Why Do People debate Religion and Politics?

It's like two armed people walk into a room to talk about peace. You will never be able to change someone's belief system and the reason is because beliefs are based on faith not reasoning. Faith is hinge not of facts but just faith. Only faith can define faith. So how can you change that? It's unreachable. Same goes for politics. Hilary, Bernie, Trump? All supporters show faith in these politicians because their promises are as far out as another promise from any other religions. Some time illogical.

So why can't these people just agree that they won't agree?

Instead they keep on debating over and over again...

Why? It's all over the front page.

originally posted by: reddragon2015
It's like two armed people walk into a room to talk about peace. You will never be able to change someone's belief system and the reason is because beliefs are based on faith not reasoning. Faith is hinge not of facts but just faith. Only faith can define faith. So how can you change that? It's unreachable. Same goes for politics. Hilary, Bernie, Trump? All supporters show faith in these politicians because their promises are as far out as another promise from any other religions. Some time illogical.

So why can't these people just agree that they won't agree?

Instead they keep on debating over and over again...

Why? It's all over the front page.

Opinions on both subjects are like butt holes everybody has one......

a reply to: reddragon2015

Humans are conditioned by the media into finding new ways to divide themselves. Religious vs atheists, materialists vs ideologists, republicans vs democrats, black vs white, anything.

Why? Because divided we fall. The minute we stop bickering over our differences, and instead put our minds together and complement each other's weaknesses, then we would make leaps of advancement as a specie. This would mean the end of corporate greed and of elistic economical inequalities.

a reply to: reddragon2015

Religion, I have no idea. I'm a Christian, but I don't understand why some in my belief seem to think the eternal soul of another is any of their business.

Politics, I totally understand because it is a lot more than just a private and personal issue. Political decisions have consequences on everyone, thus anyone debating them has some degree of personal investment.

a reply to: reddragon2015

Quite honestly, I think you're asking the wrong question.

People debate because it's a healthy thing to do, and for the most part, doing so makes the debaters research and learn more on the topics about which they are speaking.

I think what you're referencing is the bickering that people do concerning religion and politics.

We do that because it can sometimes be fun, and because we're all suckers for punishment from time to time.

(and there's always that hope that there are silent people reading the threads and actually learning from the discussions and using the information to research and come to their own conclusions about the topics at hand)

I understand it's frustrating when debating both religion and politics; especially if it turns out to be a waste of time. However, I think it's important to debate with people. That way we can understand who they are and what they bring to the table. If we didn't we wouldn't know much with what's going on.

a reply to: reddragon2015

It's like two armed people walk into a room to talk about peace.

If both sides are armed , they usually talk peaceful like.

If one side is subverting the other, there is no peace at the bargaining table, just argument.

a reply to: reddragon2015

I don't care what people believe in religion or politics.

What I do care about is politics or religion that has an impact on me and how I live my life.

Politicians that want to give speeches, I could care less about.

Politicians that want to raise my taxes, I will be very vocal against.

Religions that want to take away my booze or smokes or tell me what I can and cannot do on Sundays,.. . . . I will also be very vocally against.

It's not necessarily true that you can't change someone's beliefs. It's rare but it can happen. And if you are determined enough, you will at least succeed in making people think.

I've been online since the late 90s. When I came online I didn't even know any better than to type in all caps (Which was a common mistake for noobs at the time). I also rarely quoted people I was responding to (Which was highly frowned upon in those days on newsgroups).

So I immediately met friction just from the way I was posting. Nothing to do with my politics. That came later. But I was originally VERY liberal for much of my early adulthood. And when I say VERY liberal, I mean that I was a carbon copy of just about any typical liberal you would have found anywhere at the time. I had nothing but contempt for conservatives and didn't even know what a libertarian was. I argued bitterly with conservatives every single day of the W Bush years. Some of those guys I really despised.

I initially had a very positive opinion of Obama. But frankly, it wasn't long after he took office that I got that wakeup call that happens sometimes when people don't really know what they believe (or when something sounds better than it actually is). I regret many of the things I said to conservatives back years ago. Many of them were not bad people. They just had a different opinion. And perhaps many of them were older than I was and had gone through the same thing.

The wakeup call I got was Obamacare. It just never occurred to me that a law that literally forces you to buy health insurance would fly in this country. So I was completely oblivious as the deed was being done and knew nothing about this mandate until after it was a done deal. That completely turned me against Obama and the Democrats. It also woke me up in a rather harsh way. You might not be able to change someone's mind but you can sure as hell give them a piece of your mind. And they might even appreciate it....eventually.

Well I guess I'll be the example. I used to be a firm believer in not voting, because of the corruption in D.C. After a few conversations with people on this site, I have since switched my stance. Now my vote will go to whoever is available to vote for that has the strongest stance against corruption. If it's a Hillary vs. Cruz situation, I'll have to revert back to not voting. Those two will do nothing for anyone but themselves.

a reply to: reddragon2015

-Religion keeps our sanity in check to justify our existence so we need others to support what we believe.

-Politics affects us in our everyday lives and we have to let off steam just to keep our sanity.

So I guess we debate these issues just so we don't go insane.

a reply to: reddragon2015

I take measure of people and one means of that measure is their ability to discuss, with intelligence and thoughtfulness difficult subjects.


