God Did It! The rest is post modern chatter!

I have another doozy of a conundrum for the Christ myth.

From
www.kyroot.com...

Of all the many parallels of Christianity and the similarities that can’t be denied about the deities that were worshiped and believed in 2000 years ago and many years prior, nothing  stands out more than the Roman god Romulus.

For the best and most detailed research on the Romulus/Jesus parallels, Dr. Richard Carrier summarized it in his book On The Historicity of Jesus: Why We Have Reason To Doubt.

www.sheffieldphoenix.com...

He writes…

“But when taken altogether the Romulus and Jesus death-and-resurrection narratives contain all of the following parallels;

1 . The hero is the son of God.
2. His death is accompanied by prodigies.
3. The land is covered in darkness.
4. The hero’s corpse goes missing.
5. The hero receives a new immortal body, superior to the one he had.
6. His resurrection body has on occasion a bright and shining appearance.
7. After his resurrection he meets with a follower on a road from the city.
8. A speech is given from a summit or high place prior to ascending.
9. An inspired message of resurrection or ‘translation to heaven’ is delivered to a witness.
10. There is a ‘great commission’ (an instruction to future followers).
11 . The hero physically ascends to heaven in his new divine body.
12. He is taken up into a cloud.
13. There is an explicit role given to eyewitness testimony (even naming the witnesses).
14. Witnesses are frightened by his appearance and/or disappearance.
15. Some witnesses flee.
16. Claims are made of ‘dubious alternative accounts’ (which claims were obviously fabricated for Romulus, there never having been a true
account to begin with).
17. All of this occurs outside of a nearby (but central) city.
18. His followers are initially in sorrow over the hero’s death.
19. But his post-resurrection story leads to eventual belief, homage and
rejoicing.
20. The hero is deified and cult subsequently paid to him (in the same manner as a god).”

atheistforums.org...

It is ironic that Christians believe the existence of Romulus to be untrue and they are right to think so, but they need to acknowledge that if they accept all of these qualities of Romulus as untrue, then they must also acknowledge that these identical factors about Jesus might also not be true.

The many similarities could not be a co-incidence, it is too highly unlikely and if one copied the other then it would have to be the deity that was second, which was Jesus, who was said to have been crucified in around 30-33 AD. The story of Romulus is over 700 years older than the belief in Joshua (Jesus), or his crucifixion.

Seems like the Romans just took Jesus and gave him the exact story of Romulus. Which was 700 years previous to Christ and is basically the exact same story. Then the Romans added a little bit of pagan Sun worship in there and voila. You have the most oppressive religion of all time. Yay.

a reply to: Joecanada11

Jesus Christ is descended from David:
If He is from the line of David, then certainly Joseph could not be of his immediate paternal bloodline since Joseph was not his natural father. The bloodline could only be traced through His mother, Mary. She alone provided 100% of His genetic material, and thus provided the "flesh of the offspring of David", as shown in Rom 1:3,
"...concerning His Son who was born to Him according to the flesh of the offspring of David."

Matt 1:1, "The book of the origin of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham."

John 7:42, "...Does not the Scripture say that it is of the offspring of David, and from Bethlehem, the village where David lived, that the Christ is to come."

2Tim 2:8, Remember that Jesus Christ rose from the dead and was descended from David."

Luke 1:32, "He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord GOD will give Him the throne of David, His father, and He shall be king over the house of Jacob forever."

Gal 4:4, "But when the fullness of time came, GOD sent His Son, born of a woman, born under the law."

See also all of these verses which refer to Jesus Christ as the Son of David:
Matt 9:27,12:23,15:22,20:30-31,21:9,21:15,22:42,22:45, Mark 10:47-48,12:35,12:37, Luke 18:38-39, Luke 20:44.

Do you have any thoughts based in reality?

a reply to: 5StarOracle

Sorry, but Jesus wasn't God.

Gal 4:4, "But when the fullness of time came, GOD sent His Son, born of a woman, born under the law."

Case closed on that one I believe.

a reply to: TerryDon79

Jesus is God...

