Bad Mouth My Apostle

a reply to: newnature1

for Christ died for our sins - without really fully understanding or ever coming to comprehend what happened to the sin debt Christ died for.

First of all, "Christ" is a title, a title that existed before and after the advent of Jesus of Nazareth. It was bestowed on Jesus of Nazareth when it was said that he, supposedly, rose from the dead.

Secondly, nobody died for your sins. Jesus never taught that his death would redeem a "sin debt".

Jesus forgave people of their "sin" while he was alive, supposedly, and taught that we are forgiven as we forgive others. He said nothing of forgiveness taking place only after his death.

Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts, As we forgive our debtors.

For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.

Jesus didn't die for your sin.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: newnature1

for Christ died for our sins - without really fully understanding or ever coming to comprehend what happened to the sin debt Christ died for.

First of all, "Christ" is a title, a title that existed before and after the advent of Jesus of Nazareth. It was bestowed on Jesus of Nazareth when it was said that he, supposedly, rose from the dead.

Secondly, nobody died for your sins. Jesus never taught that his death would redeem a "sin debt".

Jesus forgave people of their "sin" while he was alive, supposedly, and taught that we are forgiven as we forgive others. He said nothing of forgiveness taking place only after his death.

Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts, As we forgive our debtors.

For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.

Jesus didn't die for your sin.

God wants believers to all think the same way when it comes to what’s happening in this Age of Grace, what God is doing today and how’s he doing it. Every sin we have or ever will commit was put on Jesus Christ, but how many people in the world miss it, because they think God is still looking at them and judging them and evaluating them on the bases of their performance.

There are those who mistakenly suppose that reconciliation is the same thing as justification. These people have jumped to the conclusion that Jesus Christ taking the sin issue off the table of God’s justice through his becoming sin for the human race is that which makes a person as righteous as God; they have mistaken reconciliation for justification. Being declared righteous is God’s gift to the believing sinner and it has nothing whatsoever to do with the sinner himself doing anything to deserve or merit that righteous standing.

What God was doing through his son; God knew about what he intended to do before the world was ever formed. Yet, God had kept this secret from ages and generations until it was time for the ascended Jesus Christ to reveal it to the apostle Paul. God no longer views us in our human flesh, he views us in our identity in the last Adam (Jesus Christ), he views us in our glorified identity. In our identity in Christ, now we can bear fruit unto God, but it is only in our identity in Christ, not through this fleshly body in which we dwell.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: newnature1

for Christ died for our sins - without really fully understanding or ever coming to comprehend what happened to the sin debt Christ died for.

First of all, "Christ" is a title, a title that existed before and after the advent of Jesus of Nazareth. It was bestowed on Jesus of Nazareth when it was said that he, supposedly, rose from the dead.

Secondly, nobody died for your sins. Jesus never taught that his death would redeem a "sin debt".

Jesus forgave people of their "sin" while he was alive, supposedly, and taught that we are forgiven as we forgive others. He said nothing of forgiveness taking place only after his death.

Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts, As we forgive our debtors.

For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.

Jesus didn't die for your sin.

Before that kingdom could be realized, there was a prophetic event that had to take place first. The way Jesus taught has special application to that tribulation period to those people who were being taught to pray in this manner. This will be a very heartfelt prayer during the tribulation period. During the time of Jacob’s trouble, the Israelites will be under tremendous persecution from the antichrist. He will be putting Israelites to death for their faith. The Israelites will be praying at that time, “thy kingdom come” the promised earthly kingdom to be set up right here on earth, because the only hope of deliverance for the believing Israelites at that time, will be the coming of the king and setting up of the earthly kingdom. 


“Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven” is a divine definition of the millennium. The kingdom is when the will of Yahweh is carried out in the earth to the same degree it is carried out in heaven. The Israelites have an earthly hope, they were promised the earth forever. At the time when Israel will be facing the wrath of Satan - the time that Israel was being prepared for when they were being taught how to pray - Satan will have been kicked out of the heaven and cast down to the earth and Yahweh’s will, will indeed be being done in the realm where Satan has just been cast out. 


This prayer is appropriate for the Israelites of that day, they will be praying at that time just as the disciples had been taught to pray. It is recited in churches across the country in our day. It is recited as though it is a prayer for today. While we are not to use vain repetition, it is recited like vain repetition as people stand up and uttering together. At the time this prayer was being taught to pray “our Father” meant that you recognized, if you were an Israelite, that you had a covenant relationship with Yahweh; you were his children. 


These saints of the earthly kingdom program will be praying in the day “Give us this day our daily bread.” They will be worrying about that day, not the next day as that earthly kingdom becomes a reality for those Israelites. “Debtors” Israel’s status as a nation above all nations depended on this very thing. The believers of Israel will be seeking forgiveness in respect to their willingness to forgive. Yahweh will not restore that nation to a place of national prominence above all nations of the earth until they adhere to the exhortation, forgive us our sins as WE (corporately) are willing to forgive those who have sinned against us.

I think its funny when people think they have got all the answers. When people think they know.

