Cameron Fires Starting Gun for EU Brexit

originally posted by: Discotech
a reply to: andy06shake

It will be interesting to see just how many actually turn out to vote.

I have a feeling there won't be many as they'll be sick and tired of all the propaganda from both sides and will just not bother voting because like the poor turnouts for the last election people are finally realising they're screwed either way so no point wasting time in voting.

I'm not sure myself whether I can be bothered voting and what I would vote for, doesn't seem to be a good vote whichever you choose and I'm a fan of the being able to freely travel anywhere in the EU

There will be high turn out because its not about a Party. And I believe the majority who wish us to leave will make sure they turn out. So I say it will be a high turn out!

And I'm voting out!

The rest of you? What say you? Op?

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I will be voting and will be voting to leave , the EU has shown itself over the years to be a bloated corrupt talking shop with no regard for the opinions of its citizens and no real idea of whats happening in the real world.

The EU is a house of cards ready to fall , Brexit may signal the end of more than just Britain in Europe.

The BBC'S Norman Smith has said Boris Johnson has been "genuinely conflicted" in making his decision on which side of the argument to back but that he will announce this evening that he will be campaigning to leave the EU.

Regardless of your opinions on Boris Johnson he is a heavy hitter and this will be a big plus for the leave campaign and a major headache for Cameron.

But BBC assistant political editor Norman Smith said Mr Johnson had now made up his mind - and would announce which team he would side with this evening.
www.bbc.co.uk...

I can feel the winds of change.

a reply to: gortex
An "emergency brake" on migrants' in-work benefits for four years when there are "exceptional" levels of migration. The UK will be able to operate the brake for seven years. - 7 years is a very short time in the greater agenda.

Child benefit for the children of EU migrants living overseas will now be paid at a rate based on the cost of living in their home country - applicable immediately for new arrivals and from 2020 for the 34,000 existing claimants - Just a sweetner to get enough support to get the other bits up.

The amending of EU treaties to state explicitly that references to the requirement to seek ever-closer union "do not apply to the United Kingdom", meaning Britain "can never be forced into political integration" - can be delayed, delayed, delayed, delayed, delayed - abandoned and forgotten about.

The ability for the UK to enact "an emergency safeguard" to protect the City of London, to stop UK firms being forced to relocate into Europe and to ensure British businesses do not face "discrimination" for being outside the eurozone

- City of London hhhmmmm is that the greater london city or is that THE 2 square mile City Of London bank owned with its own govt and appointed member of paraliment ???

Don't see much in there for the British people I'm afraid. More strategy for the countering the get-out-of-europe vote to my way of thinking.

originally posted by: gortex
The BBC'S Norman Smith has said Boris Johnson has been "genuinely conflicted" in making his decision on which side of the argument to back but that he will announce this evening that he will be campaigning to leave the EU.

Regardless of your opinions on Boris Johnson he is a heavy hitter and this will be a big plus for the leave campaign and a major headache for Cameron.

But BBC assistant political editor Norman Smith said Mr Johnson had now made up his mind - and would announce which team he would side with this evening.
www.bbc.co.uk...

I can feel the winds of change.

Apart from the theatrics, I don't understand why Boris has not made his position clear.

His father was was on the Jeremy Vine show a couple of weeks ago espousing the benefits of remaining in the E.U and the good work it has done on the environment.

Whilst talking about Boris he said he was not certain what side he would fall in with, but he did state that whilst he was working for the E.U, Boris enjoyed his time in Brussels.

If he does align himself to the out campaign then I will find myself agreeing with three of the most obnoxious politicians around. Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and the worse of them all, Iain Duncan Smith.

originally posted by: Azureblue
Child benefit for the children of EU migrants living overseas will now be paid at a rate based on the cost of living in their home country - applicable immediately for new arrivals and from 2020 for the 34,000 existing claimants - Just a sweetner to get enough support to get the other bits up.

For me, paying child benefit to children who are not even living in our country is about the principal, not the money.

This new deal saves a little bit of money but the whole principal is even worse, as now will will could pay MORE in child benefit to some children than we do to our own children living in the UK.

Only the gullible and people with vested interests will think Cameron's deal is any good.

a reply to: Cobaltic1978

All I can say to you is that this EU referendum is BIGGER than any domestic political issue you may have. This is about getting back control of our country and deciding our own destiny in the world.

Even Nigel Farage and George Gallaway shared the same platform together at the third Grassroots Out event held in London on Friday. And they disagree on pretty much everything apart from on who should run our country.

a reply to: 83Liberty

I totally agree. It's surprising that you find common ground with those that you disagree with 99.9% of the time.

Time to get our country back, time to change our political system, time for a more fairer society.

The Referendum will be the starting point.

a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Apart from the theatrics, I don't understand why Boris has not made his position clear.

I thinks he's been keeping his powder dry , choosing his time.
He couldn't announce before Cameron came back with his deal otherwise he'd of been accused of making an ideological decision and not doing what's best for the country , given his leadership ambitions waiting till now and giving Cameron a poke in the eye at the same time makes more sense to me , he needs to be on the winning team.

originally posted by: Azureblue
An "emergency brake" on migrants' in-work benefits for four years when there are "exceptional" levels of migration. The UK will be able to operate the brake for seven years. - 7 years is a very short time in the greater agenda.

