Armed Robbery Victim in NYC Jail after DISARMING Attacker

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: Sremmos80
The idea that it is in your rights to run someone over with your car when you are no longer in danger from them is pretty ludicrous.

Sorry you got your shoes stolen, but going that far just to get them back is pretty crazy, also I bet the guy ruined the shoes in this process. Either got ran over with the kid or now has blood all over them.

Why not just follow, from a distance, the kid and call the cops?

So just watched the video, pretty bad IMO. The guy has a right to get his property back, but I don't think he is within his right to then ram him with his car to accomplish that.

The idea that I have to let someone attempt to discharge a firearm in my face and when it happens to jam pretend nothing happened is also ludicrous. I don't know if I would just calm down and let him walk away.

And the driver is in on attempted murder while the kid gets "a firearm charge".

How is pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger not attempted murder?

The kid should be put down and the driver should get a parking violation.

a reply to: greencmp

It's New York. If you're anything more than a victim you're a criminal.

I saw the video. I approve of the guy running him over if the rest of the story is true and he robbed him at gunpoint. # the "Victim" who lost an arm, nobody gets hurt if he didn't create a volatile situation.

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: greencmp

It's New York. If you're anything more than a victim you're a criminal.

I'm just thinking about this and I realized that, in New York, in the eyes of the law, the possession of a thing is worse than attempting to take a life.

Officially. That's got to be why that's the charge and not attempted murder. The sentencing must be worse for having the gun than trying to use it.

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: Sremmos80
The idea that it is in your rights to run someone over with your car when you are no longer in danger from them is pretty ludicrous.

Sorry you got your shoes stolen, but going that far just to get them back is pretty crazy, also I bet the guy ruined the shoes in this process. Either got ran over with the kid or now has blood all over them.

Why not just follow, from a distance, the kid and call the cops?

So just watched the video, pretty bad IMO. The guy has a right to get his property back, but I don't think he is within his right to then ram him with his car to accomplish that.

The idea that I have to let someone attempt to discharge a firearm in my face and when it happens to jam pretend nothing happened is also ludicrous. I don't know if I would just calm down and let him walk away.

And the driver is in on attempted murder while the kid gets "a firearm charge".

How is pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger not attempted murder?

The kid should be put down and the driver should get a parking violation.

It's unbelievable. I don't blame the guy in the car at all he was acting on adrenaline. What the kid did was premeditated.

a reply to: greencmp

How is pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger not attempted murder?

How do we know it happened?

Or we just going to assume since it was said that it happened.

a reply to: Metallicus

Not saying it didn't happen, but not going to just accept the word of the guy that ran someone over as fact.

He has every reason to make it seem worse than it was, or do we not care about that?
I guess you guys are more willing to take his word because he did what he did...

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: greencmp

How is pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger not attempted murder?

How do we know it happened?

Or we just going to assume since it was said that it happened.

As Slanter said, they can check the shell for a hammer strike indentation.

a reply to: greencmp

Yeah they can, and has that happened?

I can't find anything about it happening.
nypost.com...

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: greencmp

Yeah they can, and has that happened?

I can't find anything about it happening.
nypost.com...

The argument I am proposing is that knowingly allowing a known attempted murderer who is armed to escape into the public is also a possible crime, strictly speaking.

Shouldn't we be allowed to perform our civic duty if not required to or, at least, not be punished for?

a reply to: Asktheanimals

To expect victims to just blithely sit there and go "oh well, time to call the cops" after somebody points a gun at you is beyond the capacity for many.

Well give the man a hand, errr… arm.

If you don't mind the jail time, do the crime.

Heres me, dude no need for the gun you can have my shoes, wallet, coat off my back.

I'm not like him.

a reply to: greencmp

Robbery is not attempted murder, you are making the argument that the gun jammed. Which I can't find from any of the articles that are coming out of NY, only in the comment sections.

Also what crime is it that you're proposing? Last I checked vigilante justice is not encouraged.

Shouldn't we be allowed to perform our civic duty if not required to or, at least, not be punished for?

I don't see running a guy over that is walking away from you your civic duty...


Why are you willing to take this claim that the gun jammed as fact with no real source behind it?

