Irony comes a knocking - Breivik’s human rights violated in prison

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

His PS2 games are old? Poor little snowflake! And too childish? What a shame! As an avid gamer, I would prefer Killzone to Ape Escape, but the thing is that mass murderers do not get to choose their gaming systems, or indeed the type of games they get to play. If they did, they would simply sit there, furiously masturbating over their Kill Death ratios, and learning nothing from their incarceration what so ever.

Oh wait...

Well the problem is there is the Rule Of Law, and the creeps lawyers have demonstrated that he was not being treated in accordance to the Rule Of Law, and thus he won his appeal.

We might not like the Law, we might disagree with it. But I think we can all agree that for the system to work, the Law must be applied according to its very letter.

originally posted by: CranialSponge
a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

This just makes me want to assume the fetal position and suck on my thumb.

Bwahahaha !

That sentence made me spew my coffee. Priceless !

Do you mind if I steal it from you ?

steal away...I already stole it from somewhere...

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

His PS2 games are old? Poor little snowflake! And too childish? What a shame! As an avid gamer, I would prefer Killzone to Ape Escape, but the thing is that mass murderers do not get to choose their gaming systems, or indeed the type of games they get to play. If they did, they would simply sit there, furiously masturbating over their Kill Death ratios, and learning nothing from their incarceration what so ever.

Oh wait...

yes man...didnt you hear...ps4 is already out...I think it's rather inhumane to make him use an ancient gaming system. Also...there is now a new trend with VR gear...wait...I just had an epiphany...

VR...god damn it...VR...strap him to a chair...and put a VR goggles on him...and make him enjoy Justin Bieber concerts live as if he was there.

Round the clock...I wonder if he could take it ?

a reply to: Painterz

We might not like the Law, we might disagree with it. But I think we can all agree that for the system to work, the Law must be applied according to its very letter.

I understand that man...but is it right that this man should be dealt with according to the rule of law ? Is there a point...(there is with me) where we have to just stop treating such persons...as a person ? is he a person...a human being ?

He (it) expressed no remorse...he was not mentally ill (well...at least not diagnosed)...he was highly educated...and he acted like God. People were crying and pleading for mercy. He had none.

From my corner...what we do in such scenarios only encourages the next generation of criminals...that they can get off easy for any crime. Even if caught...they can abuse the rule of law for their own advantage, which is happening right here.

He is laughing at all of us with this ruling...laughing at the victims, laughing at the rule of law.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

That is the very thing, is it not? By all accounts, God is merciful, to those who repent at least. A man who survives a grevious wound might say that God was merciful, and at the same time his relatives might say that God is merciful if injury takes a mans life, rather than leaving him in total agony for the rest of his waking days.

But the man around whom this thread revolves has no mercy. He is a machine which produces only a single product. Death. Turned his back on violence has he? I wonder, if he truly repents of his vast sins. Surely, a man who has turned totally away from violence, knowing the risk he poses to others and disgusted by himself, would not wish to play games involving the very concepts to which he is addicted? Surely he, unlike a well adjusted mortal, would not be capable of exposing himself to virtual carnage without being reminded of his sin constantly, with every simulated discharge of a pixel framed weapon, with every swing of a computer generated blade, and every wet, sucking noise of a simulated chest wound?

I put it to the membership that this man, if he truly thought himself to be the hand of God, has misunderstood God, and furthermore, that he does not repent of his sins before Him, or before mankind, that he desires to simulate, perhaps even practice or relive his sick acts using his computer console. The hole he is in has far too much sunlight, and too much space. He is merely waiting, in my estimation, not looking to change himself for the better, but to survive until he next has the smell of cosmoline in his nostrils, and a host of heartbeats to cease in ballistic fury. I believe the man has all the compassion and empathy of a stone, and seeks only a route by which he might slake his unquenchable thirst for blood.

He is no god, he knows only the mercy he is shown, not that which he shows others. He sows only death, and cares not for the consequences. He may be human in all the ways that science can discern, but he is nothing more than a golem powered by death, and will take any opportunity he can to do what he did before, again.

a reply to: TrueBrit

There is no doubt in my mind. And I think you nailed it with this:

Surely, a man who has turned totally away from violence, knowing the risk he poses to others and disgusted by himself, would not wish to play games involving the very concepts to which he is addicted? Surely he, unlike a well adjusted mortal, would not be capable of exposing himself to virtual carnage without being reminded of his sin constantly, with every simulated discharge of a pixel framed weapon, with every swing of a computer generated blade, and every wet, sucking noise of a simulated chest wound?

I once had a car crash...I was guilty. I hit a stationary vehicle with 120 km/h...throwing it on the stop light pole...which ripped off like it was made of paper. Two people were inside...luckily...they survived with only minor injuries.