Child benefit for the children of EU migrants living overseas will now be paid at a rate based on the cost of living in their home country - applicable immediately for new arrivals and from 2020 for the 34,000 existing claimants - Just a sweetner to get enough support to get the other bits up.

The amending of EU treaties to state explicitly that references to the requirement to seek ever-closer union "do not apply to the United Kingdom", meaning Britain "can never be forced into political integration" - can be delayed, delayed, delayed, delayed, delayed - abandoned and forgotten about.

The ability for the UK to enact "an emergency safeguard" to protect the City of London, to stop UK firms being forced to relocate into Europe and to ensure British businesses do not face "discrimination" for being outside the eurozone

- City of London hhhmmmm is that the greater london city or is that THE 2 square mile City Of London bank owned with its own govt and appointed member of paraliment ???

Don't see much in there for the British people I'm afraid. More strategy for the countering the get-out-of-europe vote to my way of thinking.

I do hope the majority of the Brits see it as you do!!

What David Cameron brought back is not worth the paper its written on.

Martin Schultz the German President of the European Parliament has said

any deal could be undone at a later stage and that *nothing in life

is irreversible*


Something Cameron is not crowing about is that nothing has been done

about OUR LAWS, which as of now can be and are over ruled by the EU.

The fear factor is being brought in as in *a leap in the dark!!* LOL!!

Nothing in life is guaranteed.

Cameron has told the BBC that ...

Leaving the EU would give the UK an "illusion of sovereignty" but not full control
www.bbc.co.uk...

Sorry Dave but you're confused after those sleepless nights , an illusion of sovereignty is what we have now.

Can't wait till Boris Johnson is PM , at least he'll be funny.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
Time to get our country back

Makes you wonder how many of the IN voters would be happy

with their neighbour telling them what colour they could paint

their own house, what they could plant in their own gardens.

Where they could park their own car....and so on.

Making them entertain visitors thrust on them!!!!

Wouldn't be acceptable ..... would it ?

originally posted by: gortex
Cameron has told the BBC that ...

Leaving the EU would give the UK an "illusion of sovereignty" but not full control
www.bbc.co.uk...

Sorry Dave but you're confused after those sleepless nights , an illusion of sovereignty is what we have now.

Can't wait till Boris Johnson is PM , at least he'll be funny.

WHAT!!! You mean you don't think Dave's one man stand up show was funny?



I think it was HILAIROUS !!

a reply to: eletheia

Humour is subjective , I find Dave's humour a bit dry but prefer the guffaw belly laughs provided by Bo-Jo.

a reply to: gortex

Lol @ Bo-Jo!
He's a #ing clown but very clever in my opinion, I've watched him occasionally on BBC Parliament doing London Mayor question time, hilarious, and I'm not from London lol

Not many folk supporting an in vote in this thread so far, where are the usual jokers from the Netherlands and Germany who shout doom about us leaving all the time?

The one thing that really eats at my soul in all this is that I'm on the same side as Iain Duncan Smith.
Unsurprisingly it's the "quiet man" (if only) who is first out of the box for the leave campaign using fear as a reason to leave.

Staying in the EU will make the UK more vulnerable to Paris-style terrorist attacks, Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith has told the BBC.
Mr Duncan Smith, who is campaigning for an EU exit, also questioned the effectiveness of curbs to migrants' benefits on immigration to the UK.
www.bbc.co.uk...

There are many benefits to leaving I think it's STUPID to play the fear card , the better in side have already been doing that.

a reply to: grainofsand

..... where are the usual jokers from the Netherlands and Germany who shout doom about us leaving all the time?

It appears that these Brexit threads are tucked away in the 'Off-Topic' section of ATS where far fewer members visit.

As this is probably the single, most important UK political issue I've known in my lifetime I'd like to see a Forum specifically for this subject placed in the main section of ATS.....but I won't hold my breath.

a reply to: Freeborn

Crazy isn't it, the biggest political decision for the UK in most of our lifetimes and it's just a minor regional politics issue.
It could be even more important than we realise if we vote to leave, who knows what could happen to the EU after that, will Germany be happy funding Eastern Europe then?

Fair one though, ATS is effectively a US centric site so I'm not surprised. At the very least some US members will learn a bit more about the political make-up of Europe currently...if they find the thread of course lol

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Apart from the theatrics, I don't understand why Boris has not made his position clear.

I thinks he's been keeping his powder dry , choosing his time.
He couldn't announce before Cameron came back with his deal otherwise he'd of been accused of making an ideological decision and not doing what's best for the country , given his leadership ambitions waiting till now and giving Cameron a poke in the eye at the same time makes more sense to me , he needs to be on the winning team.

Oh for sure, I appreciate he couldn't state his position before the negotiations, but we got exactly what I thought we would get, absolutely nothing of substance.

Boris isn't doing himself any favours imo, especially as he has aspirations of becoming Prime Minister. Too much dithering, does not bode well.

That being said, I think Boris is a Europhile, so if he does go against Cameron, it's for political gain only. Maybe that's what he is weighing up?