Love and Sex are not the same thing.

I just had a group argument which has prompted me to write this, as I wasn't getting anywhere in that heated discussion.
The argument was based around half of us saying that sex and love are two separate things. The other half being strongly opposed to that, with strong reasons of their own.

As far as Im concerned Sex and Love are two separate things
Im not saying that sex cant be or isn't better when love is involved. Im also not saying that love has to be involved for sex to be good either.

For me (and a lot of people) I understand that sex is (or perhaps was) primarily for reproduction, to carry on the human race, and to survive. Sex feels good for the purpose of making us want to do it. Its a bi-product of evolution.
Sex was around a LONG time before love was.
I would assume that love came about perhaps because we evolved to a certain point emotionally, and perhaps we survived best in a family unit. Also the idea was certainly pushed once religion became a big part of human life.

There are many times in history where its shown that Marriage was often treated more like a business deal. Often love was no involved at all. Not that I agree with this for myself, but these kinds of things definitely still go on today.

I think that love and sex of course go together well. But they are not mutually exclusive. I think it would be ridiculous to suggest that every single person who has ever had sex, has always 100% loved the person they are doing it with.
I also dont think that this should take away from feeling intimate with someone, I dont think it makes love any less meaningful.

The main argument that we received from the other side was that if we treat sex in such a way, then we are saying that its ok to cheat, because sex is just a primal thing.
One of the girls tried to suggest that her morals were higher than mine, and that in fact people like me who feel this way are the reason that 'the world is going to hell"

This seems like very flawed logic. It seems like very 'black and white' thinking (which is my least favourite type of thinking :p )
Yes perhaps some people might use this kind of thinking. Sex is just Sex, and perhaps they will sleep with whoever they want all the time. But if you are in a relationship and have agreed to be Monogamous then obviously if you love the person you would respect that. Its a personal thing in your own relationship. I also dont see how talking about cheating was even relevant to the conversation, which was mainly about the origins of sex, and how love is different from sex.

To say your morals are higher than someone elses, or better, is very subjective. ( There is a lot more I could say about morals, and what they are based on but that seems like a separate topic)

I also don't believe that people seeing sex for what it is, is the sole reason there is some kind of collapse in humanity.
Id be much more likely to blame greed, corruption, money, lack of education and religion for the state of affairs. I do not think people having casual sex really contributes much to this.


And before you judge me on my opinions, or make assumptions. Im not a huge slut. I don't sleep with lots of people. Yes I enjoy sex but that doesn't mean i just do it with every tom dick and harry.
I am actually pretty conservative when it comes to my ideas on family. I do think its good to choose wisely who you have children with. I think that a family environment with two parents is also wise, though I know this doesn't always work out.
But this doesn't stop me from realising why we have sex, and why we feel love, and how the two are separate, and can go hand in hand.
If you want to only have sex with someone you love, then by all means.. do that. And if you want to have sex with lots of people then do that (Perhaps be responsible and use protection though)

originally posted by: IvyNeptune

As far as Im concerned Sex and Love are two separate things
Im not saying that sex cant be or isn't better when love is involved. Im also not saying that love has to be involved for sex to be good either.

Ask most gay people - they'll agree with you.

Sex is just an animalistic craving of the body that yearns to be satiated. It is easy to be attracted to and have sex with someone you don't love. ie a one night stand with a stranger.

Love is that feeling you get when you haven't seen someone special for a while and when you do finally see them the happiness wells up inside you. You can really love somebody but not be physically attracted to them.

Like you said, love and sex can be intertwined, but most people are lonely and confused. Therefore they confuse love with lust.

a reply to: IvyNeptune

Any body who cannot distinguish the differences between sex & love should not be involved in either to be honest.

Love is a hard thing to define. Sex is pretty much nuts and bolts.
It is a lot better when love is involved.
I've never had sex with someone that I didn't love, at least at the moment.
I love many people that I have never, or likely will ever, have sex with.
I try to not overthink Nature.

a reply to: markosity1973

I agree.

I also think people confuse lust and infatuation with love as well.

originally posted by: IvyNeptune
a reply to: markosity1973

I agree.

