Seems fair! Send him to jail

only read about this story today but its been agit8ing since I did.

What logical knuckle head could believe this is the correct outcome from this incident?

I hate Australian Political fear. No one wants to speak the taboo words - so they let incredibly stupid things like this happen.

au.news.yahoo.com...

Basically, a man (and a father) who was only recently released from prison for burglary offences was breaking into a families house this weekend.
The father/owner of the house being robbed woke and found the man his daughters room.

The details of what happened next haven't been released yet but the narrative is that owner wrestled with the burglar, burglar got injured was taken to hospital and died from his injuries.

The father/home owner is now in jail being charged with murder.

What no body is saying, is that he was Aboriginal and that Aboriginal Crime is increasing dramatically and this isnt an isolated incident.

If you do find an aboriginal in your home in the middle of the night in your daughters room, dont wrestle him - be nice and talk instead! /s

a reply to: Agit8dChop

The burglar was Aboriginal?

I'm guessing the Oz doesn't have a self-defense provision, for some odd reason?

The dude was where he didn't belong, things escalated, and he paid the price. I'm not sure how this is the fault of the home owner...has any sort of reasoning been put forth for the homeowner/father being charged with murder??

OK. Finally got it to load and play...my computer doesn't like it apparently...

What a joke. The dude was most assuredly where he didn't belong. The father thought his little girl was in danger, and reacted accordingly. ...and he's the criminal? Really?

Something is definitely screwy here.

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
only read about this story today but its been agit8ing since I did.

What logical knuckle head could believe this is the correct outcome from this incident?

I hate Australian Political fear. No one wants to speak the taboo words - so they let incredibly stupid things like this happen.

au.news.yahoo.com...

Basically, a man (and a father) who was only recently released from prison for burglary offences was breaking into a families house this weekend.
The father/owner of the house being robbed woke and found the man his daughters room.

The details of what happened next haven't been released yet but the narrative is that owner wrestled with the burglar, burglar got injured was taken to hospital and died from his injuries.

The father is now in jail being charged with murder.

What no body is saying, is that he was Aboriginal and that Aboriginal Crime is increasing dramatically.

If do find an aboriginal in your home in the middle of the night in your daughters room, dont wrestle him - be nice and talk instead!

is the fact that he's aboriginal relevant?

Its possible that may become relevant if any penalty the father receives is seen as manifestly excessive compared to similar penalties handed out for similar offences carried out in similar circumstances.

Being aboriginal it's highly likely that he will get representative by a barrister and instructing solicitor paid for by the tax payer but then that may not be different for a non aboriginal person on a low income or pension etc.

Of greater concern is the rights of a parent to defend their kids in their own home and to make any attempt to apprehend an assailant.

I suspect the father did what just about any parent would do when confronted with these circumstances. My concern is always about a potential for a big difference in the skill level and fitness level differential between the parent and any invader. I would image almost any parent would just about panic with worry about their ability to overcome the invader and what might happen to themselves if the invader gains the upper hand.

My hope is that these consideration will receive great attention by the jury or judge in this case. These sorts of issues about the relative capacity of respective parties to use violence to either defend or offend must get sorted out soon, ie old vs young, women vs men and so on.

As someone who is 60+ years of age and has never had a fight in his life and now has certain handicaps, these issues increase in importance as one advances in age.

I don't get it.

The guy broke in. A fight broke out and the burglar died.

He can argue self defense and get the charge reduced to manslaughter or try to prove that he was not acting recklessly with the intent of causing death and have the charges acquitted.

The fact that the burglar was aboriginal is completely and utterly irrelevant. Same rules were apply if it were a white burglar.

I wont assume you all come from the US/UK or where ever, maybe it is just me but - almost nightly, on the news here in Australia you would have another report of someone being bashed to death, a home invasion gone wrong, a train station assault gone wrong, road rage what ever.. its even common to hear about young kids standing behind bushes throwing rocks at cars on the freeway - deliberately trying to hit them.