Bible verses that show Jesus is Divine


Following are verses used to show that Jesus is God in flesh. The Scriptures used here are from the New American Standard Bible.

John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
John 1:14, "And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth."
John 5:18, "For this cause therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God."
John 8:24, "I said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you shall die in your sins."
Note: In the Greek, "He" is not there.
John 8:58, "Jesus said to them, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.'"
Exodus 3:14, "And God said to Moses, 'I AM WHO I AM'; and He said, Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’"
John 10:30-33, "I and the Father are one." 31 The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. 32 Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" 33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
John 20:28, "Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!"
Col. 2:9, "For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form."
Phil. 2:5-11, "Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. 8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. 9 Therefore also God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those who are in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."
Heb. 1:8, "But of the Son He says, "Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever, and the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom."
Quoted from Psalm 45:6, "Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever; a scepter of uprightness is the scepter of Thy kingdom."

Jesus is worshipped, Jesus said to worship God only, yet He receives worship.

Matt. 4:10, "Then Jesus said to him, "Begone, Satan! For it is written, 'You shall worship the Lord your God, and serve Him only.'"
Matt. 2:2, "Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east, and have come to worship Him."
Matt. 2:11, "And they came into the house and saw the Child with Mary His mother; and they fell down and worshiped Him; and opening their treasures they presented to Him gifts of gold and frankincense and myrrh."
Matt. 14:33, "And those who were in the boat worshiped Him, saying, "You are certainly God’s Son!"
Matt. 28:9, "And behold, Jesus met them and greeted them. And they came up and took hold of His feet and worshiped Him."
John 9:35-38, "Jesus heard that they had put him out; and finding him, He said, "Do you believe in the Son of Man?" 36 He answered and said, "And who is He, Lord, that I may believe in Him?" 37 Jesus said to him, "You have both seen Him, and He is the one who is talking with you." 38 And he said, "Lord, I believe." And he worshiped Him."
Heb. 1:6, "And when He again brings the first-born into the world, He says, 'And let all the angels of God worship Him.'"

Jesus is prayed to

Acts 7:55-60, "But being full of the Holy Spirit, he gazed intently into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God; 56 and he said, "Behold, I see the heavens opened up and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God." 57 But they cried out with a loud voice, and covered their ears, and they rushed upon him with one impulse. 58 And when they had driven him out of the city, they began stoning him, and the witnesses laid aside their robes at the feet of a young man named Saul. 59 And they went on stoning Stephen as he called upon the Lord and said, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit!" 60 And falling on his knees, he cried out with a loud voice, "Lord, do not hold this sin against them!" And having said this, he fell asleep."
1 Cor. 1:1-2, "Paul, called as an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother, 2 to the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours." (The phrase, "to call upon the name of the Lord," is a phrase used to designate prayer).
1 Kings 18:24, "Then you call on the name of your god, and I will call on the name of the Lord, and the God who answers by fire, He is God." And all the people answered and said, "That is a good idea."
Zech. 13:9, "And I will bring the third part through the fire, refine them as silver is refined, and test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, and I will answer them; I will say, ‘They are My people,’ and they will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’"
Rom. 10:13-14, "for 'whoever will call upon the name of the Lord' will be saved." 14 How then shall they call upon Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him whom they have not heard?" (Paul is speaking of calling upon Jesus. The phrase, "Call upon the name of the Lord," is a quote from Joel 2:32).
Joel 2:32, "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call." (LORD here is YHWH, the name of God as revealed in Exodus 3:14. Therefore, this quote, dealing with God Himself is attributed to Jesus).

First and Last (alpha and Omega)

Isaiah 44:6, "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: ‘I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God besides Me."
Rev. 1:17-18, "Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades."

Sorry but he is...

a reply to: 5StarOracle

Plenty of thought based in reality. Like people don't walk on water. Or turn water into wine. Or could not fit 8 pairs of every bird insect, mammal and lizard one a vessel not much bigger than a football field.

Genesis states all plants are good for food. The story of Jesus is nothing more than a mish mash from older dieties of other cultures. Romulus being one of the main ones. Bushes done burn without being consumed and they dint talk. Seas are unable to by parted by slamming a staff. Seems its you who struggles with reality.

