to pull out the Colombian "genetic disc" at some point aren't you, when you do I will show you that its a modern fake...

So you can bang on all you want about my "bias", but that's actually just psychological projection on your part..

a reply to: Marduk

enjoy your cognitive dissonance and its nice to see youre prepared to defend it at any point in the future no matter what gets presented.

Heres your cookie

originally posted by: BigBrotherDarkness
a reply to: Marduk

enjoy your cognitive dissonance and its nice to see youre prepared to defend it at any point in the future no matter what gets presented.

Heres your cookie

from one of your posts:

the story goes the sea people kept decimating and pillaging seaside communities recruiting in a huge sea army... one of the egyptian cities got rancked and hit hard and sent a call to Ramses II they all had no idea where they were coming from but were slipping up in hordes through the euphrates...

This is your account of Ramesses II repulsing the Sea Peoples invasion.

Before Marduk will ever consider conceding any position at all, he would at the very least need to be presented a scenario where the battle took place in Egypt!

Until reasoned dialogue somehow appears in your posts, understand that you've brought nothing at all to the table here. A pipe dream, if even that.

Such daydreaming is for other sections of the forum.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

If youve read all the posts as youve said to... then youd know why that is a virtual impossibility at the present. As previously mentioned, the constant hacking at my other devices rendering them unusable for any sustained period regardless of how secure I set them up and being on a machine not suited for such an endevor what you are asking is not a current possibility. But as said anyone is wholly welcome to take the basis that I remember researching this for over 2 months tried to post it 404d and then had to dump the basics on FB and then my cell bricked just like my lap top. My current machine gets it though it cant go down just disconnected from the network usually at very inopurtune times, but I have no storage or upload capacity no multitabs no cut and paste no spell check.

I will try to rectify this as soon as im not tired of reinstalling or resetting my computer or phone on average 6 times a damned month with security measures only to be hacked by alphabet, white hats and black hats etc. where my data out is 5000 times normal what an average out sould be even firewalled, ports closed, ip switchers, and vpns.

Thats the real world tech situation ive been dealing with for close to two years. So its not like I can just be someone else and viola bang out a thread so people can then have a look at all the findings... would be nice, as I have a ton of art work personal and private business to attended to but ive not had use of a cell phone in close to a month and a half... because at some point you get extremely tired of all the above I mentioned.

So basically, if only it were that easy.

a reply to: BigBrotherDarkness

That's one of the lamest excuses I've seen yet.

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

Not an excuse wen thats the reality of the situation, so either be patient or take up the task yourself I said where the images are relevant basically step by step as I said I dont need credit which inversely means not need to discredit as thats a moot futility, as the information of it belongs to all humanity in my honest opinion... every single thing up to this moment of your or anyones life is due to everyone else that has come before you or anyone else alive... whether they had large effects or small effects good effects or bad effects still an effect up to right now... allowing all our current moments to happen that basically includes all life btw... ego goes narp a holes its all me me me me me me, well its a tired tune and hey how about calling it a community effort since im at an electronic disadvantage atm.

originally posted by: BigBrotherDarkness
well its a tired tune and hey how about calling it a community effort since im at an electronic disadvantage atm.

See, now there's your problem right there.

Try posting from another ATM, a newer one. Maybe change banks...

Harte

originally posted by: Byrd
Current thinking is that it wasn't so much an invasion (not that much in the way of war-torn cities) but more an invasion of settlers.

If that is the case, it was an invasion of settlers that completely and somewhat permanently, wiped out the literate peoples of the Aegean and caused a massive economic shift in that region. It may have been a minor blip in Egypt, but for the Cyclades, the archaeological record suggests an abrupt end to that civilisation, followed by a practically mute dark age. That's a little more than mass migration if you ask me.

There seems to have been multiple pressures, including wide spread movements of people, particularly amongst newly settled populations experiencing reproductive explosions combining with conditions that lowered food production. This is most apparent in the area around the north of the Black Sea, and elsewhere, where animal husbandry was the primary economy.

originally posted by: Anaana

originally posted by: Byrd
Current thinking is that it wasn't so much an invasion (not that much in the way of war-torn cities) but more an invasion of settlers.

If that is the case, it was an invasion of settlers that completely and somewhat permanently, wiped out the literate peoples of the Aegean and caused a massive economic shift in that region. It may have been a minor blip in Egypt, but for the Cyclades, the archaeological record suggests an abrupt end to that civilisation, followed by a practically mute dark age. That's a little more than mass migration if you ask me.

I probably should have clarified that the scenario applied to Egypt only. I don't know about the other countries.