DoJ Wants Apple To Decrypt 12 More iPhones

The Wall Street Journal (paywalled) is reporting that the Department of Justice is seeking Apple's help in decrypting 12 other iPhones that may contain crime-related evidence. The cases are not identified, though a list of the 12 phones in question has come out, but it is not known what level of Apple assistance is required (i.e., how many of those cases are waiting on the FBI request for special firmware to be developed and to be used on "one more phone"). It appears Tim Cook's assertion that hundreds of requests are waiting on this software may not be a fabrication, and the goal is not about just one phone, but to set a precedent to unlock more phones

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I may actually be just may be what many thought "to set a precedent to unlock more phones"

Apple may be adding a Fifth Amendment argument

TBut the Fifth Amendment goes beyond the well-known right against compelled self-incrimination. The relevant part for the Apple analysis is: "nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

The idea here is that the government is conscripting Apple to build something that it doesn't want to do. That allegedly is a breach of its "substantive due process." The government is "conscripting a company's employees to become agents for the government," as one source familiar with Apple's legal strategy told Ars. The doctrine of substantive due process, according to Cornell University School of Law, holds "that the 5th and 14th Amendments require all governmental intrusions into fundamental rights and liberties be fair and reasonable and in furtherance of a legitimate governmental interest."

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DoJ Wants Apple To Decrypt 12 More iPhones

Of course they do. I hope Apple asks them to, "Wish into one hand and hold the other under their butt." Then I hope they come to the boards and tell us which one was filled up first.

Just another reason we need regime change. You can't punish everyone for the evil deeds of a few. The government hasn't been very forthcoming about how many lives they've saved pre-empting terrorism ... but I suspect their batting record is identical to the TSA's in bagging Tangos at US airports.

If Trump wins the election, I hope the first government agency he lops off is the Department of Homeland Security. ... The whole damn thing!!

a reply to: Snarl

Has he given any indication that he would dismantle the DoHS?

The Govt. really has some nerve... Apples bigger than most countries economies, but the Govt just expects them to just risk decades of security advancements and intellectual property, essentially making their company vulnerable to threats.

originally posted by: Esoterotica
a reply to: Snarl

Has he given any indication that he would dismantle the DoHS?

I don't really pay any attention to what the guy says.

The only thing he's said that I'm vaguely aware of ... is that he plans to trim the size of government.

If he clipped the DHS umbilical cord, in a year you'd forget they ever existed.

I don't believe the government has the legal authority to compel Apple to create the program to weaken the user interface so that they can decrypt the phone.

However, I believe they do have the legal authority to compel Apple to provide them enough proprietary information whereby the FBI can use its own engineers to create such a program.

-dex

a reply to: Snarl

Sadly, Trump has sided with the DoJ.

Dunno about the other candidates.

originally posted by: Snarl

I don't really pay any attention to what the guy says.

The only thing he's said that I'm vaguely aware of ... is that he plans to trim the size of government.

/quote]

Maybe it's time to start paying attention.

Trump wants to boycott Apple unless they unlock the San Bernardino shooter's iphone for the FBI.

Remember Republican politicians say they want "smaller goverment"
but we all know it's just lip service.

Apple said they would need to create the tools to do it, and they have never done it before, so can the court order Apple to do something they do not have the ability to do unless they create it?

a reply to: Xtrozero

No. They can't. How can anyone subpoena something that doesn't exist?

The government is mad because apple makes something that they can't get into, and apple makes it a point to make their products that way. Government has no right to try to get keys to the back door, and if they get them once they will use them any time they want.
I hope apple doesn't give in to this.
And really if all these alphabet agencies that are wasting billions of dollars were doing their jobs correctly they wouldn't really need apple to help them, collectively they are spying on everyone and should be able to get any information that they want anyway.

originally posted by: jhn7537
The Govt. really has some nerve... Apples bigger than most countries economies, but the Govt just expects them to just risk decades of security advancements and intellectual property, essentially making their company vulnerable to threats.

The government will use the same old Pirate Bay logic. If you build something that people use because it affords them the opportunity to break the law, they will shut it down. The precedent has already been set. Apple will be forced to comply by the courts and if they don't comply the government will shut them down and throw their entire board in jail.

a reply to: roadgravel

Wow, I am honestly shocked here!

I never saw this coming, set precedent, enlarge coverage of set precedent, abuse original precedent to outrageous proportions....

I am just shocked, this has never happened before, except every chance our government gets...

Bunch of( expletives deleted) , I hope they go ( expletives deleted ) until their colon expodes!!

Sry, lost it there for a minute.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Snarl

Sadly, Trump has sided with the DoJ.

That's why I don't pay much attention to him. The guy's practically a Democrat. Everything other than that is about asinine.

Ahh the land of the "free"..

You need more proof

The land of the "slav.. hmm i mean brave"?

Kinda pathetic don't you think?

Not trying to bash the USA, but hey... come on ? You got a horde here soon that will...

originally posted by: BIGPoJo

originally posted by: jhn7537
The Govt. really has some nerve... Apples bigger than most countries economies, but the Govt just expects them to just risk decades of security advancements and intellectual property, essentially making their company vulnerable to threats.

The government will use the same old Pirate Bay logic. If you build something that people use because it affords them the opportunity to break the law, they will shut it down. The precedent has already been set. Apple will be forced to comply by the courts and if they don't comply the government will shut them down and throw their entire board in jail.

All Apple has to do is step up their lobbying and spending in congress. Apple can afford to pay for this to go in their favor.

I heard on the news today that a lot of people are going old school and dumping their smart phones. The are going back to the old, basic phones.

I am really glad to hear this. I push the basic phones, hard, to parents that are convinced their children as young as 6 years old, have to have a phone.

Honestly, there is no reason why a child needs a smart phone. If you want your child accessible, a phone that makes a call and receives one, is all they need, Actually, that is all that most of us "need" from a phone.

It looks like the really smart people are realizing they don't need smart phones.

Maybe it is time to take our lives back. If they are having a breakdown over Apple not making code for them to access our phones. We can make it real easy. No data. Not problem.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Xtrozero

No. They can't. How can anyone subpoena something that doesn't exist?

But they can subpoena all the information they need to build it themselves.

-dex

a reply to: roadgravel

Millions want the DOJ to indict Hillary....just sayin'...

a reply to: roadgravel
The total count of requests across the country is more than 10,000 requests. Looks like Apple legal is going to very busy.