Again your Joachim and Anna are nice stories but even they aren't mentioned in the book. Youv would think they would mention her geneology in it but maybe they weren't concerned of a virgin birth. Speaking of that the OT prophecy never mentioned the messiah to have to be born of a virgin but the Hebrew word translates to young girl.

So yeah you really don't have much to go on here. I Jean it's even been shown that Christ's own words denied his divinity. Yet you bring up vague scripture to refute that. I'm just having so much fun.

a reply to: 5StarOracle

None of that says he was god.

It says he's divine, by the will of God and called by God and so on. The only thing that might get close is where it says he's equal to his father. But being equal to and being God aren't the same.

a reply to: 5StarOracle

Man if I wrote a book about god it sure woukrvt have as many mistakes and contradictions as the bible does. One scripture say is he God another where he himself clearly denies it. One scripture says Judas hung himself the other says he cut himself open in the field. And then other scriptures state that he was still one of the 12

a reply to: TerryDon79

And the night continues with this folly. I think I can muster up another hour or two of finding scripture that is wrong.

a reply to: TerryDon79

Yeah divine as in the first definition for divine...

divine Translate Button
[dih-vahyn]
adjective, diviner, divinest.
1.
of or relating to a god, especially the Supreme Being.

a reply to: 5StarOracle

Guess you used the religious definition site?

Pronunciation: /dɪˈvʌɪn/
ADJECTIVE (diviner, divinest)

1Of or like God or a god:
heroes with divine powers
paintings of shipwrecks being prevented by divine intervention
More example sentences Synonyms
1.1Devoted to God; sacred:
divine liturgy
More example sentences Synonyms
2 informal Very pleasing; delightful:
he had the most divine smile

Looks like the Oxford dictionary disagrees with you.

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: TerryDon79

And the night continues with this folly. I think I can muster up another hour or two of finding scripture that is wrong.

Well it's hardly difficult to find lol

a reply to: TerryDon79

Heres another good example of how gospel writers added their own versions or stories to then more amazing. This whole Jesus story is like a two thousand yewww.kyroot.com... old fishing story.

From

www.kyroot.com...

Andrew 12: 10-24

The next day, Jesus and his disciples entered Kursi on the east coast of the Sea of Galilee.  Jesus commanded his disciples to say nothing to anyone as he was fatigued from the previous day’s travel and large crowds.  But as they entered the city, a man who walked with a limp recognized him and said, “Master, I saw your great works in Capernaum, Lord, I beseech you, not for me, but my mother, please come to heal her and forgive her sins.”

Jesus was moved by the man’s faith and said, “Very well, take me to her.”  The man’s mother was born without legs and had to be carried about, but yet she bore two healthy sons.  Jesus took pity on the woman, but commended her, “Woman, you have taken what the Lord has given you and made the most of it, blessed are those who receive little, and yet give much.”  The woman replied, “Sir, or master, I have been blessed all of my life with a good and faithful husband and two fine sons, there is nothing more I could ask of God.”

But the sons responded, “Lord, she is too humble to ask for anything, but we know you have your Father’s favor and can do great things, please in all humbleness, may you heal her and make her whole?”

Jesus was moved by the faith and dignity of this family and began to shed tears.  The room became completely silent and Jesus cried out, “Father, not for me, but for your glory take this woman, full of faith and charity, in your hands so that she might be at peace and be made whole.”  Jesus then took both of his hands, bringing them over the woman’s body, covered her with a blanket, and then said a prayer, “with this touch, thou shalt be made whole.”  He then commanded the sons to remove the blanket.  When the woman became uncovered, she was seen to be fully formed.  Everyone gasped with astonishment and began to praise Jesus.  The sons helped the mother up and she took the first steps of her life. Jesus told the sons to find her new clothes and shoes.

As Jesus left the house, he commanded the disciples to tell no one of what they had seen.  Because of the commotion, Jesus left the city and stayed overnight two miles away.  On the way he told the disciples to take two tarps they found along the way, for it began to rain.

