UK Referendum 23 June 2016 - Will it be an EU BREXIT or Not?

originally posted by: crazyewok
Talk of giving Turkey Visa free travel into the UK...

It just gets better! I can wait to hear the plans the EU have for July, it will be fascinating to watch if we do Leave (albeit over a 2 year period).

One of Cameron’s biggest donors WITHDRAWS support over his ‘IRRESPONSIBLE’ EU campaign


reportuk.org...

This a testament to the nature of the PM and Vote Remain dads army!

Threaten the old!! Con and scare the people. Nice guy!

originally posted by: nonspecific
As one of those who tried to discuss the remain vote with you only for it to fall into a shambles of name calling and bickering I would refute that this is an ATS classic and would say that it is one of the most one sided and bullying threads I have ever had the displeasure of participating in.

Yep, the remain argument has not been warmly received here at all, it is basically a pro-leave thread masquerading as an even debating platform.

If you add in the fact that at least half the posts in here are by you or two or three other members and that you went against terms and conditions multiple times to keep the thread alive and even staunch leave supporters grew tired of you what you have is not an ATS classic and the fact that it is self proclaimed furthers my point and also highlights the levels that you have allowed your ego to grow to.

Lol, I couldn't agree more
ATS classic FFS haha, although the OP has done a good job posting links and any updates on the leave position, news, comments and the like, so useful if all you want to read about is the leave campaign.
Not so good if you wanted a balanced picture what with remain supporters being basically shouted out, as you said.

Another thing I find very funny is the remain side constantly talking about trade deals with EU members. Thats not how it works. Nobody phones up Germany or France and asks for a deal. What is the phone number for Germany ?

What happens is an individual or a company here in UK decides they need something. They search about and find a supplier in say Germany. They phone the supplier and speak with their sales department. The two sides strike a deal.

Deals are made between individuals not countries and that wont change whether we are in EU or not

originally posted by: bigyin
Another thing I find very funny is the remain side constantly talking about trade deals with EU members. Thats not how it works. Nobody phones up Germany or France and asks for a deal. What is the phone number for Germany ?

What happens is an individual or a company here in UK decides they need something. They search about and find a supplier in say Germany. They phone the supplier and speak with their sales department. The two sides strike a deal.

Deals are made between individuals not countries and that wont change whether we are in EU or not

True but most of the supply is ongoing and supply relationships span 10-20 years or more. So I don't see much change and new orders for new products tend to be submitted to suppliers used previously! Unless they are companies trading with the UK for the first time. They know what they are getting!

Polls showing Leave picking up momentum.
Today's Sun newspaper headline is "BeLeave in Brtian".
Daily Mails is "Brexit poll boost as migration fears grow"

Only 9 days to go before the EU referendum vote. It appears we are moving towards a Brexit.

I guess much of this is down to the campaign run by Remain which has been predominantly about fear and crystal ball speculation and most recently about threatening the old. Just like this thread which has certainly little constructive argument from the Remain side with avoidance of many of the issue that voters are concerned about, eg. Sovereignty and Immigration.

Its interesting to note that this thread attracted few posters presenting arguments and sound debate on why we should remain which was and is disappointing. Many Remain favouring posters indicated which way they would vote but failed to provide sound arguments for debate, thus making it difficult to engage in sound debate. I guess that if you don't present sound enough arguments for debate that address the issues upon which voters will decide then they will ATS posters and voters will automatically favour the other camp. As have many ATS posters.

The ATS vote has been steady at 60-70% out for the last 3 months.

It is disappointing that this thread has been shrouded in some petty bitterness from a small minority of posters but I see that as their problem.

Meanwhile the thread continues to raise any issues that arise out of the campaign's and will continue to remain active post EU Referendum to follow the developments, particularly if there is a vote to Leave on the 23 June.

I was reading this on Sunday and thought it summed up the referendum so

perfectly that I raised my finger to *star* when I realised I wasn't on ATS

I'm beginning to wonder if this is because the risks of staying or leaving
may in fact be more or less equally balanced. If we vote to stay we will
probably find a way to make it work for ourselves despite all the obvious
nonsense and self serving guff that flows from Brussels.
If we choose to leave we are resourceful and rich enough to make that
work too. So maybe whatever decision we awaken to on the morning of
June 24th we'll be OK.

