Germany proposes reduction of murder sentence if murderer was "insulted"

Original Article:

Mörder sollen nicht zwingend lebenslang in Haft

Google translated article for us who don't speak German:

Murder will not necessarily give lifetime in prison

Okay perhaps some Germans can give some insight to this?

The draft law provides that imprisonment for murders fall to up to five years, when it came to action under certain conditions. An offender who "despair acts", "out of or exempt from a seemingly hopeless conflict situation a close to him", "was forced serious verbal or physical abuse to anger" by one or has been affected by a "comparable violent emotion", is no longer be punished according to the mirror with a life sentence.

My contact in Germany tells me they are attempting to change definition of murder. He thinks they are trying to get this law passed, because their prisons cannot handle all the murders by migrants, and this is simply for convenient for the EU regime. Maybe he's right, I dunno, I don't live in Germany.

The Bavarian Justice Minister Winfried Bausback criticized the proposal by Maas. "The draft unfortunately confirms precisely what I have always warned, namely that at a - superfluous basically - will reform the absolute threat of punishment 'lifetime' for murder called into question", Bausback told the Mirror.

The only other English article I could find on this is this bizarre "article" that talks mostly about Nazis and doesn't actually detail what the proposed law suggests.

Justice Ministry to change German law's Nazi definition of murder

I suggest not wasting your time to read that one.

Of course, this law is only proposed. But still it's dangerous. 5 years in jail for insulting someone, rather than life? This second article is trying to use Nazis as the basis for supporting this change. This on the basis of Nazis = bad, so anything the Nazis did = bad and should be changed. Notice how it carefully does not actually give details of the law of itself. Actually I take back saying not to read, definitely read it. See how weird the media is.

This law may not be passed. But the fact that people of high influence in Europe are thinking like this, is scary.

I'll be the evil bastard here and give example that probably everyone is thinking about. Hans takes a public platform to criticise Islam. Mohammed hears this, and is very deeply offended. Hans has not directly insulted any Muslim person, but has quoted examples of Quran that look very bad for Islam. Mohammed sees this as risk to his Muslim community. Mohammed takes initiative, and stops any further critic of Islam and potential negative opinion spreading of his community, and gives to Hans a bullet in his head. In the following trial, according to Germany's new laws, Mohammed's murder is reduced to a manslaughter, because he was reasonably offended and afraid for his community. Instead of spending his life in jail for assassination, Mohammed receives just five years in prison.

GERMANY WHAT THE HELL

a reply to: Helicopter
Your example paragraph was exactly my own thought on reading the title.
I also wondered if this was the real purpose of the proposal.

Definitely has some Islamist undertones for murder definition. Seems thats who they'd appease first....its like saying ya they insulted you, feel free to do it again in 5 years. Oh and honor killings are only a 100 fine. Europe has lost its pheckin mind.

I think it's for cases in which someone had been physically or mentally abused, or both.

For example a woman who has been beaten for years by her husband, or the other way around.

Well done some of you for turning it into something anti Muslim though.

a reply to: Helicopter

yeah, im gonna call a big bulls*** on this.. but nice try

a reply to: Helicopter

It looks more like a revision of laws to allow discretion rather than being compelled to use the one-size-fits-all sentence of 'life.'

Acting out of despair or feelings of persecution could apply to a battered spouse who plans to kill their abusive partner. Or a child getting abused by a parent who then kills the parent.

I notice they already have the equivalent of 'intentional killing' that is different to that of 'murder.' It already runs from 5 to 15 years so perhaps Heiko Maas wants to rationalise the difference?

a reply to: Helicopter

when it came to action under certain conditions. An offender who "despair acts", "out of or exempt from a seemingly hopeless conflict situation a close to him", "was forced serious verbal or physical abuse to anger" by one or has been affected by a "comparable violent emotion", is no longer be punished according to the mirror with a life sentence.

Thats more a universal thing than just German.

Some people are literally driven crazy by others. One little bit at a time. If the emotion and verbal abuse becomes more than they can stand and in good faith have dealt with it for a protracted period, how can you blame them for going off?

Many a manipulator out there takes silent glee that they cause others such mental anguish.

a reply to: Helicopter

Couldn't Hans benefit from the same law by killing Muslims fearing for his own culture and being insulted by Islamic extremism?