Michael Jordan is a very unusual character in that many an urban youth have killed or been killed in pursuit of his sneakers. I am reminded of this case a couple years back.
Ohio shopper shoots teen dead outside mall for trying to steal newly bought Nike Air Jordans

I think it may be time for the people to call him out and demand he drops prices for a year in the hopes some ignorant youths will see the error in their ways.

As far as this case, noone here is on the side of the 17 year old violent criminal or calling him the victim. We are simply pointing out the law as it will be applied. In order for attempted murder charges to stick, it has to be proven he did in fact pull the gun out and pull the trigger. Since the majority of gun malfunctions are failures to feed/eject (FTF/FTE) and not duds from a faulty cartridge, that would be difficult to prove.

There is video however of the initial victim pursuing and then aggressively running over the teenager after he was no longer a direct threat. This explains why the charges are the way they are.

The driver will likely plea down to attempted manslaughter or aggravated battery with great bodily harm or some # like that.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: greencmp

Robbery is not attempted murder, you are making the argument that the gun jammed. Which I can't find from any of the articles that are coming out of NY, only in the comment sections.

Also what crime is it that you're proposing? Last I checked vigilante justice is not encouraged.

Shouldn't we be allowed to perform our civic duty if not required to or, at least, not be punished for?

I don't see running a guy over that is walking away from you your civic duty...


Why are you willing to take this claim that the gun jammed as fact with no real source behind it?

In my mind, pointing the gun is declaration of intent. Aiming and pulling the trigger isn't even necessary. Presuming that someone should wait to be shot is ludicrous.

If he had been shot but, not fatally, would he have been justified?

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Asktheanimals

To expect victims to just blithely sit there and go "oh well, time to call the cops" after somebody points a gun at you is beyond the capacity for many.

Well give the man a hand, errr… arm.

If you don't mind the jail time, do the crime.

Heres me, dude no need for the gun you can have my shoes, wallet, coat off my back.

I'm not like him.

I had a guy try and rob me years ago at knifepoint when I was walking home from the bar in South Boston. I had basically nothing on me but I wasn't giving him # out of principle. The guy backed off fairly quick after I made it clear he's going to have to take what's mine and nothing happened. I'm not saying just giving your things over is the wrong move if you're alright with it but don't tell me standing up for yourself is wrong either. The guy went to sell some shoes and supposedly got robbed with a gun, if that part of the story is true I'm happy he ran the other asshole over. One of them woke up that day intending to commit a crime, the other one acted out of instinct and adrenilane after being put in a #ty situation. I side with the second guy

a reply to: EightTF3

Is it acting out of instinct to drive away and then turn around?

It isn't flight and fight, he made a decision to get away, but then changed his mind.

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: greencmp

Yeah they can, and has that happened?

I can't find anything about it happening.
nypost.com...

The argument I am proposing is that knowingly allowing a known attempted murderer who is armed to escape into the public is also a possible crime, strictly speaking.

Shouldn't we be allowed to perform our civic duty if not required to or, at least, not be punished for?

Which possible crime are you referring to here?

a reply to: greencmp

In my mind, pointing the gun is declaration of intent.

Well that is changing what you point is a bit, but that is a fine opinion but the law doesn't agree.

I would have zero issues with him acting with a gun pointed at him, but that ISN'T what happened.
He didn't have the gun pointed at him when he ran the kid over, the kid has his back to him.
Kinda akin to shooting someone in the back if you ask me.

This guy DID NOT act out of self defense, not sure how you can argue that he did.
If he did act on the kid in the car in someway, it would be a different story.

originally posted by: Shamrock6

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: greencmp

Yeah they can, and has that happened?

I can't find anything about it happening.
nypost.com...

The argument I am proposing is that knowingly allowing a known attempted murderer who is armed to escape into the public is also a possible crime, strictly speaking.

Shouldn't we be allowed to perform our civic duty if not required to or, at least, not be punished for?

Which possible crime are you referring to here?

If you have knowledge of a crime and fail to do what you can to prevent it.

a reply to: EightTF3

I had a guy try and rob me years ago at knifepoint when I was walking home from the bar in South Boston. I had basically nothing on me but I wasn't giving him # out of principle.

Dude had a gun… would you have stared down a gun barrel as readily?

"Take it muffu---" Blam!

Facing down a knife gives you a little more edge, assailant has to close to within arms reach… staring down a gun barrel at five or ten feet… a little different.


I heard a cop say once, give it to him, your life is not in your wallet. That stuff can be replaced.