I also think people confuse lust and infatuation with love as well.

Ahh yes, the thrill of the conquest you can never quite achieve.

That is not love either - it is an overactive imagination painting a picture in your mind of what you think / hope that person would be like if you could be with them, not who they actually are.

Bit of a slippery slope into madness if one is not careful.

I was promiscuous once, yeh I know right. But then I met my late wife and spent 21 years together. And the conclusion that I have come to is that love and sex are obviously different, but where love is involved sex is much better when there is emotion. Lust can be fun too though.

I've long been in the frame of mind that at least where the U.S. is concerned, the majority of people now completely equate sex with love. As in, you cannot possibly love another without sex.

Being mostly asexual, I know this is as far from the truth as possible, but I see a world and society that no longer has any concept of them being mutually different from each other. People completely interchange love and sex. The OP's paragraph regarding the separation of the two leading to the world's problems sounds as twisted to me as any nonsense one would hear in a psych ward. While I do not believe humans are generally supposed to be monogamous creatures, it's incredulous to hear people say that it's immoral to consider these things as different.

I've reached the point where I honestly believe most women(under 50) no longer feel as though they are loved unless they are being banged by someone. That if you do not WANT them sexually, you cannot possibly love them. I believe they are taught to feel this way through the media and it's reinforced strongly by the boys/men they bang at early ages telling them they love them in order to bang them. And it's only getting worse.

a reply to: gottaknow

I felt like what she was saying to me was completely twisted. I later found out that she was very christian. Sometimes peoples perceptions are warped when they are very involved in religion.

a reply to: IvyNeptune

Personally speaking, I am of the opinion that for me, sex for its own sake is of little interest. Without love, it would only be masturbation, and let's face it, I have been on my own for a while...I will leave readers to follow that to its logical conclusion.

However, I am aware that the two things are separate issues.

a reply to: TrueBrit

hahahaha true.

masturbation is healthy though

a reply to: IvyNeptune

A quick amendment to your statement:

Masturbation is healthier than nothing at all.



However, without a nourished heart, all the physical and neurochemical benefits you can possibly imagine, mean bugger all, at least to me.

originally posted by: IvyNeptune
The main argument that we received from the other side was that if we treat sex in such a way, then we are saying that its ok to cheat, because sex is just a primal thing.

That is a flawed argument on your friend's part as it is a hasty generalization fallacy based on her own personal viewpoint on sex and love. You most certainly can have a sexually monogamous relationship without love where the partners have agreed that it is not an open one. Cheating would therefore be an unacceptable behavior for either of them.

One of the girls tried to suggest that her morals were higher than mine...

Stop making it sound like you were insulted.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: IvyNeptune
The main argument that we received from the other side was that if we treat sex in such a way, then we are saying that its ok to cheat, because sex is just a primal thing.

That is a flawed argument on your friend's part as it is a hasty generalization fallacy based on her own personal viewpoint on sex and love. You most certainly can have a sexually monogamous relationship without love where the partners have agreed that it is not an open one. Cheating would therefore be an unacceptable behavior for either of them.

Friend is an overstatement.

originally posted by: IvyNeptune
Friend is an overstatement.

Uptight acquaintance of the religious nutter kind.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

accurate.

originally posted by: markosity1973
Ask most gay people - they'll agree with you.

Is that part of the dreaded Gay Agenda? Bone everything in sight with extreme prejudice and devoid of emotion?

Many years ago I heard Dr. Laura define love as "a commitment to care for someone". Ever since I heard it that is my favorite definition of love.

Sal

a reply to: skunkape23

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: markosity1973
Ask most gay people - they'll agree with you.

Is that part of the dreaded Gay Agenda? Bone everything in sight with extreme prejudice and devoid of emotion?

No it's a sad side effect of coming to terms with who you are and being rejected by your peers. That is why there has been a push to 'normalise' relationships - so we can put the two back together again and be complete like everyone else.

originally posted by: markosity1973
That is why there has been a push to 'normalise' relationships - so we can put the two back together again and be complete like everyone else.

I would argue that 'normal' is whatever you and the other party involved mutually agree upon.