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Peter The Roman has been found, and it's not the Pope (video)
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St Malachy's "the Prophecy of the Popes" is a long list accurately predicting every Pope which ends with the 112th Pope called Petrus Romanus, who
is supposed to be the current Pope.
But what people missed is that there is a change in tone in Saint Malachy's prophecy when he gets to the end and talks about Peter the Roman. The change in tone represented that Petrus Romanus is someone alive at the same time who is not declared to be the Pope. The answer begins by knowing that the term "Peter" means "stone" so...
"PETER" = "stone"
"THE ROMAN" = "Roman numeral V"
The Roman numeral "V" is a big Secret Society symbol because it is believed to somehow have a direct connection to the missing capstone of the Great Pyramid of Giza in Egypt. One of the Prophecies concerning the future world religion leader, called the Cosmic Christ, is that he will be able to make that connection and explain it fully.
There is a series on youtube called "Egypt's Philosopher's Stone" made by Wayne Pyron which just so happens to be 5 Phases long! Phases 1 through 4 are written with Arabic numerals, but Phase 5 is the only one Pyron labels with the Roman numeral "V". What St Malachy saw was "Stone: V" so he named Wayne Pyron "Peter: the Roman". In Egypt's Philosopher's Stone, Pyron attempts to bring together all of the world's religions into a new 1 world religion.
Phase 1 has a still image which tells you to read the description underneath the video, it's found here...
www.youtube.com...
Thomas R Horn and Chris Putnam wrote a detailed book called "Petrus Romanus: The Final Pope Is Here" and Thomas R Horn wrote another book called "Zenith 2016". Both books warn us that planet earth didn't make it out of year 2012 untouched like we all thought. But instead there was something that began in 2012 and comes to its zenith in 2016. Well it just so happens that in Phase 1, Pyron claims that he created the Philosopher's Stone in 2012, but that he didn't finish his youtube series until March 7th 2016. That's a perfect match.
Also notice that on the cover of Zenith 2016 is the capstone of the Great Pyramid, & the book cover asks this question "Did something begin in 2012 that will reach its apex in 2016?" Here is a link to the photo www.amazon.com...
And just in case that wasn't enough, many people were suggesting that a man named "Nimrod", which is basically another name for Peter the Roman, was most likely in ancient Babylon trying to increase his "perception modes" so that he can eventually open up the "stargate" at Giza. Videos like www.youtube.com... and also videos like www.youtube.com... Well, Pyron was in ancient Babylon because he was a rifleman in Iraq, and modern Iraq is ancient Babylon. The last sentence in Phase 1 has him saying "Yo this is a lifelong journey of mine, & in it I went to Iraq as a unique rifleman to increase my modes of perception all for this very aim - to find the Philosopher's Stone."
But what people missed is that there is a change in tone in Saint Malachy's prophecy when he gets to the end and talks about Peter the Roman. The change in tone represented that Petrus Romanus is someone alive at the same time who is not declared to be the Pope. The answer begins by knowing that the term "Peter" means "stone" so...
"PETER" = "stone"
"THE ROMAN" = "Roman numeral V"
The Roman numeral "V" is a big Secret Society symbol because it is believed to somehow have a direct connection to the missing capstone of the Great Pyramid of Giza in Egypt. One of the Prophecies concerning the future world religion leader, called the Cosmic Christ, is that he will be able to make that connection and explain it fully.
There is a series on youtube called "Egypt's Philosopher's Stone" made by Wayne Pyron which just so happens to be 5 Phases long! Phases 1 through 4 are written with Arabic numerals, but Phase 5 is the only one Pyron labels with the Roman numeral "V". What St Malachy saw was "Stone: V" so he named Wayne Pyron "Peter: the Roman". In Egypt's Philosopher's Stone, Pyron attempts to bring together all of the world's religions into a new 1 world religion.
Phase 1 has a still image which tells you to read the description underneath the video, it's found here...
www.youtube.com...