I believe it was Plato that said it best, "All I know is that I know nothing."

This is the Socratic Paradox. Learn it well for a great deal of enlightenment lies within your ability to fathom this.

Hail Eris (or don't)

a reply to: newnature1

WOW! What a waste of words!

You guys never cease to amaze me, the way you dismiss the life and teachings of your own savior. You don't think it applies to you! Don't pee on leg and then tell me it's raining!

5 “And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. 6 But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you.

7 “And when you pray, do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do, for they think that they will be heard for their many words. 8 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

9 Pray then like this:

“Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.[a]
10 Your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread,[c]
12 and forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.[d]
14 For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, 15 but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Nobody died for your sins! You have work of your own to do!

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: newnature1

WOW! What a waste of words!

You guys never cease to amaze me, the way you dismiss the life and teachings of your own savior. You don't think it applies to you! Don't pee on leg and then tell me it's raining!

5 “And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. 6 But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you.

7 “And when you pray, do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do, for they think that they will be heard for their many words. 8 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

9 Pray then like this:

“Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.[a]
10 Your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread,[c]
12 and forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.[d]
14 For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, 15 but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Nobody died for your sins! You have work of your own to do!

Who told Paul what to teach? The righteousness spoken of in what Paul calls “the gospel of Christ” is no less than than the perfect righteousness that belongs to God himself. You will never get around Paul, enjoy standing in your own righteousness; Adam, Adam in rebellion.

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
I think its funny when people think they have got all the answers. When people think they know.

I believe it was Plato that said it best, "All I know is that I know nothing."

This is the Socratic Paradox. Learn it well for a great deal of enlightenment lies within your ability to fathom this.

Hail Eris (or don't)

The issue at the Great White Throne Judgment will be those standing there in their own righteousness. Good luck.

a reply to: newnature1

I get around Paul every day. I don't understand why you try to get around the words and teachings of your own savior? Or, is Paul your savior?

a reply to: newnature1

I don't need luck. There is no such thing as luck. I'm not sure exactly what it is you are implying but if you are trying to intimidate me into believing your religion or whatever then... Good Luck!



Hail Eris!

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
a reply to: newnature1

I don't need luck. There is no such thing as luck. I'm not sure exactly what it is you are implying but if you are trying to intimidate me into believing your religion or whatever then... Good Luck!

Hail Eris!

Paul is the why out of what is being talked about on these videos.

www.youtube.com... Study the history of these dudes.

www.youtube.com... These dudes are ready. Are you sure you want to get left behind!

But you choose to bypass Paul. Good luck facing these people, they are ready for you.

a reply to: newnature1

Yeah, but it doesn't matter which religion I choose though because I can't choose them all! There are (apparently) negative consequences for all of them so no matter which I choose I will still suffer the consequences of not choosing the others!

My only real choice is to become a Chirstislamahindujewdist and, as much fun as that sounds, is very hard to pronounce in polite conversation.

Besides, I've already got a religion that I'm perfectly happy with. I hope you are happy with yours because I have no intentions of trying to convert you. Who am I to mess with your happiness?

Kallisti

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
a reply to: newnature1

Yeah, but it doesn't matter which religion I choose though because I can't choose them all! There are (apparently) negative consequences for all of them so no matter which I choose I will still suffer the consequences of not choosing the others!

My only real choice is to become a Chirstislamahindujewdist and, as much fun as that sounds, is very hard to pronounce in polite conversation.

Besides, I've already got a religion that I'm perfectly happy with. I hope you are happy with yours because I have no intentions of trying to convert you. Who am I to mess with your happiness?

Kallisti

Paul was never about starting a new religion. There’s no “Christianity” in Paul’s letters. There are no “Christians” in Paul’s letters. You can’t find the word. You can’t find the concept. There is a little time left, reconsider my Apostle. You have a ruff road ahead of you.

a reply to: newnature1

No, its you that has a rough road ahead of him. Unless, of course, you convert to Discordianism.

See? I can do it too.

But please. Do not actually convert. We don't accept overbearing indoctrinates. Those fall into the category of "greyface".

Good luck in THUD you non-Discordian Paulpresser (coined!).

No but seriously, I wish you nothing but the best in all future endeavors, regardless of your religious affiliation.

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
a reply to: newnature1

No, its you that has a rough road ahead of him. Unless, of course, you convert to Discordianism.

See? I can do it too.

But please. Do not actually convert. We don't accept overbearing indoctrinates. Those fall into the category of "greyface".

Good luck in THUD you non-Discordian Paulpresser (coined!).

No but seriously, I wish you nothing but the best in all future endeavors, regardless of your religious affiliation.

The best in all your future endeavors too.

a reply to: newnature1

Thank you.

Take this,



It has nothing to do with religion but everything to do with treating our fellow man right.

Kallisti

originally posted by: newnature1
Bad mouth the misogynist antiSemite Paul?

Perhaps you will find some interesting reading in this short paper.

10 Bible Passages That Might Be Totally Bogus

listverse.com...

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: newnature1
Bad mouth the misogynist antiSemite Paul?