There is every reason to believe that if your gospel had been placed in the Bible that people today would believe that this was a true, factual story in the life of Jesus. Who could refute its truth?  Yet it was just made up because you wanted your gospel story to be more compelling than the previous ones.  This is exactly what happened over the decades following Jesus’s ministry.  We see it in the gospels as they chronologically became more sensational.

Also note the subtlety of adding two unnecessary elements to the story above- the first son having a limp and the rain at the end. These gratuitous details are a means of making a fictional story seem more real, and it was a technique used time and again by the gospel writers.

a reply to: Joecanada11

That's just normal story book writing. There are LOADS of examples of it throughout.

I'm waiting for the NEW NT where Jesus turns into a ufo and starts spraying chemtrails to give everyone RH- blood so they can all go to Valhalla.

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: TerryDon79

And the night continues with this folly. I think I can muster up another hour or two of finding scripture that is wrong.

Well it's hardly difficult to find lol

Yep be WAY shorter to to name the verses that (if you are drunk, close one eye and squint with the other) almost matches reality....

There are only 3 or 4 of them...

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: 5StarOracle

Luk 18:19 New International Version
"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone

He just denied his divinity there. Seems like you don't know that much about your own bible. But much of an Oracle you are.

And refutes the holy trinity. Where God and Jesus are one.

This thread has been a pleasure to read, I haven't laughed so hard in a long time!
hahaha

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
Joachim and Anna
Looks like I was telling the truth...

LOL that's from the gospel of James!! The gospel of James is rejected as a hoax by early Christian fathers and modern ones too, for many reasons: it's completely different from the gospels in the NT, according to James he was the special and most favourite apostles and it states that Jesus kissed him in the mouth and called him his beloved.
Go read it for yourself.

If the gospel is rejected as a hoax (not in the Bible) why would you believe about Joachim and Anna?

a reply to: 5StarOracle

SIgh you had to go and add that last bit about the supreme being .... Divine from Latin would not have had a "supreme being". That is not how Roman cosmology worked. Jupiter while head honcho was NOT supreme. You were doing well right up to the last bit.... whatever source you picked, it is injecting its own bias into the etymology of the word. Hey at least you did not make up the meaning, as some people do.

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: edmc^2

You can't dismiss all the other evidence that goes againtst the genesis account when it was you who said that the bible is 100% scientifically accurate and genesis 1 is your rock and foundation.

I along with other members have shown a multitude of other scriptures that disagree with scientific fact.

Even the scripture you keep using in Job is not scientifically accurate. It's a vague statement and it is not scientifically accurate.

How about in Genesis when it was said that all plants on the earth are good for food? Is that accurate. Would you go and eat any berry? no you wouldn't because you know that some berries are fatal to humans. Again another example of a flaw in Genesis.

How about the earth being created before the sun? The order of animals is wrong in Genesis. The ark story is an absolute impossibility.

Like I said - when compared to true science, the Bible is 100% accurate.

Here's another:

When did we learn the human genome to be written in a code we now call DNA? 20th century.

To quote one writer who said:

“The idea of the genome as a book is not, strictly speaking, even a metaphor. It is literally true. A book is a piece of digital information . . . So is a genome.” ...“The genome is a very clever book, because in the right conditions it can both photocopy itself and read itself.”

Genome—The Autobiography of a
Species in 23 Chapters, by Matt Ridley,
1999, pp. 7-8.

Yet the Bible writer knew ahead of time this fact.

When my bones were being formed,
carefully put together in my mother's womb,
when I was growing there in secret,
you knew that I was there—
16 you saw me before I was born.
The days allotted to me
had all been recorded in your book,
before any of them ever began.

Psalm 139: 15,16 (GNT)

How did the Bible writer know that his inward parts were being written in a "book" before even he was formed or even born?

Coincidence?

I think not.

a reply to: edmc^2

You can't use metaphors as evidence of science in a story book lol.

a reply to: Agartha

Just the usual sidestepping by apologists to make sense of something with so many errors and contradictions. Lets add the gospel of Thomas in there to when Jesus says he will make Mary male so she can enter the kingdom lol.