Thomas R Horn and Chris Putnam wrote a detailed book called "Petrus Romanus: The Final Pope Is Here" and Thomas R Horn wrote another book called "Zenith 2016". Both books warn us that planet earth didn't make it out of year 2012 untouched like we all thought. But instead there was something that began in 2012 and comes to its zenith in 2016. Well it just so happens that in Phase 1, Pyron claims that he created the Philosopher's Stone in 2012, but that he didn't finish his youtube series until March 7th 2016. That's a perfect match.
Also notice that on the cover of Zenith 2016 is the capstone of the Great Pyramid, & the book cover asks this question "Did something begin in 2012 that will reach its apex in 2016?" Here is a link to the photo www.amazon.com...
And just in case that wasn't enough, many people were suggesting that a man named "Nimrod", which is basically another name for Peter the Roman, was most likely in ancient Babylon trying to increase his "perception modes" so that he can eventually open up the "stargate" at Giza. Videos like www.youtube.com... and also videos like www.youtube.com... Well, Pyron was in ancient Babylon because he was a rifleman in Iraq, and modern Iraq is ancient Babylon. The last sentence in Phase 1 has him saying "Yo this is a lifelong journey of mine, & in it I went to Iraq as a unique rifleman to increase my modes of perception all for this very aim - to find the Philosopher's Stone."
If this is about the current pope, someone beat you to this post a few hours ago.
originally posted by: reldra
If this is about the current pope, someone beat you to this post a few hours ago.
Read the OP before replying?
OP:
I don't feel that it would apply unless I start seeing a mass of people getting involved. So far, he's just another guy on YT trying to sell his wacky stuff.
edit on 18-3-2016 by StallionDuck because: (no reason given)
a reply to: alientransfer
I think there is a far simpler explanation:
Petrus Romanus = the Rock of Rome = Jesus Christ = Antichrist = Man of Sin / Son of Perdition = 8th Head /King = Judas Iscariot [resurrected] = Pope Francis.
Wait and watch!
For 666, you'll find that if you write out the alphabet and assign a number '6' to 'A', '12' to 'B', and so on, in increments of '6', you'll find that words 'Jesus', ''Lucifer' 'Y'shua' 'Messiah' and 'cross' all add up to 444, and the Greek spelling of 'Christos' or 'Kristos' adds up to 666 - that fatal number! In other words, the Greek Orthodox version of Christ [as determined at the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD in the Nicene Creed] is the Antichrist, who stand 'in place' of the true Messiah.
I think there is a far simpler explanation:
Petrus Romanus = the Rock of Rome = Jesus Christ = Antichrist = Man of Sin / Son of Perdition = 8th Head /King = Judas Iscariot [resurrected] = Pope Francis.
Wait and watch!
For 666, you'll find that if you write out the alphabet and assign a number '6' to 'A', '12' to 'B', and so on, in increments of '6', you'll find that words 'Jesus', ''Lucifer' 'Y'shua' 'Messiah' and 'cross' all add up to 444, and the Greek spelling of 'Christos' or 'Kristos' adds up to 666 - that fatal number! In other words, the Greek Orthodox version of Christ [as determined at the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD in the Nicene Creed] is the Antichrist, who stand 'in place' of the true Messiah.
I have to point out, even in all of the information provided by this outside source, it doesn't really fit regardless. Here is how:
Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus, quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & judex tremendus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
Translated into English:
In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church, there will sit.
(This is totally separate from what is below so it can just be a header of what's written after. Though it can still fit well when merged, to mean the same)
Peter the Roman, who will pasture his sheep in many tribulations, and when these things are finished, the city of seven hills will be destroyed, and the dreadful judge will judge his people. The End.
I see no reference anywhere to the last pope being the the antichrist or even being a bad person. I actually see plain evidence of the contrary.
"Will pasture his sheep" .... He will feed his sheep
Lets just say what was written above in common speak, today's English, if you will...
Peter from Rome, will care for his people/followers through great trouble and suffering. When these troubles and sufferings are complete, Rome will be destroyed and God will then judge everyone.
The End - Nothing else on earth there after.
Besides, this prophecy was never approved by the Magisterium. Some in the church have even argued if it was real or not. This has been debated by heads of the church.