We do have a problem with Aboriginal crime in Australia. Its just not isolated incidents - its a real problem and our police and brand dead media are to scared to call a spade a spade.

Maybe its just me, but having lived here 30+yrs I will always assume if a western person is asking me for a smoke or the time i'll be able to oblige, smile and walk away. But if its an Aboriginal asking me the time, asking for a smoke, walking up to me on a dark night, or hanging in a group of 3 or 4 under a bridge... i dunno...you just hope it doesn't happen to you when your on your own!

Azure Blue - your correct and that is the logical and preferred legal way to view these things.

However, too often these crimes become Race Related in the media, blatant misrepresentation of the facts from families push this mentality.

Its not just this case, it is the entire legal structure in Australia. Where you can drink drive, kill a man and get 3yrs prison released on parole.

It seems no one has the balls in our media to call out the truth on the ground

You have made this into a Cultural/Race Issue = Fail. This "the intruder is the victim law" has been in effect for a long time in Australia.

Here are just 2 examples, there are many more.

Gunman who shoots intruder dead gets 8 years jail

=http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/man-shot-dead-in-house-in-gold-coast-hinterland-house/story-e6freoof-1226092775226

This has nothing to do with being Black, Brown, White or Yellow - it's just the way it is in Australia . There are many examples of this if you Google it.

a reply to: Now2016

That is a terrible injustice.

Why even call the cops if thats the case. grab a shovel after you grabbed a gun. I sure as hell wouldnt call the cops if they are going to be servants of injustice.

Get a gun and know a guy with an excavator.

That law should be repealed ASAP. Terrible.

a reply to: Now2016

From your link:

An experienced shooter who smoked 35 bongs and drank 42 stubbies

your comparing that to a father who found an aboriginal man in his daughters bedroom that looked like this (a big mean looking dude)


This is a cultural issue, glad you picked up that theme from my thread!
You might be too scared to say it, but I am not. We have an aboriginal crime problem in Australia. A large portion of the aboriginal communities within 50kms of the cities have no respect for anyone, any law, any life. The Adults dont and they raise their children with the same mentality. Which is why we have a constant flow of reports about Aboriginal kids throwing rocks at cars on the freeways, aboriginal kids roaming in groups at all hours of the night hassling people and stealing from them or aboriginal kids being involved in mob violence which has been leading to deaths.

Here is another example

sixth boy charged with murder after they set upon a young man, bashed and stabbed him

www.perthnow.com.au... e

The prosecution alleged the boy and five co-offenders gathered rocks, star pickets, a socket bar and a screw driver, before being joined by two more men.

again, no one dares meniton the word ''aboriginal'' in the article.

a reply to: Azureblue

is the fact that he's aboriginal relevant?

No...it isn't.

Some people will try to capitalize on it i suppose, use the race angle to drum up support for their own views...but regardless.. it doesn't matter in the slightest what race the burglar is or was...just the fact that he was serial burglar, breaking into a family home (the family / homeowner's race doesn't matter either BTW) surprised and galvanised a half asleep Father into action to protect his family and died as a result of his actions.

Case closed in my opinion.

He didn't deserve the 'death penalty' for burglary, but let's face it - a father just woken up, in terror for his families life and limb, defends them and his property from this criminal, who was there for reasons unbeknownst to the father...as far as the father knew, the guy in his home could have been sexually assulting / about to murder his daughter or just about anything else.

He did nothing wrong in my opinion. In fact, the criminal entering his home has now forced, and i do mean forced by virtue of breaking into his home and fighting with him in his childs bedrrom, the father to have to live with the knowledge he has ended someone's life...a scumbag apparently, but a Human being nontheless.

To be charged for murder of all things for defending his family while surprised by an intruder with criminal intent?

That's really just showing the Oz judicial system to be the immature, idiotic farce that it apparently is.

It depends on the circumstances. Tis will be taken on board at a trial.

If the death was caused by e.g. a single punch in a struggle, then we'll probably have a lesser charge. If the burglar was maliciously beaten up, well after it was necessary, then yes, murder.