"Sure was cold yesterday", 'nice hair cut',.....yawn.

a reply to: reddragon2015

I was just thinking about people discussing different religious beliefs, while in the bath today. I was thinking about how I hesitate to discuss God and religion with anyone other than people very close to me. I don't like to discuss it because I am not 100% sure that my thoughts on the subject are accurate and I don't want to lead people in the wrong direction. My beliefs are somewhere in the middle of everything in a way and are subject to change depending on things I learn or hear. I believe in God; I am just trying to figure out the details. But, I was also thinking that I'm glad that not everyone is silent like me in that way because it would seem we wouldn't get anywhere if no one shared what they believe. I really like to ponder other people's views about such things.

I can get into a different state of mind when debating other topics, though. Ones that I am passionate about but also feel I understand. My shyness goes out of the window because I am sure I am 100% behind what I am saying. So, I guess some people feel that sure about certain religious and political topics. I feel that learning about what God is, is important but like I said, I do not understand enough yet.

originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: reddragon2015

Humans are conditioned by the media into finding new ways to divide themselves. Religious vs atheists, materialists vs ideologists, republicans vs democrats, black vs white, anything
.

I agree. It seems that people absolutely love to pick a side on everything, including very trivial things. Also, on things that they could maybe go either way on. They must pick one side and fight tooth and nail for it. For example, that stupid dress. One side saw it black and blue and the other white and gold. I understand that in reality it was black and blue but if one tries, one can see how the image on the screen could appear white and gold. At least, I could see it in both ways. Being so quick to pick a side and argue keeps us from progressing. Some things probably should be debated but yeah, I think humans do it a lot just for the sake of arguing a side.

*Opinions on both subjects are like butt holes everybody has one......

-And Everyone else's stinks.. BUTT not ours... Ours is A-1; Top Shelf...



I once read this at ATS™ but don't know the author (If You the author can You please let Me know so I can give You credit?)


Worship equals War Ship.
It is disguised as "worship" but it is truly War Ship. Yes, get that initial giggle out and continue reading My words, as 'worshipping' is the biggest reason for wars.
Those men who build languages for MASSES to think in, are very versed in metaphysical natures.
When You pray to something that You do not know is truly there, You join the 'War Ship'. You worship something You don't know of and cannot see. You divide Yourself from Yourself and everyone around You.
Well in this language We call this "Blind Faith" Now when You have many factions worshipping, just different names that are man made, now there is 'division', the opposite of being WHOLE.
Now You've entered the 'War Ship' You clash with those who pray to the SAME CONCEPT under different names (Gods have no identity, just bogus names Man made up) This is inferior mentality.
Even though they are all human, all came from the SAME SOURCE, all are 5-based beings (think pentagram geometry)
One becomes concrete in what they worship, they judge and demonize those not praying to the same NAME.
Now You have war/division.
ISIS is defending it's concepts because the ONLY power those who join the War Ship have is physical chaos to those who oppose. Internally their people are weak and are not worthy to ascend to their internal potentials.
STOP worshipping and start accepting ALL, no matter the name they worship and if Your 'TRUTH' needs to be pushed then how TRUE is it really?
Truth needs no book, no doctrine, no dogma, no heirarchy. Truth stands on it's own, the rest is just pushing to compete with Truth and that is falsehood.


Per Betty Manners, for "polite conversation" one should refrain from speaking about sex, politics and religion.. But seeing that this is an intraweb chat forum with anonymity included You get the quid pro quo of an exchange..

"Religion™ is for folks afraid of Hell, "Spirituality" is for folks that have already been.."- The Great Sioux Nation. The same folks that had their lands taken and replaced by Bibles. 200 years later alcoholism runs rampant and this is placated by getting to fish with nets and splitting the proceeds from ¢a$ino$.. Pathetic

One is about two people arguing about who's pretend good guy is the best and what dogma they preach that is right, and the other is about religion.

It boils down to people wanting their beliefs to be vindicated. Everyone wants to be right. In the case of religion it is about what will happen after you die and for there to not be some reward for living a good life is intolerable to some. There HAS to be some meaning to life besides living, breeding and then dying.

For politics, they will support anyone who is most in line with their own thoughts and who will make their own life easier. No one (not all I suppose) votes for the person that will do the best for everyone as a whole, everyone wants to get the most bang for their buck. You promise tax cuts? That's good enough for me, you have my vote even though you want to invade another land and/or kick people out of, or not allow people into, our country.

Selfishness is what it all boils down to.

edit: and fear...can't forget fear.

a reply to: reddragon2015

As long as people are trying to combine the two, we will always need to debate religion and politics. If religion were completely divorced of politics, hardly anybody would be criticizing their beliefs. They are debated because the religious beliefs of others impact the lives of those who are unaffiliated with those beliefs. And vice versa, because of this unholy matrimony, religion is also influenced by politics.

Separate the two and I won't care what you believe. But if your beliefs allow discrimination against me and my spouse on a legal level, then I will suddenly have a strong opinion about your religion. If your religion negatively influences the availability of birth control for people outside of your flock, then I will criticize your beliefs.

originally posted by: slider1982
Opinions on both subjects are like butt holes everybody has one......

...and they're fun to explore

See, the reason people enjoy debating topics is first off, to express their own views, and try out debate tactics, but it also serves to allow outside observers the chance to hear both sides, the facts, and how things are discussed to make a informed decision
Also we are always interested in fighting..be it physical, mental, etc..it is a attraction of conflict and resolution inherent in our species.

a reply to: SaturnFX

There's a difference, though, between discussion of opinion and bickering over trivialities.

Because through intelligent debate you end up learning new things. The problem is we end up with people attacking each other and heaven forbid someone drops a loaded word on accident then all intelligent debate is out the door.

I don't engage people to 'change their mind' I engage them to broaden mine.