The prophecy didn't pop into existence some 450 years AFTER the supposed writer died.
Some of the names can loosely connect to the popes in power and some can not. It's a crap shoot to try and prove any of it. For the sake of it possibly being true, it still reads as though Peter the Roman is a good guy, not a bad guy. He just happens to be the last one in a time of chaos and death and when he's done, everyone is judged and it's game over.
It never says anything about the last pope being the bad guy.
The odd thing is... There are not only many translations, but many latin written originals that aren't quite written the same way. Makes me wonder what the original script says.
ex.
In persecutione extrema S.R.E. sedebit Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus: quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & Judex tremêdus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
vs
Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus, quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & judex tremendus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
Translation:
In extreme persecution S.R.E. will sit Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations, of which the city of seven hills, the formidable Judge will judge his people. The end.
vs
Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations, of which the city of seven hills, and the judge shall judge his people, fearful for his own. The end.
Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus, quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & judex tremendus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
Translated into English:
In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church, there will sit.
(This is totally separate from what is below so it can just be a header of what's written after. Though it can still fit well when merged, to mean the same)
Peter the Roman, who will pasture his sheep in many tribulations, and when these things are finished, the city of seven hills will be destroyed, and the dreadful judge will judge his people. The End.
I see no reference anywhere to the last pope being the the antichrist or even being a bad person. I actually see plain evidence of the contrary.
"Will pasture his sheep" .... He will feed his sheep
Lets just say what was written above in common speak, today's English, if you will...
Peter from Rome, will care for his people/followers through great trouble and suffering. When these troubles and sufferings are complete, Rome will be destroyed and God will then judge everyone.
The End - Nothing else on earth there after.
Besides, this prophecy was never approved by the Magisterium. Some in the church have even argued if it was real or not. This has been debated by heads of the church.
The prophecy didn't pop into existence some 450 years AFTER the supposed writer died.
Some of the names can loosely connect to the popes in power and some can not. It's a crap shoot to try and prove any of it. For the sake of it possibly being true, it still reads as though Peter the Roman is a good guy, not a bad guy. He just happens to be the last one in a time of chaos and death and when he's done, everyone is judged and it's game over.
It never says anything about the last pope being the bad guy.
The odd thing is... There are not only many translations, but many latin written originals that aren't quite written the same way. Makes me wonder what the original script says.
ex.
In persecutione extrema S.R.E. sedebit Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus: quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & Judex tremêdus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
vs
Petrus Romanus, qui pascet oves in multis tribulationibus, quibus transactis civitas septicollis diruetur, & judex tremendus judicabit populum suum. Finis.
Translation:
In extreme persecution S.R.E. will sit Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations, of which the city of seven hills, the formidable Judge will judge his people. The end.
vs
Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations, of which the city of seven hills, and the judge shall judge his people, fearful for his own. The end.
a reply to: StallionDuck
Whoever wrote that last cryptic message of St Malachy's verses, knew and understood his Bible and that's where to look for the answers to make sense of it.
In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church, there will sit Peter the Roman, who will pasture his sheep in many tribulations, and when these things are finished, the city of seven hills will be destroyed, and the dreadful judge will judge his people.
Knowing the Bible you would read it as: In the final Inquisition committed by the Roman Catholic Church, which sits on seven hills that are also seven kings; there will sit the foundational Rock of Rome, Jesus Christ, the useless shepherd, who will lead his people to commit the Tribulation against the Elect Saints of God, over the name of the Son of God. At the end of the three and a half years, that City and its last and eighth King will be destroyed, as they are judged, and punished accordingly.
It would take a whole book - the Bible - to explain this brief verse, but for speed's sake, read these verses:
Zachariah 2:17 ' useless shepherd'
Matthew 16:18 'Peter', 'Rock'
Matthew 24:9 & 14 - 'Tribulation', 'on account of his name', 'hated and killed [persecuted], 'then the end will come'.
Revelation 17:9 to 11 - 'seven hills/kings', 'eighth', 'perdition' [destruction], 'was, is not', yet shall be [resurrected].