Perhaps you will find some interesting reading in this short paper.

10 Bible Passages That Might Be Totally Bogus

listverse.com...

I took out something that makes no since, some kind of superiority teaching that seems to be added to Hebrews?

Hebrews 1:1-3:15;

From of old, Yahweh spoke to the Israelites fathers by the prophets in every manner, and in all ways; but in these later days, Yahweh has conversed with us, by his son; whom Yahweh has constituted heir of all things, and when Yeshua made a purgation of sins, then Yeshua sat down on the right hand of Yahweh. Wherefore, my brethren, who are called with a calling that is from heaven, consider this high priest of our profession, Yeshua the Messiah; because Yahweh has said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day; do not be stubborn as at Meribah, in the wilderness, when your fathers put me to the test, tried me, though they had seen my deeds.

Forty years I was provoked by that generation; I thought, they are a senseless people; they would not know my ways. Concerning them, I swore in anger, they shall never come to my resting-place!” Beware, therefore, my brethren, lest there be in any of us an evil heart that believes not, and we depart from the living Yahweh; but we need to examine ourselves all the days, during the day which is called today; and let none of us be hardened, through the deceitfulness of sin; for we have part with the Messiah, if we persevere in this firm confidence, from the beginning to the end; as it was said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day.” Do not harden your hearts to anger Yahweh.

Hebrews 1:4-2:18; 3:2-6 is what was left out.

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: newnature1
Bad mouth the misogynist antiSemite Paul?

Perhaps you will find some interesting reading in this short paper.

10 Bible Passages That Might Be Totally Bogus

listverse.com...

I took out something that makes no since, some kind of superiority teaching that seems to be added to Hebrews?

Hebrews 1:1-3:15;

From of old, Yahweh spoke to the Israelites fathers by the prophets in every manner, and in all ways; but in these later days, Yahweh has conversed with us, by his son; whom Yahweh has constituted heir of all things, and when Yeshua made a purgation of sins, then Yeshua sat down on the right hand of Yahweh. Wherefore, my brethren, who are called with a calling that is from heaven, consider this high priest of our profession, Yeshua the Messiah; because Yahweh has said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day; do not be stubborn as at Meribah, in the wilderness, when your fathers put me to the test, tried me, though they had seen my deeds.

Forty years I was provoked by that generation; I thought, they are a senseless people; they would not know my ways. Concerning them, I swore in anger, they shall never come to my resting-place!” Beware, therefore, my brethren, lest there be in any of us an evil heart that believes not, and we depart from the living Yahweh; but we need to examine ourselves all the days, during the day which is called today; and let none of us be hardened, through the deceitfulness of sin; for we have part with the Messiah, if we persevere in this firm confidence, from the beginning to the end; as it was said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day.” Do not harden your hearts to anger Yahweh.

Hebrews 1:4-2:18; 3:2-6 is what was left out.

Uh, thank you, I'm sure, but I merely offered that link for food for thought, perhaps.
I am neither endorsing or condoning anything by the presentation thereof! *__-

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: newnature1

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: newnature1
Bad mouth the misogynist antiSemite Paul?

Perhaps you will find some interesting reading in this short paper.

10 Bible Passages That Might Be Totally Bogus

listverse.com...

I took out something that makes no since, some kind of superiority teaching that seems to be added to Hebrews?

Hebrews 1:1-3:15;

From of old, Yahweh spoke to the Israelites fathers by the prophets in every manner, and in all ways; but in these later days, Yahweh has conversed with us, by his son; whom Yahweh has constituted heir of all things, and when Yeshua made a purgation of sins, then Yeshua sat down on the right hand of Yahweh. Wherefore, my brethren, who are called with a calling that is from heaven, consider this high priest of our profession, Yeshua the Messiah; because Yahweh has said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day; do not be stubborn as at Meribah, in the wilderness, when your fathers put me to the test, tried me, though they had seen my deeds.

Forty years I was provoked by that generation; I thought, they are a senseless people; they would not know my ways. Concerning them, I swore in anger, they shall never come to my resting-place!” Beware, therefore, my brethren, lest there be in any of us an evil heart that believes not, and we depart from the living Yahweh; but we need to examine ourselves all the days, during the day which is called today; and let none of us be hardened, through the deceitfulness of sin; for we have part with the Messiah, if we persevere in this firm confidence, from the beginning to the end; as it was said, “O, if you would but heed my charge this day.” Do not harden your hearts to anger Yahweh.

Hebrews 1:4-2:18; 3:2-6 is what was left out.

Uh, thank you, I'm sure, but I merely offered that link for food for thought, perhaps.
I am neither endorsing or condoning anything by the presentation thereof! *__-

Thanks for the learning. It is a trip what people have done to that bible. Thank you.

a reply to: newnature1

Paul was a tosser and a phony. Had a seizure and then tried to change the message of Jesus.

Why would God have two different programs one heavenLy and one earthly.? I though thY will be done in earth as it is in heaven?

Nobody can die for someone else's transgressions. If there is a god we will all face our own judgement. I don't care what pretty Paul says.