I dont suppose the new law would work in both directions.

There's also the guillotine. An alternate scheme for reduction of prison overcrowding.

a reply to: Helicopter

So if a white person snaps and ices someone who has called him a racist/bigot/pos etc he will get a more lenient sentence? They must be careful-if you pass a law it means whats good for the goose is good for the gander..Someone who posted before me mentioned a Mohammed..the same exemptions will have to be extended to Wolfgang or Ute..imo the Whole thing is a stinking crock of #.And a very Very slippery slope.

a reply to: intrptr

Indeed there are Many out there who cause great anguish and mental/psychological torture through verbal abuse.You can't go around bumping people off for that though.Holy heck if everybody killed one person a day who were verbally abusive to them this planet would be a daily open air abbatoir.At some point you have to rise above verbal abuse from others-and just say eff it and shrug the # off your shoes.Why would people want to ruin their own lives because of other peoples' douchebaggery?

The solution is this: do not incarcerate them at your expense. When found guilty, EXPORT IMMEDIATELY. I'd even fly them over Saudi with parachutes and kick them all out if no one wants them. Because after seeing what's going on, I'm getting meaner.

a reply to: Unity_99

Because after seeing what's going on, I'm getting meaner.

The propaganda is working then

originally posted by: Raxoxane
a reply to: intrptr

Indeed there are Many out there who cause great anguish and mental/psychological torture through verbal abuse.You can't go around bumping people off for that though.Holy heck if everybody killed one person a day who were verbally abusive to them this planet would be a daily open air abbatoir.At some point you have to rise above verbal abuse from others-and just say eff it and shrug the # off your shoes.Why would people want to ruin their own lives because of other peoples' douchebaggery?

Because part of the plan of verbal and emotional abiusers is to 'trap' their victims into relationships with them so they can 'work' on them and do it in secret (behind closed doors) so nobody else sees it.

It is murder, even more insidious, murder of a persons sanctity and serenity one bit at a time. How cruel is that. At least if a killer kills someone they go bang and they're dead. These monsters do it over time, exacting great pleasure from the pain they inflict. The end result they get away with it and their poor victim becomes a monster too, lashing out at them or someone else. There is this weird back to front perspective in the world that if you aren't physically injured no harm is done. The worst harm is inflicted upon peoples minds, imo.

You want to carry it to peoples, Germany has a word for it, Schadenfruede, besides Germany started two world wars last century… talk about loving to spread misery.

I have reflected upon this, my mom is from Germany and I am half German.

a reply to: Helicopter

My contact in Germany...

thanks for the inside scoop Agent 86

a reply to: Helicopter

You're reading this all wrong.
All this says is that if a victim of abuse murders their abuser that must be taken into consideration.

This is doing nothing more than clarifying existing laws and putting a limit on punishment in cases where it can be proven that the murderer was acting our of rage against someone abusing them.

So, in the future, if this passes, a victim of abuse who murders their abuser cannot be convicted under the same criteria as someone who murders without that context.

originally posted by: Urantia1111
a reply to: Helicopter

Couldn't Hans benefit from the same law by killing Muslims fearing for his own culture and being insulted by Islamic extremism?

I dont suppose the new law would work in both directions.

There's also the guillotine. An alternate scheme for reduction of prison overcrowding.

Well done for sinking to new lows.

a reply to: Helicopter

Wow, even with a reduced sentence, I'd still serving multiple life sentences if I killed every person who has ever offended me.


This is just silly.

a reply to: Helicopter

Sounds like some of the laws in the US surrounding murder. For example second degree murder. In some cases you can get 5-7 years for such a killing. And there is a wide range for death of another depending on what state you commit the act in.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: Helicopter

My contact in Germany...

thanks for the inside scoop Agent 86

Easy. Plz refer to him by the codename, man. 'Rhinestone'
-The German contact is 'FullofShïtten"

In all seriousness, nothing as ludicrous as this would ever pass into law. Impossible.

The second link seems to describe "diminished responsibility" a term used in English Law.

Wiki Diminished Responsibility

In English law, diminished responsibility is one of the partial defences that reduce the offence from murder to manslaughter if successful (termed "voluntary" manslaughter for these purposes). This allows the judge sentencing discretion, (etc)