Daniel 7:25 - 'three and a half years', 'persecute the Saints'
Revelation 13:5 - '42 months' [three and a half years],
Daniel 12:7 ' power of the holy people [Saints] completely shattered'
Revelation 13:7 - 'shatter the power of the saints'
Etc.
Whoever wrote that last cryptic message of St Malachy's verses, knew and understood his Bible and that's where to look for the answers to make sense of it.
In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church, there will sit Peter the Roman, who will pasture his sheep in many tribulations, and when these things are finished, the city of seven hills will be destroyed, and the dreadful judge will judge his people.
Knowing the Bible you would read it as: In the final Inquisition committed by the Roman Catholic Church, which sits on seven hills that are also seven kings; there will sit the foundational Rock of Rome, Jesus Christ, the useless shepherd, who will lead his people to commit the Tribulation against the Elect Saints of God, over the name of the Son of God. At the end of the three and a half years, that City and its last and eighth King will be destroyed, as they are judged, and punished accordingly.
It would take a whole book - the Bible - to explain this brief verse, but for speed's sake, read these verses:
Zachariah 2:17 ' useless shepherd'
Matthew 16:18 'Peter', 'Rock'
Matthew 24:9 & 14 - 'Tribulation', 'on account of his name', 'hated and killed [persecuted], 'then the end will come'.
Revelation 17:9 to 11 - 'seven hills/kings', 'eighth', 'perdition' [destruction], 'was, is not', yet shall be [resurrected].
Daniel 7:25 - 'three and a half years', 'persecute the Saints'
Revelation 13:5 - '42 months' [three and a half years],
Daniel 12:7 ' power of the holy people [Saints] completely shattered'
Revelation 13:7 - 'shatter the power of the saints'
Etc.
edit on 19/3/2016 by Maigret because: Proofing
edit on 19/3/2016 by Maigret because: (no reason given)
edit on
19/3/2016 by Maigret because: Addition.
a reply to: Maigret
I respect your study on this but can't agree. There are a few "7 hills" around the world. The US could be considered one, the 7 continents and also rome. Even if rome which I can agree it very well may be, I don't believe it's something to do with an inquisition by the catholic church. I believe it has everything to do with ISIS or another similar group taking over rome and destroying everything in it's wake.
I don't have a say for or against whether or not the catholic church is the good guy or the bad guy. On one hand, I believe it had it's own birthright, the torch sort of passed to peter. On the other hand, I also believe it's possible that it could be a false organization based on false pretenses. What I do know is, I do not have the knowledge nor wisdom to know which is correct. I also believe that there is not one human being on this planet that knows this answer as well.
The bible is riddled with... riddles It's full of metaphors and things that we simply can not understand. I believe it was made confusing for a purpose. What that purpose is, I do not know. I have an idea but my ideas are only right half of the time and maybe less.
Even with all of the clues laid out in the bible, it's such a huge possibility that they can point to many different things with the same similarities. I've read through and through and have always thought that 'this' could apply to a few different things and while reading forums here and there, more possibilities arise. 7 hills that are 7 kings, 10 crowns, 7 horns... the only thing I can attach to the roman catholic church are the 7 hills. If you chose the last x amount of popes, then one would just be dividing something to make the numbers fit. For me, they symbolize other things but not just one idea.... many different unproven ideas of what's what.
The bible is plain to me, but it is also the most confusing book I have ever read many times over As much as I think I understand, I learn some new aspect of it often from others. It's almost as if it means something different to everyone who reads it. Strange, huh?
I respect your study on this but can't agree. There are a few "7 hills" around the world. The US could be considered one, the 7 continents and also rome. Even if rome which I can agree it very well may be, I don't believe it's something to do with an inquisition by the catholic church. I believe it has everything to do with ISIS or another similar group taking over rome and destroying everything in it's wake.
I don't have a say for or against whether or not the catholic church is the good guy or the bad guy. On one hand, I believe it had it's own birthright, the torch sort of passed to peter. On the other hand, I also believe it's possible that it could be a false organization based on false pretenses. What I do know is, I do not have the knowledge nor wisdom to know which is correct. I also believe that there is not one human being on this planet that knows this answer as well.