I am sorry if the above does not satiate those on ATS who habitually bay for blood.

I was really hoping this wouldnt become a racism thread - if you knew me you'd understand colour or race means nothing to me...I was trying hard to explain the situation on the ground, one that you need to identify as a culture problem and the reason it still happens is because people refuse to say what it is!

Our police have been saying it for years..

WA police commissioner Karl O'Callaghan wants a public debate on Aboriginal youth crime following the horrific bashing of an elderly man over the weekend. 'The 73-year-old great-grandfather, known as Wally, was brutally beaten with a baseball bat in an unprovoked attack

www.perthnow.com.au...

even our statics point out that there's a cultural problem
www.creativespirits.info...

Aboriginal people represent only 3% of the total population, yet more than 28% of Australia’s prison population are Aboriginal.

Why cant we just admit the bloody reality here instead of going all judgmental and politically correct?

a reply to: Now2016

maybe you didnt notice how i described the crime before even mentioning his race, to let you build your own opinion.

If you were not to busy walking around with this air of superiority, you'd be able to discuss the topic without turning into a 6yr old. Maybe it doesnt exist on your local street corner and you arent the news paper reading type?

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
a reply to: Now2016

maybe you didnt notice how i described the crime before even mentioning his race...

Maybe you didn't notice that the victims of home invasion are always charged if the intruder is hurt or killed : FUBAR. This has been going on for decades in Australia, no matter what race, or religion you or the home invader is. You chose to make this into a race issue.

a reply to: Now2016

For crying out loud, I'm not saying the actions from the crime or the result of what happened is motivated by his race/culture - in this case!

Do you get that?

I know its not and I expect the home owner/father to be let off very lightly..

what im saying is - that this type of aboriginal youth crime has become common place in our society, yet no one seems to be able to admit it.

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
a reply to: Now2016

For crying out loud, I'm not saying the actions from the crime or the result of what happened is motivated by his race/culture

what im saying is - that this type of aboriginal youth crime has become common place in our society,

Go have a lay down son - You have just contradicted yourself and you need to rest and think about what you are saying.

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Perhaps, i'm not saying you're not absolutely correct about aboriginal youth crime, but that picture of the criminal isn't what i'd consider to be a part of the 'youth crime stats'...he looks at least mid- 30's...hardly a youth.

And yes, there certainly seems to be a disparity between aboriginal population percentages and the percentages of aboriginals currently residing in prisons...but even that aspect can be argued and argued legitamately in many cases, to be the result of a disproportionate ratio of aboriginal representation, perhaps in the police and judicial areas of society would do better showing an even hand in involving aboriginals in them and giving them a greater sense of being part of the solution, instead of mostly being considered the problem.

If a particular group doesn't get a loud enough voice as representation or a big enough seat at the table to be inclusive in society, that's usually when all sorts of trouble ensues.

Are aboriginals agequately represented in terms of numbers of Aboriginals serving as Police officers, Magistrates, Prosecutors, defenders..or other similar roles?

Imagine the tables turned and the whites were the aboriginals...how would white people feel and act, if they weren't being included to a proper degree in societies legal and political areana?

Probably, the reaction would be a similar level of disenchantment and distain for the majority population as the aboriginals seem to be showing.

Just for the record, in South Australia this would be a home invasion .... and we can use any amount of force that we believe is necessary.

I think he will be released eventually. It is his word versus a corpse.

Otherwise, the Government will get woken from their slumber by very angry protesters.

Happened here which is how our laws were changed.

P

a reply to: pheonix358

I totally agree with your laws.

If an intruder doesn't want to run the risk of being shot, battered or beaten, which may or may not result in permanent injury or death for inavding anothers home...don't inavde another's home.

It's not exactly a difficult concept to grasp...in fact, nothing could be simpler to comprehend.

And of course, this applies to everyone that invades another's home...white, black, green or purple, it doesn't make any difference.