That is of course as far as the economic arguments go.

Sovereignty is a different matter. Our Supreme court is 'supreme' in
name only, its European counterpart can over ride its decisions any time
it wants. Equally we don't have sovereignty over the passing of laws:
unelected civil servants in Brussels ultimately call the shots.

So if the economics are navigatable whatever the referendum result,
its sovereignty that emerges as the defining issue.

Richard Madely

I read much on ATS about "people" just being "slaves"... fodder for the rich

etc. If this be true ? and people vote to stay in with all that it intials they

deserve to be slaves

Lets vote *OUT* and free ourselves from the oppressive subjugating

dictatorship of the 'United States of Europe' .... the evil sudo empire hell

bent on world domination

originally posted by: eletheia
I was reading this on Sunday and thought it summed up the referendum so

perfectly that I raised my finger to *star* when I realised I wasn't on ATS

I'm beginning to wonder if this is because the risks of staying or leaving
may in fact be more or less equally balanced. If we vote to stay we will
probably find a way to make it work for ourselves despite all the obvious
nonsense and self serving guff that flows from Brussels.
If we choose to leave we are resourceful and rich enough to make that
work too. So maybe whatever decision we awaken to on the morning of
June 24th we'll be OK.

That is of course as far as the economic arguments go.

Sovereignty is a different matter. Our Supreme court is 'supreme' in
name only, its European counterpart can over ride its decisions any time
it wants. Equally we don't have sovereignty over the passing of laws:
unelected civil servants in Brussels ultimately call the shots.

So if the economics are navigatable whatever the referendum result,
its sovereignty that emerges as the defining issue.

Richard Madely

I read much on ATS about "people" just being "slaves"... fodder for the rich

etc. If this be true ? and people vote to stay in with all that it intials they

deserve to be slaves

Lets vote *OUT* and free ourselves from the oppressive subjugating

dictatorship of the 'United States of Europe' .... the evil sudo empire hell

bent on world domination

Agree. You reap what you sow!

Even if we vote leave, the govt will ensure it takes 10 years, not 2, to exit and other deals will be signed secretly to keep power in Brussels. That is if they don't just rig the vote.

originally posted by: UKTruth
Even if we vote leave, the govt will ensure it takes 10 years, not 2, to exit and other deals will be signed secretly to keep power in Brussels. That is if they don't just rig the vote.

Don't worry Boris will be the next PM and Grove will be a key player also etc etc.

I've not posted for a few weeks on ATS as needed a break and also been busy helping with Leave campaigning.

Saw today Leave in front on Poll of Polls and Sun Newspaper is backing Brexit. What worries me are the undecided. Apparently they are more likely to stay with the status quo so Remain could still pip past the post.

I desperately want us to leave and just hope people hold their nerve.

Just got back from Devon and there were lots of Leave signs and all the way home there were huge billboards with Vote Leave. I didnt see any Remain! Lets hope the polls are out and Leave is more like 70%/30% so all the rigging in the world by Remain wont change the outcome to Brexit.

originally posted by: anxiouswens
Just got back from Devon and there were lots of Leave signs and all the way home there were huge billboards with Vote Leave. I didnt see any Remain!

Lol, I'm south Devon and I haven't seen a single remain poster, but you are absolutely correct, that leave posters are all over in peoples gardens, windows etc.
I don't actually know anyone who has indicated they will vote remain.

...I hope my corner of one of the neglected bits of Britain outside of London reflects UK opinion.

Professor David Blake, director of the Pensions Institute and professor of

Economics in the Finance faculty of Cass Business School, City University London

says ....


"Osborne's scaremongering *Treasury reports* are two of the most dishonest and

deceptive documents I have ever read and will rightly gain the *status of dodgy

dossiers*


Read the full analysis.....

www.cass.city.ac.uk...


And now he is threatening us with another austerity budget, tax increases

etc. UNBELIEVABLE