Of course I had my licence revoked...but I was so disgusted with my stupidity afterwards...and fearful from the realization..."I almost killed two people"...that I couldnt drive a car for a year after that.

originally posted by: woodwardjnr
a reply to: SprocketUK I agree with Norways decision . Thats the point of having standards and sticking to them no matter how heinous the crime. It's what separates them from the uncivilised nations in places like the Middle East where they practice torture and kill the likes of breivik.you don't change your wholepenal system based on the nature of the crime.

Can't argue with that, though if I was personally affected I would want him dead. At my own hands if possible.

a reply to: SprocketUK, I can understand that point of view. I'm not really sure what my position is on law enforcement and punishment

It's a tough one, isn't it?

If someone harmed one of yours, you'd want them to suffer.

If one of yours harmed someone else you'd want them rehabilitated.

The middle ground is rather uneven.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Did you ever get your licence back?

Intention is the difference. You merely aimed to go faster. Unwise? Certainly. Reckless? Absolutely! Deliberate, wilful attempt to murder someone, or a group of people? Not at all. Your remorse probably shook your soul.

But there was only ever one outcome of ABBs actions, and that outcome was a massacre. He knew this when he loaded the first magazine, when he made the first twist of wire that would form the foundations of the explosive devices he built and deployed, he knew this well in advance of the day of the assault. Every one of the actions of which he partook leading up to, during, and after the events which saw him sent to jail, was one he involved himself in willingly, and without the slightest doubt as to the outcome.

I have spoken to you before on these boards, and so although I do not know you as well as I know my own blood, I know this about you. When you got into your car on the day of your smash, you were not intending to kill anyone, or harm anyone. The incident made you more aware of the consequences of your actions, that unintended consequences are consequences all the same, and I am willing to bet that if someone had told you before hand "Listen MOTF, today, while you are having grand larks going at improbable speed, you are going to slam into a car with two occupants inside it, at more than one hundred miles an hour", that you might have elected not to get into the car at all that day.

Your intentions were not evil, just misguided. His actions were designed from the outset to cause specific and horrible results. No comparison what so ever. You are, for all your faults, just a dude. ABB is a remorseless death machine.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

If society agrees that killing is wrong - then it's always wrong

If we agree that humans have basic rights, and that we are above acting on our most primitive instincts - the rules we agree on together about how we treat each other apply to all of us equally. Even those of us that break those same rules

If we disregard those rules, the exceptions makes all of it meaningless. We can only pretend that we're better than the people we lock up

Vengeance isn't useful, it's only satisfying

a reply to: SprocketUK


I had a friend I grew up with that was sentenced to enough years to kill a vampire (thanks to minimum sentencing laws), another friend executed three people and got three consecutive life sentences.

I don't think either of them should be rehabilitated.

I had soldiers under my command that were charged with Violations of the Laws of Land Warfare (as was I). If any of us had been found guilty I believe we should have been punished to the fullest extent.

It's the "my baby didn't" that destroys the very fabric of society.

That being said, I posted earlier to let him interact or kill him. Anything else is torture. Torture sucks, believe me.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Its giving the fraction of the population an idol thats still alive, who can release manifestos and books through compatriots.

Same with Varg Virknes, should have the death penalty for over the top murders.

a reply to: 200Plus

Thanks for sharing.
I wasn't advocating a particular way of treating someone like Brevvik.
More exploring the issue in that way.
I can't for sure say how I'd react to one of mine doing something horrible. I hope I'm never in that position.

I'm certain that I'd want vengeance if I was on the injured party's side though.

Again, not advocating it, just my best guess at my feelings.

a reply to: SprocketUK


Oh I have little doubt I'd want vengeance as well. It's human nature.


Sorry if I came off as attacking, as I was also simply sharing an opinion as a counterpoint.

a reply to: 200Plus

Nah, it's all good. Just didn't want there to be any misunderstanding. I seem to have a knack for giving folk the wrong idea lately.

As someone pointed out earlier, i am against the death penalty, for the sole fact that its the easy way out for killers and rapist, put them in cages 24/7, no human contact and make them live a very very long time, now thats torture.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Yes, he killed 80. 77 of them were kids at a summer camp. Let's imagine if American society up and decided the guy who shot those people in the church deserved this kind of treatment ... and to get out in 21 years.

Any bets on if that happens?

Not sure I agree with the popular notion that prisons have become like holiday camps for inmates; although to be fair anybody who has been to butlins can probably attest to the comparable level of bleakness, despair and thoughts of suicide that have inevitably crossed their minds.

They do tend to be fairly horrific places and I certainly wouldn't like to end up in one.