Exodus 4: 24-26 WTF???

a reply to: Rasalghul

Text Why was Yahweh trying to kill his friend Moses? He messed with him bad by not letting him see the promised land, but this earlier event is just unexplainable.

God was not trying to kill Moses. The problem that most have is that they read in verses and not thought.

Exodus 4:22-27
(22) And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:
(23) And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn.
(24) And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.
(25) Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to me.
(26) So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision.
(27) And the LORD said to Aaron, Go into the wilderness to meet Moses. And he went, and met him in the mount of God, and kissed him.

First you must understand that all covenants between man and God are Blood Covenants. Blood is the life force of the terrestrial creation.

God told Moses that Israel (Jacob) was His firstborn and Moses very well understood that he and all of the Hebrews were under the covenant of Abram (Abraham). This covenant required circumcision of all males in the house hold of all of the Hebrew tribes. They and their servants were considered under the blood covenant of Abram. God then revealed to Moses that He would slay all of the firstborn of Egypt who were not under this covenant. This was told to Moses in that Moses had not observed the covenant of Abram and that by Moses being of Egypt this would apply also to his first born son. Moses had not honored Abram's covenant and had not circumcised Gershom his first born.

It was here that God being just and true to his word would have no alternative but to kill Moses' first born also. The only recourse was to circumcise his son and honor the blood covenant. It was not Moses who was threatened but was his son who God would have to kill. Moses wanted to do as he pleased but being a Levite was in violation of the Abramic covenant. He still had the teachings of the Egyptians in him in not circumcising Gershom as a Levite was required to do. This forced Moses to adhere to the blood covenant of Abram.

a reply to: Seede

So ultimately if the law in this case the covenant is broken then punishment is due

Interesting a gnostic in a thread around here somewhere alleged that God was bloodthirsty and we were all in fear of Him

Interesting to note that scripture states that the fear of the lord leads to wisdom, also that there will be a time of judgement

God is justice and if we are sinners outside of Him we should be in fear

a reply to: Raggedyman

TextSo ultimately if the law in this case the covenant is broken then punishment is due

Actually (in this case) this occurred before the Sinai convention (ten commandments) and Moses was reared as in Egyptian culture. Here God is educating Moses as to the Hebrew covenant which Moses has neglected. So in effect, Moses is not breaking the law of Abram but instead is ignorant of the law of Abram.

God informs Moses that his son is Hebrew and belongs to Israel. Not to Moses but to Israel. God also tells Moses that Gershom belongs to God and if Moses does not let the child serve God then God will kill the child. That is why Moses' wife then circumcised Gershom in anger and condemned this circumcision ritual. At this point Moses was from Ethiopian and Egyptian culture and his wife (Zipporah) was a Midianite. Zipporah's father was Jethro or Reuel. Reuel was from the seed of Ishmael or his son Midan. So in effect Zipporah and Moses were actually distant cousins.

But nevertheless both of their cultures were not compatible with Jacob (Israel). So they both had to learn and both were reluctant to accept this God of Isaac and Jacob. Here God is actually teaching them that they are under His law and that He will not tolerate any other means. So God threatens Moses with the death of Moses' son.

You must remember that Moses has just come from being a king of Ethiopia and was royalty for forty years in that kingdom. He was a great military strategist and warrior which many people have not realized. He was not simply a stuttering fool such as some would have you believe. Here he is a man of about eighty years old and wise beyond most of what teachers teach.

a reply to: Seede

How many wives did Moses have, his wife was a Cush ite which is northern Ethiopia and Sudan.

a reply to: Seede

Ahh that goes a long way to me understanding the issue
Very well explained, appreciate the correction

There is still so much that can be missed without reading and fully understanding how the history of the bible plays out.

Trickier than War and Peace

a reply to: Raggedyman

Only if you're not that bright. I suspect you know far less about the bible than most atheists and kids in a sunday school. You don't act like a Christian, championing ignorance and intolerance like they are running for president and owe you a favor. I laughingly enjoy when you try to appear knowledgeable about things you haven't a clue, the bible especially. You are why people hate christians so much.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Seede

So ultimately if the law in this case the covenant is broken then punishment is due

Interesting a gnostic in a thread around here somewhere alleged that God was bloodthirsty and we were all in fear of Him

Interesting to note that scripture states that the fear of the lord leads to wisdom, also that there will be a time of judgement

God is justice and if we are sinners outside of Him we should be in fear

Note: If you disagree with ragsyman you are a Gnostic.