The bible is riddled with... riddles It's full of metaphors and things that we simply can not understand. I believe it was made confusing for a purpose. What that purpose is, I do not know. I have an idea but my ideas are only right half of the time and maybe less.
Even with all of the clues laid out in the bible, it's such a huge possibility that they can point to many different things with the same similarities. I've read through and through and have always thought that 'this' could apply to a few different things and while reading forums here and there, more possibilities arise. 7 hills that are 7 kings, 10 crowns, 7 horns... the only thing I can attach to the roman catholic church are the 7 hills. If you chose the last x amount of popes, then one would just be dividing something to make the numbers fit. For me, they symbolize other things but not just one idea.... many different unproven ideas of what's what.
The bible is plain to me, but it is also the most confusing book I have ever read many times over As much as I think I understand, I learn some new aspect of it often from others. It's almost as if it means something different to everyone who reads it. Strange, huh?
the present Pope is to soon become Peter or Stone/Rock
when he ushers in the unified & universal blending of Islam & Christianity = CHRISLAM
the Seat of the power will be moved from the Vatican (Rome, the western leg of the Empire) to Jerusalem, the Rock housed under the Dome-of-the-Rock will be the Seat of Power for the Former 'Francis' replaced as "Peter" (or Stone/Rock)
thus commencing the mission of the FP who will later team up with the AC
'Image' is also the Stone housed in the Kabbah
Image/Meteor/Stone/Rock/Peter there is a medley of correspondences having a core meaning & all are interchangeable
.... all of which is intentional because prophecy is meant to be mystical and so compounded that many angles are all degrees of the truth/reality
when he ushers in the unified & universal blending of Islam & Christianity = CHRISLAM
the Seat of the power will be moved from the Vatican (Rome, the western leg of the Empire) to Jerusalem, the Rock housed under the Dome-of-the-Rock will be the Seat of Power for the Former 'Francis' replaced as "Peter" (or Stone/Rock)
thus commencing the mission of the FP who will later team up with the AC
'Image' is also the Stone housed in the Kabbah
Image/Meteor/Stone/Rock/Peter there is a medley of correspondences having a core meaning & all are interchangeable
.... all of which is intentional because prophecy is meant to be mystical and so compounded that many angles are all degrees of the truth/reality
edit on th31145848031520252016 by St Udio because: (no reason given)
originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: alientransfer
I think there is a far simpler explanation:
Petrus Romanus = the Rock of Rome = Jesus Christ = Antichrist = Man of Sin / Son of Perdition = 8th Head /King = Judas Iscariot [resurrected] = Pope Francis.
What ? I thought the resurrected Nero is the Antichrist
www.the-romans.co.uk...
en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 21-3-2016 by Ove38 because: text fix
a reply to: StallionDuck
How many of those seven hills have a crowned monarch's throne? Revelation 17:9 & 10 How many monarch's rule over the monarchs of other nations? Revelation 17:18 How many have had seven kings, and then an eighth? Revelation 17:10 & 11. How many church body's are covered in scarlet? Revelation 17:3. How many kings have blasphemous titles - concerning God? How many monarchs deal in trade? Revelation 18:11+
How many of those seven hills have a crowned monarch's throne? Revelation 17:9 & 10 How many monarch's rule over the monarchs of other nations? Revelation 17:18 How many have had seven kings, and then an eighth? Revelation 17:10 & 11. How many church body's are covered in scarlet? Revelation 17:3. How many kings have blasphemous titles - concerning God? How many monarchs deal in trade? Revelation 18:11+
a reply to: Ove38
Copied and pasted from a previous reply:-
So, yes - Jesus not only was, but is the Antichrist.
In short: -
The word 'anti' means 'against and also, 'in place of'!
Jesus Christ is Christian deity, God the Son, second person of the Trinity, worshipped as God in Christian churches throughout the world, on Sunday and at Easter and Christmas.
Yeshua the Messiah, is 'kosher' Jewish High Priest, Son/Lamb/Word of God and he will lead his followers in worship of our Creator, God the Father, on the Saturday Sabbath and on all the Biblically prescribed festivals.