Yahweh is bloodthirsty, God is merciful.

Yahweh is scum

God is good.

Yahweh kills infants to show how powerful he is. He even hardens Pharoahs heart just so he can kill those evil babies.

If that's your god and you think that's justice, let's just say it explains why you are so ignorant and boorish yet think you know everything.

a reply to: Raggedyman
Nobody ever told you? An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

a reply to: Rasalghul

It doesn't leave the whole world blind.

It leaves one guy with one eye, and he's therefore the one eyed king in the global kingdom of the blind, on top of the social pyramid. The dollar guy, if you will.

a reply to: Rasalghul

I starred that because it was so clever
Eye for an eye, blind world.

It leaves the whole world one eye

As MrT would say

a reply to: Rasalghul

How many wives did Moses have, his wife was a Cush ite which is northern Ethiopia and Sudan.Text

I don't have the source in front of me but in my understanding Moses had only one wife named Zipporah who the daughter of Jethro. Numbers 12:1 is written that Moses married an Ethiopian woman prior to Zipporah but tradition contradicts that.

Being a young man of about twenty, Moses fell out of the grace of Pharaoh and fled to Midian. About this time the king of Cush [Kinkos] prepared for war against the Syrians and while away was betrayed by his countrymen. Not allowed to return to his city, Kinkos laid siege and during this first year of siege is when Moses happened upon the King. Kinko's siege lasted nine years and young Moses gained favor with the king for those nine years.

The great King took ill and died leaving the army without leadership. The officers of Kinko elected Moses as the King bringing him great riches of gold and silver. Immediately Moses retook the city, assembled thirty thousand men and defeated Syria and the East. He then was given Kinko's widow as a wife. The marriage was never consummated because she was a descendant of Canaan. Moses ruled a full forty years as King of Cush. As King Kinko's son matured and the people wanted the son to be King they approached Moses with this problem. Moses agreed that the son was the rightful heir and left the Cu#es with great wealth from the entire nation. From here he went to Midian where he spent ten years in prison by the decree of Jethro.

a reply to: Seede
Odd, I don't ever recall Moses being king of Cush (which is mostly Sudan now, a small part is now Ethiopia.

Where did you get this.

a reply to: Rasalghul

You will not find this in written Torah but you can find one account of this in the "Legends of The Jews" by Lewis Ginzberg. My copy is 1909 volume two. I believe you can internet a read on this but have not tried. I have a library of Ginzberg as well as ME Am' Loez "Torah Anthology." I think you can buy both works but don't know about the reading only. Ginzberg is still one of the leading Jewish traditionists in Torah study but many people will not accept outside literature. This is related to oral Torah in conjunction with written Torah. Many people will not accept any oral Torah whatsoever.

The most accepted of oral Torah is that of Me Am' Loez. Oral Torah was taught only to selected students and after Rome decimated Jerusalem in 135 CE it was feared that oral Torah would become lost to tradition if the slaughtering of Jews continued. Oral Torah was strictly memorized by Jewish scholars in selected schools but the Romans were killing Jews to the point that it was feared oral Torah would be lost.

It was late 16th to early 17th century that it was decided by Judah the Prince (HaNasi) to call all known traditions into one school and write them down. This was undertaken with some effort under Judah the Prince and compiled as tradition. Not all Jews will accept the oral Torah such as the Sadducees but it was and is still respected by most Orthodox Jews as true tradition. There are some Jews and Gentile alike that will use written Torah in conjunction with oral Torah in teaching. It is understood that one cannot understand Torah with out both. Both were given to Moses on the Mount by the Hebrew God.

There is another very large book called " The Book Of Legends" Sefer Ha Aggadah that is quite interesting and is chocked full of traditions but I found Ginzberg's "Legends of The Jews" more in story line sequence and far more interesting read. Do a Google search and God Bless.

a reply to: Seede
I like the Zohar, I read the torah portion but I have to read the rest. Cool book though.

Oral tradition always eventually gets written down like Sepher Yezira and the Talmud.

Sacredtexts the website has everything.

a reply to: Rasalghul
Zipporah's father was a Midianite priest but the Torah has Moses marrying a Cush.ite woman.

Can you clarify that for me?