As you can see, they are NOT one and the same!! Jesus stands 'in place of' Yeshua the Messiah.
You will find proof of the original name of the Son of God here - www.nehemiaswall.com...
The Bible says clearly, 'there is no no other name given...' (Acts 4:12) and 'he is condemned already who does not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God'. John 3:18)
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
In no particular order...
Check for my replies on the Book of Daniel to see more on how the Religious nations are the elements of King Nebuchadnezzar's Image and the Four Beasts..
Copied and pasted from a previous reply:-
So, yes - Jesus not only was, but is the Antichrist.
In short: -
The word 'anti' means 'against and also, 'in place of'!
Jesus Christ is Christian deity, God the Son, second person of the Trinity, worshipped as God in Christian churches throughout the world, on Sunday and at Easter and Christmas.
Yeshua the Messiah, is 'kosher' Jewish High Priest, Son/Lamb/Word of God and he will lead his followers in worship of our Creator, God the Father, on the Saturday Sabbath and on all the Biblically prescribed festivals.
As you can see, they are NOT one and the same!! Jesus stands 'in place of' Yeshua the Messiah.
You will find proof of the original name of the Son of God here - www.nehemiaswall.com...
The Bible says clearly, 'there is no no other name given...' (Acts 4:12) and 'he is condemned already who does not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God'. John 3:18)
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
In no particular order...
Check for my replies on the Book of Daniel to see more on how the Religious nations are the elements of King Nebuchadnezzar's Image and the Four Beasts..
edit on 22/3/2016 by Maigret because: Additions and proofing.
Revelation 2016:
In this year, an old man in China pokes a yellow blob with a stick and the Earth gets rocketed into the Sun.
Part of an old ATS prophecy. Hey, it is as good as any of the others....and the Pope had nothing to do with it.
In this year, an old man in China pokes a yellow blob with a stick and the Earth gets rocketed into the Sun.
Part of an old ATS prophecy. Hey, it is as good as any of the others....and the Pope had nothing to do with it.
originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: StallionDuck
How many of those seven hills have a crowned monarch's throne? Revelation 17:9 & 10 How many monarch's rule over the monarchs of other nations? Revelation 17:18 How many have had seven kings, and then an eighth? Revelation 17:10 & 11. How many church body's are covered in scarlet? Revelation 17:3. How many kings have blasphemous titles - concerning God? How many monarchs deal in trade? Revelation 18:11+
Sure, it had 7 kings but what of the 10 horns and crowns? What of the many, many rulers there after? The kingdomship of rome didn't last very long. Though, for many, many, many years after, there were still rulers. Those kings no longer existed during the time of Christ nor after. Even still, if you're mixing the kings and popes together, which they are totally separate and had many rulers in between, keep in mind that the Caesars in between claimed to be gods themselves. Shouldn't they also be counted?
Today there are many monarchs. Every country, monarch, government, etc, deals in trade.
a reply to: Maigret
I'm not going to watch a video that's over an hour long to try and find a hidden name. What's this guys word over anyone elses? I've never heard of him before and I'm not keen on taking information from self proclaimed experts on a youtube video
How does one be anti-himself? Jesus is the Anti-Christ? Christ is the anti-Christ Doesn't sound right.
I'm not going to watch a video that's over an hour long to try and find a hidden name. What's this guys word over anyone elses? I've never heard of him before and I'm not keen on taking information from self proclaimed experts on a youtube video
How does one be anti-himself? Jesus is the Anti-Christ? Christ is the anti-Christ Doesn't sound right.
originally posted by: StallionDuck
originally posted by: 123143
S.R.E.
What does this mean?
I had to dig deep for this one. According to what I've found:
Sancta Romana Ecclesia (Latin: Holy Roman Church, epigraphy)
You've touched on an important point.
The lingua franca (look it up if you have to) for those in the know is not English....it's Latin.
Always has been, always will be.
The fact that so few know it fluently today is not only unsurprising, it was "planned"...
Sunt qui vident caeci qui non
I'll save you the time - "There are none so blind than those that will not see"...
This is but one tip in a very large iceberg...
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